Professionalism At Virgin

[Don Esson]

The Stuntman (Clever Dickie??) has done it again. Yesterday saw the launch of a new range of under-garments bearing the VB brand. What amazed me was the fact that Pilots, Cabin Crew and Ground Staff were all photgraphed wearing the new jocks etc. I don't have a problem with thatinn itself but where does one draw the line to ensure that professionals are not trivialised when on duty? Would it now be acceptable for a 'guest' to present him or herself for travel on Virgin dressed in not much more than basic underwear that leaves nothing to the imagination? What are the Occ Health and safetty aspects of Ground Engineers working in jocks and safety vest? Aren't Cabin Crew employed for safety rather than entertainment?

If Virgin wants to be taken as a serious and professional player, then itscorportae and staff behaviour is going to have to reflect the characteristics of professionalism. Yesterday's stunt failed miserably to do that.

:O :O

[Anflygirl]

have to say

" DITTO "

[Australia2]

Ditto again, if a GA employer had ever suggested this, it would have been laughed at !

[ShesGreatintheGalley]

their marketing strategy is great.. but stupid for an airline. Virgin as a company could (and did) get away with this with stuff like virgin vie and virgin pepsi etc, virgin mobile etc. Sex sells well and it is ok for certain companies to sell their product this way.

personally i think an airline is a little different. people would rather hear about safety and service than sexy slogans (or knickers)

next they will be selling inflight virgin merchandise... not only will you be able to purchase t-shirts and caps from the cart but also virgin condoms, vibrating virgin planes or FA dress up outfits for those 'raunchy nights with a hostie'

ridiculous!

[halas]

Have to agree with all the above posters.

What is sad to say though is that a lot of "Blanket & Pillow" set probably think it's a great idea.

l remember them from the Rocky and Mackay trips when AN used to undercut QR on an odd particular afternoon service, usually a full moon.

They would turn up with their belongings in a dilly bag and head south with the banjo plucking.

Now to get some undie's or some regonald's from those grouse hostie sheilla types has to be the ducks gut's, eh? Particularly if they have a virgin on 'em (he, he, he).

Should have seen it coming is all l can say.

halas

PS Before anyone goes off the hook and says AN provided a better service than QR, l would have say that l probably agree, but l never tried it, and we also carried a lot of QR personnel around, who were in no fit state to work on arrival, but qualified AN to be a far better service, hic.

[Sperm Bank]

And there in lies the anal retentive attitude so entrenched in a minority of Australians. You guys really do astound me at your total lack of understanding and acceptance of anything modern, diverse and need to explore new mediums. Lets just stay stuck with heads up anals cavities in our little time warp down here in Oz and let the rest of the world roll on by.

What amazes me is that whenever Virgin promote something new using their own distinctive methods, it attracts criticism from people who are entrenched in a by-gone era. WELCOME TO THE 21ST CENTUARY

Thank god some people have the enterprise and progressive attitude to think of new ideas and methodolgies to market there product.

DON, it has NOTHING to do with professionalsim among the rank and file. How could it? It was and ADVERTISING expose' and nothing else. They were launching a new product. To suggest passengers turning up in basic underwear is simply farcical mate. The cabin crew, engineers and pilots were assisting with a marketing stunt. Have you ever seen them dressed like that before? NO. It was a one off so get over it and please find something else to complain about. I guess by your assumption we can assume you think if one wears a tie to a simulator training session, they are somehow more professional than a person who does not. What garbage!

The regressive (minority) Australian attitude to change needs to be discharged to the anals of obsoletion for good. We don't need any more out of date thinkers in this country. Wake up and smell the new centuary.

[AN LAME]

So Sperm Bank...what size were yours? ;)

[The Enema Bandit]

I had a couple of friends not in the industry who queried the profesionalism of Virgin and said that it swung them towards Qantas. They wondered how safe they would be. And they aren't wowsers either.

[Whiskery]

..................and the profits just keep on rolling in!;)

[TheNightOwl]

Right on the money, Sperm Bank, my initial reaction was surprise at the tight-arsed attitude of the posters, followed by the realisation that any chance to attack and demean VB is to be grabbed and shaken for all it's worth by some posters on here.

