NEW C130 Variant seen in Wilts!!

[Grimweasel]

New C130 variant seen this week at secret Wilts airbase. The new C130G Mk4 seems to be a secret foray into the world of the noiseless Hercules Glider! I just wonder why the enginless beast is not being activley towed around the world by the new C17 fleet. Worked for Op Market Garden. Is this model made of wood too?????

[StopStart]

If it all goes to plan we expect to have a full fleet of these by early next year.

As we understand it, they will be towed into battle by the MK3B Bendcules.

:ok:

[TAC Queen]

STOP START
In reply to your post, all the extra kit they have shoe horned on to the bendcules is excellent, unfortunately they have now found you cannot actually fit any crew on. Apparently the next mod will incorporate the crew sitting in the wheel well using highly trained fairies to move the controls (like the J). This will solve all the problems in one stroke. There has also been the suggestion of the Nav’s bringing their caravans to help balance out the front!

All spelling mistakes are because I can’t spell
:uhoh:

[T_Handle]

Are Mk4s the big ones or little ones!?!

As I understand it the 4s are big, so someone has stolen two great big chunks of the fuselage of the stealth glider then stuck it back together with out anyone noticing!

Or is it just inacuracies in the prejudice?:}

[Roland Pulfrew]

Anyone got any pictures of the J-Glider?:)

[StopStart]

Course there aren't any pictures! Top Secret you know.

If pictures got out Lord Hutton would be even busier.....Grimweasel would have to take a walk out into the woods and not come back - if you get my drift.

T-handle - you are correct. The MK4 is the longer version.

The Mk5s were chosen as the basis for the glider as they are shorter and lighter and hence easier for the Bendcules to tow into battle. When I say battle, I mean Akrotiri.



As I understand it we're all soon to be issued with red noses and spinning bow ties to complete the effect.

http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/silly.gif

[RoboAlbert]

We don't need red noses SS, remember that trip in the states when the RAF police girl pointed out to us that we were in fact the comedy clown flying club - such insight after only a few moments on headset!:p

[Grimweasel]

No chance of the Bendcules towing the Jlider into battle. All that xtra weight down the back will cause terrible trim problems!!!!! (ie. It may cause the thing to trim and be useful!!)

[ZH875]

Easy one to solve. To retrim, simply put more pies on the flight deck. Aircraft Happy, Loadie even happier.

[DummyRun]

SS

Sorry to pull you up on a trivial point old boy, but you did appear to omit the rather nice, long flappy boots with the curly up toes! apparently one would'nt be seen DEAD without those at ARSEc't Ops these days ( well, apart from the kweel nu guys at BZN )

Sorry, lost the thread slightly, ZH 875, didn't I batter your backend a bit firmly in somewhere stanlike, if you can't recall it we can do that PM thang.

As for the weight on the flightdeck, what's wrong with a STANEVAL Capt checking the OCU Capt checking the Capt whilst the STANEVAL nav is checking the instructor nav checking the stude nav + Eng di da di da, you pointy guys missed a trick, how can you possibly trap the checkers without at least a 4 seat Tornado !!!! SLAP,- Doh, Sorry we've always done it like that in 48/6?/38/1/38/2 Gp, why train for excellence when you can fudge for compurtense.

Load Moving.............

[Impiger]

At least the glider version will be able to use max continuous .. er .. continuously.

[Grimweasel]

Seen Air Forces Monthly this month? Go to the attrition page and look at the Israeli C130 that was opened up by the No.4 engine Prop coming loose!! I would never sit between the red lines that say "Danger Propeller Blades!!!"

I take it that the Airships deem it too risky to have the same thing happenig to the new J fleet. The solution is to take the damn engines off and turn 'em into gliders. It's all so clear now!!!

[Surditas]

There's been a J model glider parked at RAAF Richmond for a couple of years now. In the true RAAF way we are ignoring an off the shelf solution and pressing ahead with developing our on piece of kit. It will be in service ten years after it was originally meant to be, won't do what it was designed to do and will eventually be modded with off the shelf kit so that it fits in with our combined ops with the Yanks.

[Noble Lox]

I think it's a shame that what should have been a wonderful aeroplane is reduced to scrap metal and is now only good for melting down and making bean cans.

