Air France / flybe franchise.

[BEagle]

Due to fly LHR-TLS shortly in C class. I now discover that it isn't an Air France flight, but is 'operated by flybe' and is a 146-100.

Has anyone any information concerning the quality of travel on this route with this airline franchise? Or am I in for 2 hours of the usual 146 oily smell in a 1970s seat design?

[BAe 146-100]

Hi,

BEagle, you will probably be on G-JEAU seated in a 3+3 82 configuration or 3+2 70 config. On the flybe. website it says Economy "Designed for the passenger who wants minimal fuss and low fares twinned with excellent service". Hope you have a good flight!

BAe 146-100 :D

[surely not]

The seats are very comfortable, and the service is perfectly acceptable. What oily 146 smell? I've never noticed this and I've flown on the 146 quite a few times.

[BEagle]

The buzz 146s always had an odd, slightly oily smell when the cabin conditioning was on. But maybe flybe have a different system.

It'll be fun listening to that 'whooooooooooooo' noise when the flpas retract again!

But isn't the 146 rather a odd choice for LHR-TLS? I would have thought the A319/320 would have been more appropriate.

[Final 3 Greens]

BEagle

A 146 is a bit short of legs for sure, but no doubt its due to Flybe's fleet and presumably the fact that the route is 'thin' and thus AF prefer to sub it out.

I know what you mean about the oily smell in the past:yuk: Weren't there some strong complaints from crew a few years ago, some felt quite ill due to ingress of fumes into the galley I seem to recall. (Don't think it was Flybe, can't remember which airline.)

No doubt some mods have been added, as I've been on RJs with BA and Swiss this year and 146s with AF (Cityjet) and not experienced a whiff :O

They still imitate banshees when flaps are travelling from 18 to clean though!

[PAXboy]

The oil problem was quite some years ago and mainly in Australia, as I recall. It was to do with the air con pack intake being too close to the engines, or along those lines.

Some cabin crew were badly affected and even legal action, if I recall correctly. If you search PPRuNe, you will probably find something about when it happend but I think that it is now history.

I have been on the original 146, and various models since, for nearly 15 years - usually on the London to Isle of Man service but also on some longer sectors. I have sat in all corners of the cabin and have never experienced this smell. With regards to length of sector, I have done LTN~MUC (DebonAir :hmm: ) and that was just over 90 mins and reasonable. Last week, I was on a 737-300 and that did the TLS outbound sector in 75 mins, so not much longer for the 146, I expect.

The flaps do create significant noise whilst in transit but it's only a few seconds. On the approach, I take the sound to indicate that we are now committed to land, therefore a good sign! :p

I went through Toulouse last Sunday and Tuesday. A smart airport, clean and built to a sensible size to take expansion. One complaint - in the international departures lounge, flight information is only on TV sized monitors, rather than a BIG display. So you have to get up to inspect it.

I used the bus service to the train station and that was fine and on time.

If you are a Priority Pass member (or related) then the La Croix du Sud lounge is good and worth popping upstairs if you time on your hands.

If you are interested in aircraft :rolleyes: then watch out for all the Airbus activity. The existing facilities are on the (I think) south side and there were many a/c around in last stages of painting or being test flown. Several of the 'guppy' style machines that collect parts from the various plants, were on the Airbus tarmac, which is on the far side of the runways to the commercial tarmac.

To the north is the considerable development for the A380 production. From the air, the hangers just look big but when you are on the ground and see them, you realise their height is considerable.

After all that travel report, I suspect that I have confirmed my :8 status.

[BEagle]

It's actually Airbus I'm going to visit. They certainly use the Beluga a good deal - they're equally busy up at Hamburg!

Outbound sector by 146 is scheduled as 1:50 - so slightly longer than the 737, I guess.

The flap howl is rather amusing - I always use to watch people's reactions on my sadly defunct STN-FRA trips with buzz. Nowadays it's LHR T2:yuk: to FRA with LH...and the joys of the Lufthansakaesebroetchen! :yuk: :yuk:

[Final 3 Greens]

The banshee is not restricted to the cabin either.

Living near the STN SIDs, we can always tell when one of BAEs finest is cleaning up on the climb if we're in the garden!

[PAXboy]

Funny that you should mention that F3Gs, I was leaving friends this evening and heard the Banshee ... it was dark but someone was on their way into Luton ...:rolleyes:

BEagle: "It's actually Airbus I'm going to visit." There I go, preaching to the converted, "If you are interested in aircraft ...": D'oh! :uhoh:

[BEagle]

Well, back from the flybe expereince:

Check-in. Fine, quickly completed with no problems.