There will always be someone eager to denigrate that which they can't/won't understand, pity them rather than attack them, mate!


Kind regards,

TheNightOwl. :ok:

[robair]

I think from reading this post that some poeple in aviation need to get a life and a sense of of humour.

What are you lot ? A bunch of baptists or what?

[Poto]

Don't suppose anyone has a link to some Photos:ok: :E

[halas]

Hey Spermy....

Think l may get me some of these if they make me as sensative as you and all the other Virgin underpants supporters :p

l really don't see what this has to do with VB proffessionalism, l have to agree.

But the intelligence of the average punter that Virgin market their gifts, trinkets and wares at must be brought into question.

They probably spell the word for 100 with an A as well.

halas

[tobzalp]

Hey Spermy....

Think l may get me some of these if they make me as sensative as you and all the other Virgin underpants supporters

l really don't see what this has to do with VB proffessionalism, l have to agree.

But the intelligence of the average punter that Virgin market their gifts, trinkets and wares at must be brought into question.

They probably spell the word for 100 with an A as well.

halas




Oh my.:ooh:

[divingduck]

Hey Halas....

Professional is one 'F' and 2 'S's'...can't be one if you can't spell it.

Maa salaama

[halas]

Aw Buggger moi

At least l don't hi lite it with bold tipe

halas

[GalleyHag]

Grivation - I have no comment on this issue, but there were photos in the Sydney Telegraph of two pilots, a cabin crew member and three ground crew, the photos were of actual DJ staff. There was also a show at the Gate using professional models as you stated.

[Capt Basil Brush]

The ground guys in their boxers and Hi Vis Jackets were not loading any bags - because there were'nt any to load. It was a flight to nowhere.

So no O H & S problems there - just clever marketing.

[VB_Capt]

I must say that at times our organization looks less thamn professional because of soime of the stunts of tricky dicky. He's a wacky type and some like it but some hate it. Id prefer that he took the aviation thiung a b it more seriously .Obviously personal opinions differ greatly.

[onya]

Sooooooooooooooooo,
Is there a link to said photos.........anybody? I honestly think in the interests of furthering the discussion we need to get a visual on the subject matter.
Onya.........you little champions

[Pinky the pilot]

What I suspect it all boils down to is publicity; ie keeping VB in the publics eye using the old maxim that any publicity is good as long as it reminds the punters that VB is here and we're all one jolly good mob of happy workers etc etc.
Meantime Sir Dickie sings 'My God how the money roll in' whilst laughing all the way to the bank that one day he may even buy!

You only live twice. Once when
you're born. Once when
you've looked death in the face.

[gadjo]

Shouldn't the jocks be worn over the pants like another flier who doesn't need a 737 to get airborne?:)

[whipping boy]

Get real you guys at QF, I thought Totaii Kefu was a pilot after seeing the commercial of him kicking the tyres of the 737-800(ARU sponsors),I remember thinking AN flight attendants always bowled peanuts to each other(ACB sponsors). Can't you people divorce fiction from reality.
That said,I wish we could work in a pair boardies and thongs.

[proplever]

Matter of fact, the TV coverage of the event showed cockpit footage whilst airborne of the two pilots wearing uniform shirt and Virgin boxer shorts, whilst sitting at the controls.

At least I hope they were pilots, because if they were models then the airline was in breach of certain regulations with regards to who can sit at a flight station whilst in flight.

And if they were in fact pilots, then whilst no regulations were broken, sorry but this distraction was unprofessional at the very least.

[hoss]

What are Virgin Blue's requirements for acceptance into the Cockpit while in flight.(assuming proplever is correct and the aircraft was in-flight)

I know another large airline in Australia(;) ) would not allow a camera crew to do this.

[Chris Higgins]

This is the last place I would expect to see a bunch of Australians being so upset about some people having fun at work.

I left Australia in 1990 to marry my American wife. I have been flying here ever since and be ******ed if I thought I'd ever see the day where people in Australia gave a thought to what people are wearing at work, let alone get this upset.

What happened, did the country run out of friggin' beer with the last drought?

[Sperm Bank]

Chris, the politically correct minority are getting more air time and they think the rest of us care for their opinion!