I can't help but having a wry smile at all the route queens who thought they were onto something special, including the monkeys who parked in a ditch in Kenya last week.;)

Rumours are afoot about the big meltdown which can't happen soon enough. Then at least the decking and the new patio will get some use as we'll all have :mad: **all to do - like it was before.

Just popping down Sainsbury's for a bulk order of pies.:=

Bring on the A400 and then we'll have a proper aeroplane! They told me it's great!!!

[BEagle]

It will be! If the 130Js and Ks can keep going for that long, of course!

Then there'll be C17, A400M and the transport capability of FSTA - and the C130 will be pensioned off after an enormously long and impressive career coping with all the $hitty jobs that were thrown at it.

(Even if it is $odding awful in the passenger role!)

[Noble Lox]

Get with the programme Beags - thats what this is all about, the mighty J is turning into a glider as its consuming engines quicker than 24 Sqn eat pies, and at the current rate will be lucky to make it to the end of the week:ugh:
The old rattlebus K has had a small fortune spent on it and is rumoured to be projected to early part of the next decade.
Meanwhile back at the pie eating establishment in darkest Wilts ..............that will close 2010 !! those with a brain are starting to look for jobs that suit themselves, and there are 2 engineless crocks of s*** parked on bays with small numbers out of sight.
The boss put a flying suit on his mangy,epileptic dog last week and posted it to BZN ,apparently its doing well on the 10 Groundschool, but it is a champion at putting its nose up seniors b*****m's:D :D :D

:sad: :sad: :sad:

[BEagle]

Actually, my Noble Lux, originally I penned:

"It will be! If the 130Ks can keep going for that long, of course!"

..then thought that perhaps that was a bit mean on RoboAlbert, Stoppers and others who have to cope with the digitally re-mastered 130 on a day-to-day basis! So I changed it to "C130Js and Ks"...

C130J - there's 'smart procurement' for you:yuk: Even people involved in the project allgedly resigned as they refused to tell any more lies for Lockheed. "You CANNOT BE SERIOUS......" Perhaps some of you will recognise the significance of this quotation?

Oh - and the mangy dog gave up its rectal exploration efforts - it kept getting kicked in the chops by the ankles of those who were already deeply inserted!;)

[Noble Lox]

Couldnt agree more........I do truly feel sorry for all those on the mighty Lockweed electric,singing,dancing jet as they have been sold a pup. Credit is due to them that they have got it so far and acheived so much and saved some senior backsides.
Talking of smart procurement, hot rumour is.........sell the little electric jets to assuage the furrowed brows of the bean-counters as it will offset the money spent on more ......drum roll please..............C-17's of course,now why didnt I think of that. Oh and as a complete aside -everything might (might) fit into BZN
As for the dog, well it made it back but its in a bit of trouble as it spent lots of 30Sqn SOCIAL fund on decking and stuff for a new patio. without asking the troops,who are revolting:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[juliet]

i wouldnt feel too sorry for j guys, we are still getting 60-80 hours a month and it all counts pretty well towards that atpl. if you do want to shed a tear though think of us only doing telic runs with two days off in between, very boring, could be worse, could be on the k having last flown a route in july

[Little_Bee-eater]

:(:8 Pups, epileptic dogs and revolting troops? Maybe you're a tad frustrated over there in Kandahar...

[Noble Lox]

Please , please , please can we keep this one from descending into K v`s J vitriol and back biting as it has already worn me out !
We know the war was won en route to Akrotiri and a jolly fine (and long boring) job you did too.
60-80 hrs is easily enough to qualify you for a hard won medal, but I am reliably informed you had to be awake for at least 30% of the time to qualify.
Open your mind (and eyes) and you will see that some (lots ) of the K`s have been very noticable by their abscence.
And the Route (schmoute) currency issue is because they have been acheiving more than 60-80 hrs but no route hrs(scratches head in wonderment-goes back to building decking)
Facts are, for whatever reason J model engines are lasting about as long as a lolipop in Basrah, and a big problem is looming(scene shifts to engineless models looking forlorn) . Mind you it hasnt stopped HM`s finest parking in a storm drain last week and rendering another one useless.
Have a lovely time hours building on route, please eat a pie for me:= := :=

[BEagle]

A quick reminder for those thinking about ATPL(A)s who are current on military ME multi-pilot aeroplanes (that doesn't mean 2-stick FJs, incidentally!), the maximum accreditation is available for those with 2000 hrs TT, of which 1500 must be on an approved ME type (e.g C130) following completion of the OCU. Of those 1500, not less than 1000 must be as PIC, the other 500 can be co-pilot P1 time (PIC U/S).

