Av8 Already In Trouble !!!!!

[flymeagain]

Well it would seem that the new start up at Manchester AV8 is already in trouble, (a lot of trouble!!).
basically, they can't get the experianced crew. No one really wants to leave a stable job with another airline to go for a new start up long haul airline in this volotile time, and who can blame them. the thing is the flights are already busy but it's getting closer to the start date. evan though they have just announced new destinations to Dubai and durban, it sounds like there already trying to make themselves sound succesful!!! also I've heard that the b-767 there using is gona have to do a refuelling stop in Las Palmas!! if that's true when there selling it as a non-stop service from Man to Cpt, there not gona be popular!!! also on that route, evan with a heavy crew they would have to watch the hours as they could not afford any delays!!!!

[ladies and gentlemen]

Just a quick question. I know AV8 are getting their B767 from Icelandair, does any-one know if their B757 is also coming from the same operator? Also what is their flight prefix? thanks. Have they not already got full crew quota? Somebody who works at my airline called them last friday and was told they had finalised the cabin crew recruitment. I beleive that on the current training course it is majority MYT crew who have jumped ship.

[LU17]

the 757 is also coming from iceland and is being operated by their flight deck & CS up until March i think.

the final interviews were done last week for the training course to start in jan, I think they are having 4 new courses, 2 already started

I also heard they are having a refueling stop at LPA, but then i've also seen their Cape Town Brochure which advertises non-stop flight. I think, if i remember correctly flights will be on a wednesday & saturday! correct me if i'm wrong.

Heard alot of MYT crew have jobs with AV8, so how do you think this will affect MYT redundancies? I think MYT are gonna end up with less crew than they need!!

[Thunderbird One]

All the crew that have gone to AV8 from MYT are the seasonal crew who have been told they have been layed off. Good timing and Good luck to them.

Suprised anyone wants to go to AV8 though with the attitude of their Cabin Crew manager.

[WEBLUEIT]

Why what's the problem with her? I hear she was A2k base lady at MAN

Apparently the cc training is being done by A2K. At least it will be professionally carried out.

[Localiser Green]

Why are they using LPA as a tech stop, it's miles off the great circle route MAN-CPT!

MAN-LPA-CPT is 5,806nm, compared with 5,336nm MAN-CPT.

Wouldn't something like MAN-MIR-CPT work better at 5,381nm, saving 850nm (circa 2 hours flight time) per round-trip?

Isn't fuel in the Canary Islands pretty expensive too (hence UK charters tankering fuel out there)?

[Ringwayman]

I believe one of the CPT services willl be routing MAN-DUB-LPA-CPT.

[tailscrape]

Or maybe:

MAN-LTN-OPO-LPA-BJL-CPT, or any other number of ideas.....

Surely punters do not want a magic mystery tour of UK and Ireland airfields before arriving (many hours later)?

[dada]

pardon my iggnortce but was does av8 stand for?

[chiglet]

dada,
Try saying it out loud:ok:
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy

[Thunderball]

...presumably AV8 is a phonetic for "Aviate"?

[Fokker-off]

If they are stopping for fuel and selling as a direct flight then I think their pax will be...IR8 !!!!

[NorthSouth]

On the subject of what being a pax on AV8 is like, take a look at:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=113543
And on the question of fuel stops, they're at Palma, not Las Palmas. We stopped there in both directions - on the way out via Dublin I understand all of them stop at Palma because the Dublin runway's not long enough for a 767 max weight t/o. On the way back we were told it was due to headwinds. Temp on t/o from Cape Town was 35 so we may have been weight-limited but the runway there's 3200m and at sea level so this must happen a lot.
Were we IR8? Yes we were!

[Wing Commander Fowler]

FlyMeAgain

I don't like the title of this thread since this type of "slant" is the last thing a new company needs - do you have a particular grudge against them? You obviously have no experience of starting a company since "making it sound successful" is critical to any company let alone one in it's early stages. So, who can blame them for taking an appropriate stance in marketing and setting the image?

NorthSouth

I've read your post including the link and am sorry you were disatisfied with your experience but you do well to remember that they are a new airline as Pontius pointed out.

Dada

your iggnortce (as ever) is duly pardoned.....

Good luck to AV8 and in particular MOD - a man who I have considerable respect for!