Just read proplevers comments. "If in fact they were pilot's" well who else would they be?, "whilst no regulations were broken", of course they were not!, "this distraction was unprofessional at the very least", I repeat my comment this is anal retentive Oz at it's best.

The fact this even made the forum is testimony to some very sad people. I guess as long as they are complaining about Virgin they are leaving someone else alone. I suggest some of the contributors having operated only in Australia all their limited lives, would know very little as to what constitutes professionalism.

Alas we humour them with our patience and lack of vitriol.

[EPIRB]

Spermy, everyone has different values and always will.

[Chris Higgins]

Then stay in church and attend choir practise, don't go to the airport!

Flying was always supposed to be an occupation the rest of us can enjoy...

From the sounds of it, Australian aviation has had larger problems than this that need to be fixed. Didn't Horizon just go under, before that it was Ansett, Compass II, Compass I.

I had a friend who is now at Qantas that once told me, "If they can't take a joke, tell them all to stay home".

It has always been part of the Aussie culture to not take yourself too seriously, only your job! That's what sets us apart from the rest of the world.

Come on, Aussie grab another beer, blow it off and just be friends!

[RYAN TCAD]

Okay - so if you want to see those commercials that show on TV, then here are the old and the new.

And yes - on Virgins website. Just takes a little searching! But here is the direct LINK!

http://www.virginblue.com.au/about/ads.html

Bo!

[proplever]

Sperm breath. Duuuhhh?

Pilots - they might be models, as were used elsewhere that day. Read the fricking posts.

Regulations broken? If those were in fact models at the controls in flight as it showed on commercial TV, then yes regulations were broken. Read your CAO/CAR.

In your underwear at the controls on national TV? If you reckon thats professional, then sh1t mate, I can guarantee no-one with a half of a brain would want to fly with you. Which is why only ferals seem to fly VB.

Jeeez, you can't even seem to understand basic english, yet you have the nerve to somehow criticize my post?

I couldn't care less what they do anytime ever, unless it affects me. Would I allow such behaviour on my flight deck? No - it simply isn't appropriate in a Boeing - thats why it isn't in Boeing's manuals.

Am I trying to be politically correct by saying this? Not particularly, its not about politics. Its about professionalism. Something that you and RB cannot seem to see.

Professionalism does not = media stunts.

[oldhasbeen]

They were crew and I think you'll find it was filmed at the gate.
Now own up ... who hid props valium??

[23 Metros In a Row]

ferals maybe.....so there must be over three million ferals now.

And ferals have money.

Bit like the ferals that fly with Qantas.

Generally not a good idea to guarantee that no one with half a brain will not fly with VB.....they do, sometimes they even have real people on board.

I suppose RB looks a little feral with the flowing locks and beard, but hey without his feral instincts, we would all be wearing QF Y fronts............

Dead set mate, you are a Wally. Breach of regs...is that the best you can do.

Measure the marketing effort and you may understand that your comments and snide remarks only add to the power of their push.

Proplever you had better go now, I think I hear your FOI calling, she has dinner, jamies and hot milo ready for you....

[What-ho Squiffy!]

20th Century airline crew conversation - rival companies:

"So, Bill, how is the farm going?"
"Not bad Kev - got a hundred and fifty head of Santa Gertrudis grazing at the moment."
"Really? That's excellent. By the way, I heard your mob had a bit of strife with accommodation in LAX?"
"Yeah mate, but it's all sorted now. We agreed to settle on a five star hotel, instead of five and a half star..."
"Good call. Listen mate, great to catch up - might see you next month for a beer..."
"Seeya."

21st Century airline crew conversation - rival companies:

"Was that you guys with your landing light shining up final?"
"F@ck off."
"Unprofessional posers..."
"My airlines better than yours..."
"No - MY airline's better than YOURS!"
"No - My airline's better than YOURS! Nyah nyah nya nya nyah nyah...."

[JetRacer]

hahaha

Very good What-ho Squiffy !! A good laugh I had! :D

It is sad to think that this is becoming the norm ..... the grass is not always greener on the other side, so be happy with what you have and happy for others that are content with their lot in life, even if it is 'below' your own expectations/standards.