If you have all that, then all you need to do (and no,you do NOT need to do the FRTOL exams if you meet these accreditation criteria) is:

1. Get a JAA Class 1 medical
2. Pass ATPL Air Law
3. Have your next IR 'observed' by a civil IRE
4. Fill out the application form
5. Pay the dosh
6. Wait for thud of little green book on doormat!



I did! Incidentally, if you've already got a UK civil commercial licence and have completed the JAR-FCL 'assimilation of knowledge' requirements, you don't even need to take ATPL(A) Air Law!

[Little_Bee-eater]

Get back to the bit about elastic bands for engines, it makes I laugh. Now 60-80hrs/mnth heading for lots more, against 8-10 engines/mnth starting with not too many.............I think this plan has a flaw.Keep eating isotonic meat+potato pies(remember plenty of sauce) and 1000pies will occur well before 1000hrs but way after 1000 engines.

[juliet]

not trying to slag off the k at all, just genuinely sorry for the guys i know on the south side who are getting one route a month or a couple of local area mct's at best. also am quite aware of the engine, and other, problems so am looking forward to some gardening leave.

[RoboAlbert]

Spare me your sympathy Beagle because I am now moving on from the jolly old RAF.

I will miss the J though and it has never been the case of having ‘to cope with the digitally re-mastered 130 on a day-to-day basis’. Quite the contrary I loved everything about the aircraft. However, I have come to realise that the ill informed bollix that permeates the whole J debate has probably irreparably damaged the aircraft’s chances and sadly it really is the RAF’s loss.

On a happier note I’ve just got back from Disney and found this great sweatshirt – it’s got a picture of Mickey Mouse and an aeroplane overhead. Underneath are the words Mickey Mouse Airlines. How very appropriate.

[Little_Bee-eater]

Look fella's I have the utmost admiration for you military war heros, but my genuine sympathy is with you as you have performed feats beyond the endurance of gods making that engineless crock of s*** work. You all deserve a day off , a trip to the Palace and a life on the "after dinner speaking circuit" telling of your trials. What should have been the best aeroplane to hit the street has proved to be an Airfix kit made by Wombles flown by Skygods;(that includes route queens of the highest order too!).
I honestly despair that we are soldiering on(no pun intended) with a 50yr old battlebus and on the horizon all I see is Indians and the promise(listen for the echo ,J is great) of the A400 to fill the boots of the real albert.
We should have listened to the USAF,USMC,RAAF and everyone else with a brain and NOT Miguel Portillo.
Look across the airfield as jobs will be available for a loooong time, as long as your skin is thick enough for the schoolboy banter
Still never mind plenty of time for the Kenyan Tac warriors to enjoy the new decking ho ho ho while they queue for their chat with the boss

[Aerobratic]

Gents,

As a mere onlooker I find it hard to understand how those from the same base pick holes at each other.

The K has had a mighty reign. The J has bags of potential but, unfortunately, not the correct personnel on high to promote it further(coupled with alleged problems with Lockheed).

Comparing threads on PPrune, when a Red Arrow departs the RW in Jersey the thread remains staid and apt. At the slightest hint of a problem with a J/K(eg Kenya,engines) a melee commences. I would imagine 5 year olds could assist in that type of banter.

Surely someone with more rank than I should be stamping on these squabblings as it will probably end in tears sooner than later. Grow up lads.

End of broadcast.

[Little_Bee-eater]

Purrleease
lets not get into another peurile squabble or the acrobatic air cadets will tangle the handles of their hi-tech handbags.
For the record,this is a serious issue as soon there may not be a J ,if this horrid engine problem is not sorted soonest.
The rumour that"a done deal" is shortly to be announced that a substantial proportion of wonder jets are to be "exchanged" for C-17's is more than crew room chat
As for the K in the past tense,please try to stetch your mind(it may hurt a little at first) ,as serious amounts of cash have been spent, and the latest informed opinion sees the old boneshaker well into the next decade
Oh and I find it difficult to argue with anyone on my base, as Im de boss, what I says goes

[2port]

Been away for a few weeks - what did those mighty tac J's get up to in Kenya??

