WHY do flight training in UK and not USA?

[Spike001]

Hi all

I’m just completing my PPL in the UK at Shoreham. I’ve been told by my instructor to do my training in the UK. When it consists of future courses i.e. ATPL, CPL, IR, I’ve been told to do the groundschool in the UK and the flying in the US.

I’ve looked into the costs of the courses, and the costs for an ATPL in the UK is in the region of £50,000 (or £40,000 in my current situation), I’ve recently heard that in the US, I could do it for £24,000.

I’m beginning to think whether staying in the UK to proceed with my flight training is a good idea!

Just to give you an idea, I’m paying £125/hour (inc. landing fees) at Shoreham in a PA 38, I’ve heard that I could fly in a Cessna around the region of £30/hr in Florida.

I’m starting to feel as if I’m being ripped off, and I’m wondering whether it’s worth my time and effort saving up for the “UK” ATPL, CPL, IR etc. when I could do my training for half the price in the US! Overall I’d save in the region of £26,000.


By training in the US, does it effect’s ones chances of getting a job at the end of the day in today’s climate, to someone who’s trained in the UK?

Do airlines tend to think of pilots who’ve trained in the UK, are more knowledgeable and are on a higher plain?

Does it matter where one’s trained, whether it’s in the US or UK, because as I understand it, airlines are now more concerned about what experience you have, as to where you trained?


I’d appreciate the info.

Cheers

[englishal]

There are places in the US which will take you from Zero to ATP/ATPL, 1500Hrs including 600 twin, 500 of them turbine, for 42000 GBP. These prices include FAA to JAA conversions, accomodation, ATPL ground exams etc etc....

I know where I'd put my money.

EA:D

[onehunga]

Spike,

Set yourself an hour (maybe more) and do a search on these threads for training and the US and CPL and IR and ATPL, JAA conversions etc. Hopefully after that you will realise that there is no simple answer and it will all depend on YOU and your personal circumstances. Good luck.

[FlyingForFun]

Agree with onehunga.

There are lots of people who have family or work ties in the UK and can't go to the US for extended periods. There are other people who just don't want to. That's why there are so many options - because there are so many of us, and we're all different.

Assuming none of that applies to you, and you're free to go to the US, have you factored in the cost of flights to and from the US? Accommodation when you're out there? Car hire? Bear in mind that you will need to come back to the UK to do you IR test, as there are no examiners out there.

Where do you imagine your first job will be? I'd guess it won't be flying to, or in, the US. Far more likely to be instructing in the UK, or flying short-haul flights to/from regional airports in the UK and possibly Europe. There are differences in the way the airspace is constructed and used, and some small differences in the use of the r/t - nothing major, but possibly enough that, given the theoretical case of two identical job candidates, but one of them trained in the UK and one in the US, it might make a difference.

Even if it doesn't make a significant difference to your job prospects, you have to assume that you won't find a job immediately, and that you'll need to do some flying between finishing your course and finding a job, just to stay current. In which case, any instructor at any school you're going to hire from will most likely want to spend some time bringing you up to speed with the UK system.

Nothing against doing it all in the US, so long as you go in with your eyes open. Know exactly how much it's going to cost you (not just the flying, but everything), and budget for any extra time you'll have to spend getting to know the local procedures afterwards.

Personally, I would suggest a compromise. Do your PPL in the UK. Do some hour-building abroad (maybe South Africa or Canada - not the US, though), then come back to the UK and do some more hour-building here and in Europe. Do the CPL in the US (this is why I said not to do the hour-building in the US - if you're going to go to the US for the CPL you may as well get as much variety as possible and go somewhere else to hour-build!) Then do the IR in the UK. But, as onehunga says, that's my personal preference so it doesn't necessarilly apply to you.

Good luck!

FFF
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[pa28biggles]

I agree with the 'its dependant upon your circumstances.'

I was in your position myself a few months back, and decided to stay in the UK. This was mainly due to commitments here - Im currently at uni, and instead of getting drunk every night I build hours in a C-152. When I finish uni, the plan is to have enough money saved to do ATPL exams, and have enough hours built.

If you have the ability to get time off, consider the US. I found that the cost of flying in the US was not as cheap as it first seemed, there were hidden costs. I agree with FlyingforFun, find out ALL of the costs. It should work out cheaper, its just a case of how much cheaper.

Have a good look around your area. I pay £75 per hour, £6 insurance waver per flight, and £4 per landing at my base airport. Not bad really. I used to fly a PA28, that cost £110 per hour + insurance + landing fee. What a cost difference the C-152 makes.

Maybe speak to people that own aircraft, there was a person that was willing to rent his old battered C-150 out for £50 per hour + £15 landing fee (ish). Only problem was that you had to buy time in blocks of hours.

Hope this helps and all the best!

[Spike001]

Thanks for the info guys.

In my current situation, I'm self employed, decided not to go to uni due to the debts, as flying costs enough as it is!
With this said, I'm free to head off abroad to continue with my training.
I'll start some research regarding the prices, conversions, accomodation costs etc in the US.

[Send Clowns]

You are also slightly over estimating the cost in the UK. I reckon it can be as little as £42,000 including VAT, all fees and MCC, all flying in the UK. Some may be saved by hour building in the US, but there are cheap ways to hour build here (buy a share, block book, book a structured hour-building course). Also in the US you have to be very strict with yourself, as it is a temptation to fall into the easy, relaxed flying patterns typical of US private flying. People come to the CPL, and take extra hours to be brought up to speed.

When I was looking at courses (late 1999 for a 2000 start) there was no approved modular training in the US, so I only looked at integrated at WMU. They quoted me US$80,000, very much comparable to quotes from UK companies. This suggests to me that the final savings are not that great from training in the US.

However you do it, best of luck!

[MorningGlory]

I think starting with a ppl in the uk is a very good idea. It'll give you the essential and intial basic introduction into uk regs and airspace that'll become your grounding.

Airlines couldnt give a monkeys where you did all your initial basic training up to the end of atpl's, ie: ppl, imc. night, multi, hour building and written exams for atpl, so doing it somewhere like the US or SA would make financial sense. Airlines will be more interested in first time passes for flight tests and high average grades in the exams. They would also like not to see too many training organisations on your cv, so for your CPL, IR and MCC go to just one school for this ie: stapleford, oats, ccat etc.

More importantly than that before you do anything, go see the nice chaps at GAPAN and do some aptitude testing, or at least go and see an independent training consultant. A lot of people dont do this and end up with a large bill at the end of training and no job, so do it and you wont go into the training blind.