Better things to do in life than to try to get the upper hand.... :rolleyes:

My 2c worth! :ok:

[AA717driver]

I'll bet the Virgin guys are getting laid a lot more than the QF's...;)

Professionalism is not running your airplane into the ground or getting violated. Everything else is technique.TC

[The Baron]

I can't speak for what happened on the flight but was loitering in the general vicinity of the gate when they deplaned. From memory there were 3 professional models and some male and female FAs strutting around. All quite harmless really. Passengers waiting for flights were either amused or bemused, with a few of the elderly ones going up and getting the free undies that they were giving away. As for the product, a bit tacky but bound to appeal to some of the guests.
Those of you pontificating about this must live sad repressed lives, back to your fundamentalist religious houses of worship with you.... off you go now!

[Keg]

Funny Baron but this has NOTHING to do with religion. I'm a Christian and I don't have any dramas with fashion shows like this. I haven't bought into the 'professionalism' argument because it doesn't serve any real purpose but I WILL buy in to those who are narrow minded enough to call people of religion 'narrow minded'.

It's obviously been a while since you've been in a Christian church if you think that Christian's are 'repressed'. :rolleyes: :*

[HotDog]

Well said SpermBank, I couldn't agree with you more. Pity you had to stuff it up though with your last paragraph.

The regressive (minority) Australian attitude to change needs to be discharged to the anals of obsoletion for good. We don't need any more out of date thinkers in this country. Wake up and smell the new centuary.

[Gnadenburg]

What about the inaugural VB flight wasn't it? To Maroocyhdore, a pleasant saunter up the coast but on departure Traffic Staff flashed her boobs at the Chief Pilot.

With all those dignitaries on board, the old Chief Pilot was either still mesmerised by staring into the headlights of the Traffic girl or going for the number three wire on the aircraft carrier USS Maroochydore. Bang!!!

Been guilty of having many a good time on the Flight Deck myself. Out of public view and I always felt a CRM Red Flag and heightened Situational Awareness accordingly-especially with Elle or the team from Girlpower in the jumpseat.

[HotDog]

Fortress of Grace, are you ex TAA? I think you gave me your jump seat once from MEL to SYD? We landed on 07 and you gave your F/o (PF) a right bollocking after touchdown.

[Gnadenburg]

Hot Dog

Your German not bad but look at a Silesian dialect.

You wouldn't be much of a distraction in the jump seat I imagine.

If only I was a TAA Captain. I could have retired by now! Post 1970 birthdate I'm afraid.

[Sperm Bank]

Proplever, you post vitriloc diatribe like that and then profess to call yourself a PROFESSIONAL.

I don't need to say any more on the matter. You just proved my point.

[HotDog]

Gnadenburg, thanks for the clue. So maybe your ancestry is not from Tarnowsky Gory in Poland but more than likely from Gnadenburg South Australia. Hill of Grace, undoubtedly one of the best Shiraz produced in Australia. Probably not a member of the Henschke family either as you would have retired by now in spite of not being an ex TAA captain.;) Cheers, HD.

[amos2]

Well, if we are talking Hill of Grace we are certainly in distinguished company here!

But a pilot?...Nah!!

Not a chance! :p

[Kaptin M]

4 pages of prattle about nothing!
Which only goes to PROVE what a very clever marketing stunt this was, to have attracted the attention it has.

Suckers!! :sad:

[proplever]

Well, looks like you read it too, Kap!

Spermy, hang on a sec. Yours wasn't vitriolic diatribe? I merely expressed an opinion early in this thread. You decided to denigrate my opinion, which I am entitled to have by the way.

So, I replied in turn. I think my friend that you are a hypocrit who simply cannot spell, let alone stand the fact that someone else may have an opinion which does not align with your own.

Go back to your meage pay packet.

Show's over.

[Kaptin M]

You're right, Props ( I did read it, too) - and not ONLY that, but replied to it (twice now!!).

As previously stated, damned clever, intra-reactive marketing!!

[Sperm Bank]

Kapt... correct. 4 pages of prattle about NOTHING. The original author posted about professionalism at Virgin, due to a advertising campaign kicked off at Syd. Some mind numbingly infantile morons then decided to turn it into a QF v's DJ thread (yet again!).