[Noble Lox]

Firstly, Ive re-read the posts and for once I think this is how it should be,namely informed debate/rumour and sharp banter (do you see yet aerobratic??) if your too sensitive or precious not to be able to see the nose on your face, then sit down for a few minutes and have a word with yourself. Then re-read the thread and eat more fish for your noggin.

Secondly, our heros got a little tired and emotional in deepest Africa , and so did some people in deepest Wiltshire, none of this is true,I slipped in the shower,banged my head,and when I awoke found it was all a dream:confused: :confused: :confused:
Ah well lots of spares back home,oh no thats right I forgot for a mo!!
Still at least we might now get some time off to enjoy the expensive patio

[john morrin]

People should really learn the facts before putting 'pen to paper' or 'fingers to keyboards'. If you want to learn the facts then please come across to my office tomorrow and I will pleased to enlighten you. As for Noble Lox, I hope he or she has the guts to come to my office tomorrow morning so I can explain the facts of life to him or her.

John Morrin

[Noble Lox]

Ooooh now easy tiger,
is your office comfortably furnished? I would just love to visit, just one small prob-WHERE THE b***** H*** is it old fool.
Lets keep this on the level and get back to idle banter and keep hold of our teddies,dummies and lollipops.
Before we miss the point entirely,are the engines alright??
I hear the hamsters all survived but most of the wheels are bent beyond repair.
Maybe you'd like to come to my office chocolate lips

[john morrin]

Enough said - see you tomorrow then

John Morrin

Sorry. I Didn't read your last email properly.

I will be available from 0830A to 0930A in OC24 Sqn's office ( by the way, I am the OLD BASTARD, at the moment). After that I will be flight testing an aircraft following rectification, for a multiple engine change. Should be back in OC 24 Sqn's office from 1400A. I await your arrival!!

John Morrin

[Noble Lox]

Would truly love to meet tomorrow but its an awful long way from here to there. It would also put a major dent(no pun) in my prog. It will have to be another time.:D

[john morrin]

Clearly then you don't know the full picture!!

Take care and FLY SAFE

John Morrin

[Aerobratic]

Nicely put Johnny.

Mr Nob Le Lox, where are you to be so far away yet so well informed on matters?

[highveldtdrifter]

Hear hear Jonny,

So its true the turbines are not lasting as long as they where supposed to at max chat. The solution will be a cruise power reduction (sound familiar 1010 vs 985 on the K), but it should still be faster than the old girl.

Don't be too hard on the Kenya lads, they wouldn't be the first to hit something on a night strip would they, and we all know who we are. Of course many have been saved by a bit of GE fetteling or by stuffing feathers in the hole and claiming a bird strike.

It is an outstanding patio, shame we can't afford hot water in the Mess as well.

[Noble Lox]

Firstly, sorry if I offended your delicate sensibilities(honestly).
There seems to be some top level brown nosing going on here,is it assesment time for the children in Wiltshire? Did the big boys shout and make you cry , good on yer Jonny for telling them off, now can we have an ice cream if we promise not to wet our pants again.
Acrobrat and drifter go make some tea while the grown ups talk.
Would love to meet when Im home....would look funny in a hat though(havent worn one in years),you could pop along to my office when you have time,or we could do lunch I'll charge it to the company and call it networking.
You know there is a big world past the end of Dauntsey bank, and the earth is round.
PS for the acidbrat I have friends who build patios who Im still in touch with,who enjoy keeping me informed. Go on use your goldfish brain -it,ll hurt at first but you can do it.Then make Jonny some tea:{ :{ :{ :{ :( :( :( :(

:D

[RoboAlbert]

Noble Lox – although not formally trained in this field, would I be correct in assuming that you were bullied at school?

[average pilot]

Robo-
think you might be right about Nobbly Blox, or whatever his name is. probably went to pwep school
John-
don't take it all so personally, or you'll have a heart attack...not worth it, mate!
Beagle-
you really do have shares in the A400M Luftklappenfuhrertransportmachine don't you ?

[BEagle]

No I don't!

And why do you call the A400M an "air valve leader transport machine"?

It will be an excellent transport aeroplane - its only drawback is that it looks so much like an Albert that the ignorant can't understand why it will be so superior.