[NorthSouth]

Wing Cdr Fowler:you do well to remember that they are a new airline
Only partly. The aircraft and flight crew, and at least one of the senior cabin crew, are all Icelandair. So they have a lot of experience on hand to make use of. Not much evidence that they do that though, at least not on the ground handling/cabin service end of things. On the other hand it's a long time since I've flown on an Icelandair schedule - maybe they're not very good either.

[Nato 35]

flymeagain,
what is your problem. I know that this is a rumour network, but I did not realise you could just slag off anyone for the hell of it. By lack of experience did you mean FD or CC. A mate of mine left a charter to join them as a FO with only 7000+ hours.
L & G,
Their 757 is UK reg with UK crews and their 767 is Icelandic registered and crewed till the end of Jan. It then goes on the UK reg and will be crewed by them.:cool:

[Wing Commander Fowler]

NorthSouth

Ah.... if the aircraft and crews are Icelandair then your criticism is presumably aimed at them as an operation. AV8 can only have so much control over what goes on from that perspective I'm afraid. I know little at all of Icelandair's ops......

So perhaps instead of making statements like

On the subject of what being a pax on AV8 is like

It might be better to name Icelandic as the main source of your disatisfaction??

[Fokker-off]

I think the buck must stop with how the South Africa flights are sold to the public.

If they are being sold as direct flights where there clearly is a tech stop involved then obviously pax will be annoyed.

It is down to Icelandair & AV8 to make sure seats are sold with pax knowing of tech stop...this will stop most complaints

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

From my days as working for a tour operator I always read it that if a flight was DIRECT it did not involve a plane change en route but could put down for fuel or to pick extra pax
If the flight was listed as NON STOP it was point to point with out a tech stop

Golf India Bravo

[SWADLER747]

Imagine how the Newcastle-Cape Town passengers must feel, having a supposed "direct" service, yet the 767-300 service, goes something like this;

NCL-MAN-LPA-CPT !!! - Some direct service - but hey !!

I am travelling from NCL-TFS on AV8 in July....Im looking forward to it !

[NorthSouth]

WingCo:if the aircraft and crews are Icelandair then your criticism is presumably aimed at them as an operation. AV8 can only have so much control over what goes on from that perspective Well, no, because if you read my post my criticisms are about ground handling and cabin service, not about flight ops. And the marketing is not Icelandair's responsibility either.

[Wing Commander Fowler]

Hmmm.....

And on the question of fuel stops, they're at Palma, not Las Palmas. We stopped there in both directions - on the way out via Dublin I understand all of them stop at Palma because the Dublin runway's not long enough for a 767 max weight t/o.

sounds pretty flight opsy to me - and after all this is the subject of this thread I seem to remember - WRT the rest of your complaints:

Only partly. The aircraft and flight crew, and at least one of the senior cabin crew, are all Icelandair. So they have a lot of experience on hand to make use of.

EXACTLY........ Your criticisms her are relevant to Icelandair ops not AV8!

I re-iterate my previous comment "they ARE a new airline!"

[Fokker-off]

Wing Commander

I think it's irrelevant if they are a new airline or not

Fact is pax arent being told of ACTUAL route when booking

[Data Dad]

The following is taken from the "General Information" provided by CT2-South Africa (the tour operator selling these holidays/flights) and I am sure the printed brochure says the same thing.

"Our flights to and from South Africa are operated as ManAir, by Icelandair utilising Boeing 767. Internal flights within South Africa are operated by Sun Air and other South African based carriers utilising DC9 and other jet or turbo prop aircraft. We plan our holiday flights many months in advance and the flight timings in this Website are provided for guidance and may be subject to change. Details of your confirmed flight timing - using the 24-hour clock system - will be provided in your travel documents. If we have to change your flight, airline or aircraft type, it does not count as a major change to your holiday. Some flights may stop en route for technical reasons (such as refuelling). As the factors affecting such stops may change without notice, it may not always be possible to notify you in advance. "



DD

[Wing Commander Fowler]

No it's not irrelevant at all - there are several issues being raised here many of which are not that uncommon when starting a new company. I haven't mentioned this before but the fact that an aircraft makes a stop for refuelling (or a tech stop) wouldn't put many passengers off since the critical thing for them is whether they are inconvenienced by having to leave the aircraft or change aircraft. If Departure and arrival times include time required for a stop I think generally most pax wouldn't see a problem with a stop at all......

Still my major issue with this thread is the title in any event!!