AF Lounge. Poor selection of snacks. Nowhere obvious to plug in a lap-top power supply and no desk to work from. Convenient for the departure gate. No obvious departure display screens.

Aircraft. The British European BAe146 G-JEAX, contrary to the statements made on the Air France website, is not ‘in AF livery’.

4. Boarding. 9-18, then 4-18, Business Class last. Gate jet stairs ‘not compatible’ with the BAe 146, so I was forced to stand in an environmentally noisy location with the aircraft APU and various GSE items running, not to mention the noise from other manoeuvring aircraft. Whilst on the aircraft steps, I was surprised to note that the Commander was evidently permitting the push-back vehicle to couple to the tow bar whilst boarding was still in progress. The slightest movement of the push-back vehicle at such a time could cause passengers to lose their footing and possibly to fall from the steps. There were thus several avoidable hazards to passengers in the boarding operation.

5. Pre-departure. No particularly special treatment was shown to Business Class passengers. No magazines were offered at any time in flight. Most of the available newspapers had already been taken by the Economy Class passengers who had, of course, boarded earlier!

6. In-flight. The Commander made one very brief PA call as we began our descent into TLS. He appeared to show little interest in his customers.

7. Catering. In a word – poor. Compared to the standards of Lufthansa:

a. Starter. Bland but acceptable. LH’s are far better selected and presented. They offer a selection of bread rolls which are warm and served with tongs, whereas AF’s are cold, of one type only and already on the plate

b. Main course. Horrible! A cold piece of white fish with cold rice. The worst meal I’ve ever been offered on any airline ever. I took one bite and left it.

c. Cheese. Mercifully the French cheese was good. But the second bread roll I asked for to accompany it was offered from a grubby looking plastic bin. Hardly well-served!

d. Sweet. Totally uninspiring. LH’s are vastly superior.

e. Drinks. The wine came in screw-top bottles and I was expected to drink it from what looked like a plastic tooth mug. On LH the wine is served from a bottle in a real glass. LH also offer mineral water, either sparkling or still, again in a real glass. AF merely provided a sealed plastic cup of water.

f. Coffee. Absolutely horrid. For a country famous for its coffee, I expected something far better.

g. Chocolate. Fair enough – and made in Belgium.

Overall this was a sadly disappointing meal. Given the French reputation for fine cuisine, I was expecting something very much better, especially in Business Class. Lufthansa’s Business Class catering is far, far superior in every respect.

8. Service. I felt that the Cabin Crew were keen to feed the passengers and have everything all cleared away as soon as possible; there was a general feeling of being hastened throughout. Again, LH service is vastly better.

9. Arrival. At least the jetstairs at TLS are compatible with the BAe146!

10. Overall. The overall impression I gained was that this was basically a low-cost airline masquerading as a main line operation – and certainly not what I would term Business Class in any respect. Fortunately I did not pay for my own ticket or I would be certainly demanding a refund. Bread and cheese is hardly what I would call a Business Class meal. And why on earth the French national airline should schedule a franchised low-cost airline operating old BAe146 aircraft on a route to the home of the French aircraft industry (Airbus Industrie) I cannot imagine. If I have to fly to TLS again, I will certainly attempt to fly with a different airline.

[BAe 146-100]

Hi,

How was the condition of the aircraft from the inside?

BAe 146-100 :)

[BEagle]

Nothing special. 'Clean and adequate' is all I would decribe it as.....

[Dick Fisher]

Flew BHX-TLS in April with FlyBe and thought the service was fine. So much so, we're doing it again next Friday.

Toulouse Airport is great. Not very busy so quick to get into and out of. Mind you, fighting the French in an unfamiliar hire car on the peripherique fifteen minutes after de-planing is always likely to be a big thrill!

[BEagle]

TLS is indeed a fine airport!

Hope you don't get the horrible cold fish meal though if you're in Business Class.

Incidentally, the coffee on LH HAM-LHR was far nicer than the AF/flybe rubbish.

How is 'FlyBe' pronounced? Is it 'fleeb', 'fly B', 'flab', 'Fly Bee-Ee' or what? Why do some airlines have such stupid names - what was wrong with 'British European'?

[knobbygb]

On the positive side of such airline alliances... Was recently booking an AF trip MAN-CDG (mainline A320/737) for a friend and managed to get the same flights on the FlyBe (thats "Fly B") website considerabley cheaper than the AF coded ones anywhere else.

At off peak times the prices were the same with either airline, but in rush-hour AF went up from £114 to £230, but the FlyBe ones were still £114! My friend was very glad not to have to check out of her Paris hotel at 5 AM.

Worth checking out if you're paying for your own tickets :D