[RoboAlbert]

Good Grief – a sensible comment on a J thread…..

’ its only drawback is that it looks so much like an Albert that the ignorant can't understand why it will be so superior’

…unfortunately you’re talking about the wrong aircraft Beagle!

[Aerobratic]

Nob Lox are you getting the picture?

Bit of a trend building amongst the lads here over your comments....and, well actually, you.....last time I saw that it involved Admin Guru or whatever he was called.....oh dear.

You seem so keen to mention 'your office' so often, where is it?

[BEagle]

Robo - you will note that I was using the future tense as the A400M has yet to fly.....

"Its main drawback is that, even though it looks so much like any other Albert, the ignorant can't understand why it isn't any better" is perhaps what I might have said about......another transport aeroplane;)

[Noble Lox]

Is that the best you can do? Did the big lads shout and make you cry? do you want them to go away? Aaaaah diddums.
Look clowns take a deep breath and try to see what this is all about, yet another problem hinders the wonder jet,and a long way down the line it still cant/isnt doing what it says on the tin.
You have a point with the reduced engine power setting for the K but the solution they employed was put on extra fuel,often into the external tanks(can you see whats coming?),have you fitted the tanks yet?
Now its just ANOTHER problem to overcome and in the big bad world people are losing faith.
A coherent Tac AT transport policy (open your eyes,use your goldfish brain,smell the coffee) is plain , C-17's,A400,FSTA, which why the big coffee bar chat see's the part ex of your electric jets for C-17,and get by until the European wonder bus arrives.
Then you all need a job at BZN.
:* :{ :p :p :p :ok:

[BEagle]

I'd go along with C17, A400M and FSTA - but really think that the A400M should be based at Rompers Green.

Whichever flavour of Albert is still in service in 6 years time will doubtless have provided a pretty good return on investment. But how on earth anyone expects a relatively slow tactical trash hauler/meat bomber to be used for strategic work without rapidly using up airframe and engine life I cannot imagine!

Incidentally, EADS is now funding further tanker development, so it must be very sure about the A330's chances in the FSTA competition.

[I_stood_in_the_door]

regards the stealth jlider, with the 59 anniversary of the Battle for Arnhem this weekend could we get the powers that be paint one in D Day colours and tow it across the channel to our dutch friends?

We could use the old battlebus as the tug and arrive in one piece.

What no engines?

[Cardinal Puff]

Beags

"Air valve leader transport" would be appropriate considering the amount of hot air generated by the leadership. gotta vent the stuff somehow.....

[2port]

Mr Morrin - why can't you enlighten us all of the facts on this forum rather than just a one to one with Mr Lox? Surely can't be that secret that it has to be behind closed doors??

[Little_Bee-eater]

Well put...and, forgive a newcomer for commenting, isn't the purpose of this site to be rumours and suggestion...?

Why get so het up?

...and I'd prefer beer to a patio any day... :=

handbags down Johnny :ouch:

[Noble Lox]

No prep schools for me I'm afraid.
Acidbrat pray tell of the trend amongst you young thrusters,please tell me they dont beat the brains,sense and ability to see past the end of your big nose out of you at Stalag Luft IV these days.
As for AG he dissappeared, it is you who are noticably absent.
Now if you all get together you might be able to come up with a witty reply(or some more bunk party line about the wonder jet).
As far as I can see a few bits of unguided venom from some girl guides is hardly a trend.
Anyway back to the point,apart from being able to climb fast(oooh- but a bloo** big thermal needed) why is your car so good mister?
:{ :{ :{
:D :ok:

[RoboAlbert]

If you are really interested in knowing about the aircraft if you do a search you’ll find plenty of information on the J’s capabilities. Better still speak to any J operator; J guys are always glad to talk about the aircraft. It isn’t a party line by the way most, guys are just genuinely enthusiastic about it.

However, I suspect you are just a windup merchant who would rather give a group of very hard working, enthusiastic and highly motivated colleagues a hard time. Well done your mum must be so proud.

[Noble Lox]

You think this is a hard time!
Oh deary me,its true then they can train jelly babies
:( :( :ok:

[RoboAlbert]

Oh yes please NL. Please cut me down with your razor wit and advanced name calling....

I wonder if StopStart has got some small GIFs of some sticks and some stones?:zzz:

[john morrin]

I promised myself that I would not write under my real name again but find myself doing so (DOH!!).