One clown in particular asked the question whether they were actually pilot's at the controls and then made reference to the CAO's/CAR's about legality. Only in Oz have I ever witnessed this type of brain dead diatribe. One can only imagine what they do in their spare time.

For the record and for those who really care about such a (breach of Australian professionalism).\

1. There were 2 (two) qualified and current on type pilot's at the controls at all times during the flight. (So we can avoid referring to those good old CAO's hey?, unless they don't allow pilot's to wear boxers!)

2. Yep they put on a pair of boxers over their pants. In the spirit of the advertising campaign they participated "as instructed in their brief from head office". I repeat for the little slow "as instructed from head office"

Prop, at no time have I ever engaged in anti QF behaviour. We have to work in the same environment on a daily basis mate, so it astounds me as to why some of you take it upon yourselves to assume you are the bastions of our skies. I have the pleasure of drinking with a few of your colleagues, fortunately they are not a bit like you.


WOOMERA . These DJ v's QF threads are becoming monotonous, pedantic and increasingly infantile in content and delivery. I (and many others) would like to see you intervene as soon as this type of garbage is initiated. There is little or no logical debate, just slanderous rubbish. I stand to be corrected but I see very little value in this kind of communication (or lack there of). It's one thing to have a bit of a dig and a laugh at ones expense, but something else to continually ridicule and deride the opposition, mostly with vacuous and foundationless drivel.

Your input is appreciated and I wait for your response.

Sperm breath? I think not!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[What-ho Squiffy!]

I think my friend that you are a hypocrit who simply cannot spell ...and...Go back to your meage pay packet

Oh the irony...

[Australia2]

proplever,

In the whole four pages (yes, I must admit I have read it) one thing catches my eye from you,

back to your meagre pay packet

In 4 years of wandering this forum I have never seen anyone make reference, or sling mud on this basis. Maybe a little below the belt; after all in this industry ( and it's certainly not over yet in the pacific) you are only as "illustrious" (in your context) as the next pay cheque !

[amos2]

So, the juniors once again need "big daddy" to protect them...

God help us all if this is the airline captain of today!!

[air-hag]

So how're VB going with their nice new jox.... must be sagging a little in the arse by now! :uhoh:

Have you VB drivers hit the skids yet?? :yuk:

[robroy]

Woomera,

How did this thread resurface ?

Has HAG the qf DRAGON, taken control D & GZ ?

Cheers,

robroy.

ps. I first met Puff the Pan Am, DRAGON, on a flight LHR - BKK, In the 70'S, surely, hag MUST BE HER TWIN DRAGON.

[Mr.Buzzy]

Riiiiing riiiing......
Hey proplever thats your bell to get back to tech. so you can brush up on all those CAOs/CARs. Keep pulling that lever Im sure someday all your schoolboy dobbing and sooking will pay off.

Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.............

[schweinhund]

Bzzzzzzzzzz???

Is that the noise of a stick shaker on a VB Ng I hear?

[Mr.Buzzy]

No Shizenhound, it's the sound of the GPWS going off south of Canberra just before sunrise........ Knob

[newbe200]

oh what a bunch of bloody childish babies. and to think you could all one day, or even now, be the captain of an airliner. jesus christ, you blokes need to come back down to ga for a week, in fact i would like to see that, you can come flying with me and be on my wage, put up with all the crap etc etc etc. i wonder how to pay the bills and you blokes go and get broadband so you can abuse each other, even faster.

and then you go on about how qf gets more than virgin in the bank..

and then you call each other knobs ( very intelligent )

unbelievable, this really shows why aviation in australia is such a crap industry at times, and how sad given its the best job in the world

[Binoculars]

Err, I think newbe has summed it up pretty well, really. Read back over the last page and see if you could disagree.

[air-hag]

abuse each other???

I think you're over-reacting a little you moron... :* ... ;)

It is Our Lot as Airline Pilots to work very little and spend the spare time bitching and moaning and taking cheap shots at each other. We earned it and we deserve it.

It is your lot, as lowly unwashed GA rabble, to read about it on your pathetic 28.8k dial-up connection on which you can only afford to send the replies in burst-transmission, then log off again, and enjoy pleasant thoughts of when you will join us.

