Where to conert and what with? AUS ATPL to JAA ATPL

[canopy_gone]

Hi there....

Aus flight instructor 1200 hrs TT (single piston) + CMEIR (50 twin)


Wondering if anyone could advise on the best place in Europe or the US to do a conversion? (from their justified experience). Is it better to do do the flying in the US and theory in the UK?

What is the best qualifications to come over with i relation to multi time + single time (piston only)?

Is it better to come over with a full AUS ATPL (As I have almost completed the requirements)?

Roughly how long will the conversion process take?

Would like to hear from anyone who has gone through this process......or could advise

[redsnail]

ok, I hope you've done a search on the CAA's website and worked out what you have to do.
LASORS (http://www.caa.co.uk/srg/licensing/fcl/document.asp)
That'll spell out just what you need. Note the rules about training in one place and flying in another. I have also posted at length about the conversion process.
At the moment because you don't have 500 hours multi crew time then you won't get a JAR ATPL. Instructor time is fine but nothing spectacular here. There's enough instructors here competing for the next step up. To get the attention of the Brits you'd want to have some turbine time, preferably jet time. (yes, I know what you are thinking...)

There's several things you can do. Firstly, get the Australian ATPL finished. To minimise your exposure to financial drama, I would do your theory part time/distance learning through Bristol Ground School. Note, you'll have to come over here to do the exams.
Medical, do at Gatwick.
Theory, do at Bristol Ground School.
Flying, I'm afraid I can't strictly advise. You'll need to do a min of 15 hours to convert the IR. THere are some other Aussies that have done the flying here. Look at PAT at Bristol, I think Tayside has a good rep too (In Scotland).
How long will it take? It depends on how you do the theory and if there's any resits etc. Allow a potentional 6-12 months.
Budget at least $35,000. You have to consider the MCC as well plus living expenses.
If you are coming here on a UK Grandparent visa then you are restricted to living in the UK untill you have a British passport.

I am sorry to sound a bit negative about your instructing time however, it's still a tough market for non turbine people here. If you can, get some charter time in Oz. Why? You just might find that Oz is easier and cheaper. Yes, the market is slowly changing here and should get better 2004-2005.

PS the Aussie licences are valid for life, the UK/JAR licences are not and must be renewed. Therefore, get the Aus ATPL.

[dorosenco]

Canopy,

It is not as bad as redsnail puts it. The cost of the conversion is around $15k, not $35k !!! There are schools in the US where you can do JAA theory+flight for cheaper.

Check my website for conversion infos: www.passion2fly.com
Try Naples Air Center in Florida for theory.

good luck,
:ok:

[canopy_gone]

rednail,

thanks for the reply, much appreciated. Just want to point however (i'll take on board the advice regarding turbine and jet time), however:

- if i did have such expereince I proabably wouldnt be looking to convert and in AUS 95% of such time in with major or regional airlines, so its not going to happen any time soon for me, such work is difficult to find in aus and once u are there..u r not moving.

- the best I could obatin is maybe 200-300 hrs multi piston, or a C-90 endorsement at best.

- How would the brits view that? Im looking for work anywhere in Europe flying piston twins or singles initially, as long as I could progress onto bigger and better.

Looking at coming over late 2004 or early 2005, and would be doing resedential theory BRISTOL sounds good or LMU and I have a unrestriced passport (dad is english) so its not a problem.

Do operators in Europe mind if you have converted in the US as dorosenco points out it is much cheaper.

How is it going finding work over there, or are u gainfully employed?

As dorosenco points out, and as it appears, the US is alot cheaper.

Altough you dont mention difficulties obtaining the M-1 VISA. As I intend to work in Europe, its a little concerning how operators may view the fact you have trained in the US or is this just not an issue.

Any replies welcome.

[redsnail]

Perhaps I didn't make the money clear. I was quoting Australian dollars, not US dollars.

[canopy_gone]

Redsnail,

What do you think the chances are of aquiring turbine or piston multi in the UK?

What are operators looking for?

Any thoughts? (even if you payed for a type rating or something)

Any feedback greatly appreciated

[Sheep Guts]

I would have to agree with Redsnails post from my research 35 k AUD is conservative unless you have an "Uncle in Surrey". $15k usd sounds very cheap Id say that would get you Frozen ATPL without MCC. You see Canopy I dont know how many hours you got but If you complete this and look for work youll be competing with a Multitude of British colleagues with 200-300 hRS.
I have a mate here in Carribean spent about 30 k usd and he had Turbine and Jet Time with no joy.

Plus its bloody cold there anyhow

Sheep

[redsnail]

In all honesty, there's more turbine operators around to piston operators. There's very little GA as we (Oz) know it. I bought a Shorts 360 rating because I was converting an Aus ATPL to a JAR one (I had +500 hours multi crew so it was feasable). It helped me get a job in night freight after I did some time in ops as a night ops assistant.

Operators are looking for what operators look for in Oz. Good skills, can work with others etc. Single pilot time isn't held in a lot of regard here. (sad;ly)
I'd have a rummage around the pilot's job site (http://www.ppjn.com)

[canopy_gone]

redsnail and sheep guts,

cheers for the replys, great to hear them.

redsnail, what about paying for a type rating, and going into an F/O slot with a turbine operator? (does that ever happen). Will be over in 6 months to have a scout before I make the final plunge (any thoughts, as im sure u have been down that road).

sheep guts I have an Aus ATPL, and will have around 2000hrs by the time I decide to go to the UK, fine. Sadly however, it is all piston single instruction. I have very little multi (50hrs). Sounds like your mate was VERY unlucky (great time to have).

Anyways, I wouldnt mind what I was flying o/seas (instructing,s/e), as long as the oppurtunity to progress was there somehow. Would be prepared to pay for a type rating.

Thoughts? (let me guess..... maybe, save your money ans stay in Aus)

[redsnail]

After you have the subjects and the CPL/IR then you would also probably have to get the MCC. Budget around 2000 pounds for that. The cheapest type rating is the Shorts. That costs around 8000 pounds. I don't know if Emerald are running any external courses. Next bet is an ATR or 737. Budget at least 15000 pounds.
It is possible to get an FO's position after buying the rating but since the companies aren't obliged to take you on it is still a risk.
The market is picking up, esp for turboprop pilots wishing to move on. This makes room for others.