I have written to Noble Lox explaining why I replied to his earlier threads, specifying the points I was unhappy about. It had nothing to do with things ‘J’ related (pprune seems to be a forum for what we used to do in Happy Hour, on a Friday night – namely friendly leg-pulling!!) and I should have been more specific in my reply.

I didn’t want the thread to become a slanging match – neither am I prepared to supply real-time information on an open and insecure site (read the disclaimer at the opening page!!). It would also be extremely bad for my career prospects (not to mention my pension!)

I was quite taken aback when some of my colleagues decide to rally to my defence – it was appreciated, but I am quite prepared to fight my own battles, as I have been doing so for some considerable time.

As for the J, the ac has been doing a fantastic job. You need only to look at the logbooks of the Pilots and Air Loadmasters to realise how much the RAF has relied upon the J, on operations, especially over the last two years.

The flying rate at Lyneham has exceeded all expectations – especially considering the base is home to two smaller fleets as opposed to one large fleet, as it was in 1990/91.

It would be unfair to sing on about the J. Our colleagues across the other side of the airfield did some outstanding work during TELIC. You civvies will have to wait a long time before you get to know a fraction of what they did. Most of it is a mystery to us as well!! Well done boys and girls.

As for brown-nosing, I have never found the need, as my abilities as a pilot and an officer have seemed to be sufficient so far, and I am too old to start changing my ways.

Don’t worry about me having a heart attack – the CO’s X-country confirmed the ticker is still ticking!!

Here endeth the lesson – If you must write, keep it impersonal (i.e. don’t slag off third party individuals!). Lets stick to banter that everyone can appreciate – email is very powerful and can go anywhere!!

John Morrin

[flipster]

Nicely put John,

I'm with you mate

Inter-squadron/fleet/service banter is fine but all too often, this site degenerates into vitriolic and personal slanging matches which demeans the genuine posters, their valid concerns, problems, questions and not least, their humour. One could argue that it is a 'rumour site' and has no basis in fact - not sure about that as people do use it as a means to ask for advice, air the grieviances, and spread the word - and it IS monitored by the high-paid help - I know - so be careful!

I especially agree about cautious use of the power of e-mails.......but that's another story, as they say!

Flipster (and I thought I was being obvious!)

ps Thanks to the J for the lift to Marshalls the other day to see more new bits of kit with which the old venerable rattle-bus is now bristling. Shame both J and K couldn't be similarly equipped fleet-wide - then we might have something the army could actually use !

[Aerobratic]

Flipster, Johnny M,

Agreed. This isn't a personality slagging forum which is what some (NL) appear to be wrongly using it as. Banter is integral to our profession. The best banter though is witty and informed, not crude and unfounded.

No doubt there will be another adolescent reply from some quarter.

(PS. NL, My teeth are probably a lot longer than you think).

:E

[SALAD DODGER]

John Morin

You seem to be someone who knows a thing or two about the C130 J, and your post have interested me. Please could you share some of your knowledge for those af us not lucky enough to be at Lyneham. Please be honest.

Is the J more capable than the K at present?
I know that it has a swanky flight deck, and a radar to be proud of, but does it give any real advantages to the operational capability?
Why is the Lyneham banter and infighting always laced with venom?

Thanks

[Grimweasel]

now that all and sundry have had their chest hairs bared for all can we beg the question as to why the Jlider exists in the first place? Is it a case of canabalisation or just plain unlucky?

[TAC Queen]

If any one was around Lyneham yesterday 20/09 they would have seen a completely empty PAN, K and J
(Except the glider sorry to mention it).
Does this not show how hard both sides of the airfield are working still. Yes the J has some problems so does the new K3A.
Lets all eat a pie and say no more about it.

I'm really looking forward to the reduction in crew ratios followed by my divorcé.

All spelling mistakes are because I can't spell.

[albert the first]

TQ - Gosh you are so cuddly - Lets all have a big hug in

the north and south should be friends:yuk:

[ZH875]

Grimweasal, the reason that the Jlider exists, is due to results of a trial.

Compared with the Klassic, the mighty J has so much more Engine HP and fuel endurance, so some bright spark decided to have a competition between the K and the J to see at what point the two aircraft have equal load shifting capability/fuel burn rate.