And if we go on strike, we expect you to get your arses out of the way so we can continue earning $$$ in GA jobs for a while til the heat dies down.

Now back to the topic, have you bought a set of VB Jox yet Newbe?

If you bought them when they first came out, have they stood up to the rigours of GA usage? Being poor, you'd probably have turned them inside out a few times by now, unless things have changed since when I was in GA.

By the way, stop bitching about tuff times with your "instant" 250hr MECIR, multi-type-rated, "frozen" ATPL all-in-1 package deal that ya dad bought.

When I were a lad 'twas a lot harder. None of tha' fancy GPS stuff for us. We had to draw our own charts (Maps to you..)

Been to the bush yet?

[newbe200]

ah very intersting indeed. whilst not getting involved with your slag off i will happily answer some of your questions.

no, i have not bought virgin underwear

if you do go on strike i would expect you would be too busy campaigning your point and drawing up picket posters to be looking for my job

i actually have a 56k connection

my dad didnt buy my licence, i did, he passed away when i was 15, and i am still paying it off, 10 years later. so, now i am not a 1000 hour pilot whose straight into virgin on the back of a reference, in fact i am waiting for qf to call me. but hey, i would take a job with either.

i did my atpl when i had the hours to get my atpl

yes i have been to the bush, every week actually. gee, doesn't that give me instant cred:ooh:

i learnt to fly on maps as well WOW

yes i do dream about an airline job so i can support my family a little easier

hope that helps with your instant assesment of me:ok:

[air-hag]

In the words of Col. Nathan R. Jessep, USMC (Jack Nicholson) in "A Few Good Men",

"Well aren't I the ****in asshole..."

Am I allowed to say that in this context???

Yeah you're not really fitting into the stereo-typical GA box. Maybe I mis-judged you. Maybe I've mis-judged a whole lot of things around here.

I think it could be time to say good-bye to air-hag. She's none too popular and getting a bit tired and cranky.

Thanks, Newbe200, I owe you one.

[Sunfish]

Air Slag and the rest of you are way too young!

None of you remember your own dear QuaintArse campaigns during the 70'S!

Any of you remember "the Fading Blue Denim Route to England"??? This was one of Qantas's marketing campaigns that was at least asd embarrassing as anything that Virgin has ever done. Denim seat covers.

And now you are rabbiting on about Virgins marketing campaigns????????

Cheers!

SF

[yoobeedo]

A bit off the topic, however spot on the subject.

I boarded a Virgin flight recently just in time to catch the last quarter of the safety brief. 30 or more pax behind me on the ramp. Got to make that SY corfu.

:sad:

[schweinhund]

Are you reading this, CASA? :yuk:

[Sperm Bank]

Yoobeedo...ABSOLUTE GARBAGE! Even your dumb ar$e mate swinefund knows that to be wrong. The safety demo does NOT begin until AFTER the doors are closed and push back has commenced. NIce try at a wind up all the same.

Swinefund was that you trying to fly into a mountain down South?

[schweinhund]

Professionalism at Virgin = Military Intelligence.

A BIG contradiction in terms!:}

[Sunfish]

I've flown Qantas and VB. My verdict? Give me VB any day. At least they try and make flying a little less dour then it is at Qantas.

And furthermore, Branson's defining business philosophy is to make it fun to go to work - and its been proven to be a very succesful philosophy.

Qantas on the other hand, looks like its goign to be a very sad work environemnt in future.

[centurionII]

Dont know much about the flight crew, but i remember being in Sydney at a gate lounge waiting for my flight to Darwin back in early May this year. Come time to board, the chicky behind the counter made her announcement and from the very first word, she was pissing herself laughing over the PA. She was that much of a struggler that some other girl came over and finished it off for her as she disappeared below the counter. Having said that, i have a great friend who is a senior cabin attendant for VB and she's as professional as they come.

[quim]

Nice one centurion, like it, like it. (life of brian!)

Gotta agree with others here. VB is quite simply the most unprofessional airline that I have ever seen. It is a matter of time before something bad happens because of it.

Sunfish, regardless of what you state here, you have already destroyed your reputation with your inane ridiculous comments. No one is listening to you anyway, mate!

[Woomera]

This thread has run its course