So first they removed one engine from the J. Surprisingly it still won, so they took off another. After many runs in various coditions, the Klassic was still being outpaced. To ease the financial costs of another two sets of flight trials, they decided to remove the last two engines in one go. Now the result of this was a big surprise to the bright spark. The Klassic won this part of the trial hands down. Unfortunately, as most of the K force was moving Op Telic etc good about, the only load they could put on the K was the engines from the J.

As the 47/70 boys needed a good laught, they arranged with the muppets to off load the engines downroute. Since this happened, the combined Herc force has been too busy to go and pick them up, and even if they could, the Muppets have lost the location of the engines and the airwaybill details as well.

I hope that this clarifies the Jlider for you.

[TAC Queen]

Albert the first
Are you calling me fat?:{

Why don’t we have a J,K bash. Sorry I mean party, we could hold it on the glider.
A SNCO could plan it, organise it and run it while a young thrusting Flt Lt (lets call him OIC Party) could write a letter about and take all the credit and then get promoted.:ok:

Has their not been enough said about J,K. Its very childish at times and just not called for. I feel it undermines the spirit de corps of Lyneham. Is not professional or in the greater good of the Royal Air Force or our Britannic Majesty when our dirty laundry is aired on a public forum such as this.

So lets take the P**S out of the shiny fleet, who are lets be honest a right bunch of W:mad:S.
:ouch:

All spelling mistakes are because I can’t spell.

[Noble Lox]

Firstly,apologies if Ive upset some of you more sensitive types. I never (ever) said you didnt work(damned)hard and I know you have (ALL) done an incredible job.
What has amused me is the constant "fettling" the wonder jet has needed to get it this far.What has got it this far is the people involved - so stop telling me you work so hard ,I KNOW YOU DO. In your part of the world I also draw amusement from the strength of feeling amongst truckies
As for Acidbath who seems to want me to descend into some personal diatribe with him, if my comment is so crude and unfounded then why are you so irate?(Again -"me think the lady doth protest too much")
Please dont go off beam again and tell me how hard you work/worked,this is not my point at all.
It started out as a gentle jibe about engines, now join the great hugfest,and humourmill and calm down.
The Team works to coin a phrase,now my cover is blown!
Please all take care,and never ever trim into turns
:D :D :D :ok:

[charliesbar]

JM and Flip

Can't help but think that you let down the RAF as a whole by feeling the need to reply to these posts. Whats wrong with letting others speculate, lies rumours etc? That is the fun of the forum. Let the RAF's achievements speak for themselves. Using your names does not give you the morale high ground at all but just makes you look petty, self publicists who can't keep your gobs shut and please don't think for a minute that you are now the people's heros.

Just my opinion.

Oh if you want to keep it impersonal then don't make it the complete opposite.

[RoboAlbert]

Not as such charliesbar – I know them both well and ‘petty, self publicists who can't keep your gobs shut’ they ain’t.

They’re both probably guilty……

…of nothing more than actually giving a f…. Quite rare in this man’s Airforce.

[Aerobratic]

I'll second RoboAlbert.

If the forum is for (paraphrased) 'lies, rumour, opinion and speculation' then at least let the gents give their opinions.

:ok:

[charliesbar]

I agree, but they are also anonymous forums (see big red blurb at the bottom of the page) and trying to make your point more valid by using your name is surely against the spirit of the thing.:confused:

I say I exist so it must be true.

Father Christmas

[Aerobratic]

May be wrong, but I believe that the Anon Blurb in red is more of a disclaimer rather than a rule.

What IS written in the PPrune home page is:


"....Our aim is to keep the content relevant and to stop the few troublemakers who are unable to learn 'netiquette' from turning some threads into flame wars.

PPRuNe started out as a hobby but has grown into an organisation dedicated to providing the ability for anyone with an interest and something worthwhile to say, a platform directly to the people who make the aviation world go round. Use it but please don't abuse it. It can be addictive, so be warned! ".


More relevant to read that (above) with respect to JM and Flipsters inputs than the red stuff at the foot of this page....perhaps? But again, that is simply my opinion.

What a great digression from Grimweasels Jlider thread. :\

[Little_Bee-eater]

Why quote the rules for :mad:'s sake? I agree with Charliesbar.

It's just rumour, jibes and fun.

Christ, chill out.


:=

[Always_broken_in_wilts]

JM, recently promoted and STILL a top geezer, how many like that do we all know:yuk:..........fu@kin few me thinks!

Robo and the like, myself included, fly in the electric jet and love it to bits. All those who have I have had the pleasure of flying from a to b have remarked what a lovely machine it is. There is no doubt we have been sold a pup for a whole host of reasons but we are doing our bl@@dy hardest to make the thing work, and are getting there for sure:ok:

Mr Lox,

"Firstly,apologies if Ive upset some of you more sensitive types. I never (ever) said you didnt work(damned)hard and I know you have (ALL) done an incredible job."

Next time you sober up go read all your posts and see if you come to same conclusion as the rest of us......................your just plain rude:sad: I expect some sort of schoolboy personal attack which will only serve to prove mine, and most others on here point. You would have come across a lot better had you the courage to take up JM's very kind offer.......................but hey that's civvies for you.

al spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced

PS in anticipation...........my OJAR, there's a new word for us baldricks:O , was written weeks ago and JM does not feature in the chain..............stroker:}

[Aerobratic]

I hate to get pedantic, but I will always stand up for myself or others who deserve it. ;)

I am not a big reader of rules, but it was Charlies Bar who initiated that aspect...you know, the guy you agree with?

I am all for rumour, jibes and fun, but the reason JM and Flipster wrote what they did was because this thread was going well beyond that. Read back a few pages?

Always Broken, yes you are right, JM is still a top lad. Funny that, I suspect he was promoted on his professional ability rather than dusting the Mess. In fact its arguable that all SO2 on his sqn are from this mould.

So, anyway......some rumour....is it true that a J is off to rescue a K on a strip in Africa this weekend?:ok:

[Noble Lox]

Do they issue blinkers to truckies these days?
Can we please,please leave the K v J vitriol alone it really does you no good and its not the point of this thread at all.
If you really are that angry or hung up about it then there are very good courses available these days(or chat with the padre).
Of course I could continue the mutual appreciation society that this seems to have become.
No one said the C130J was not good at getting from A-B it is,but if half the things it said on the brochure were true then it should be doing an awful lot more than that.
Going to rescue a K is the business youre in and its all part of the job,Im sure theyve got you out of some holes before now. If its for an engine malfunction then that too is just life. Engines have a "life" and that should be `x`(usually a very big number) now this brings us back to the original point of the wonder jet as `jx` is a very very small number (see what I did).
Anyway rumour is the bean counters cant find a straightforward way of financing J`s for C-17`s so the whole lot are off on arrival of the truly amazing(cardboard) A400.
Why are you always broken in wiltshire? I think there is a disparity between ambition and ability amongst senior soupdragons in SW UK . Now you jelly bellied bonehead (now thats rude!) take a deep breath, look around (maybe outside your office/building/Station/Service) and try to form an adult opinion and not just throw cack . I tell you its C-17,A400,FSTA and.......super MR4 ..oh here we go again :ok:

[LunchMonitor]

Lets move away from the secret airbase in Wilts and see how our colonial bretheren are coping with the J glider then shall we?

http://www.defence.gov.au/news/armynews/editions/1073/topstories/story07.htm

Where it says about the J(amongst other things):

“It’s had some untrue rumours spread about it, but it’s proven to be as capable, if not more capable, than previous models,”

"the new Hercules’ reduced crew, from six in an H-Model down to four in the J-Model had not reduced the aircraft’s effectiveness"

“I actually find the J-Model better than the older models, with reduced crew and computer-generated air-release-point, [which has] proven to be more consistently accurate.”

“It’s a good aircraft, it’s a viable aircraft and it’s a safe aircraft to jump from so it offers us another squadron, with another capability that we can utilise very effectively.”

So perhaps our problems with the J are self induced ?

[Always_broken_in_wilts]

Mr LOX,
Pretty much as predicted...................civvie's eh:rolleyes:

all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced

[Noble Lox]

Your biting wit has us all falling off our pay packets....ho ho how we laughed.
Is that the best you can do?
Pop down to stores and see if they can exchange your blinkers for a brain.
Now about these engines....

:ok:

[Always_broken_in_wilts]

:sad: Yawn......OK No Bolox to answer your question it seems the problem is bad but not as bad as first thought. Been away from work for a few days but read an email this morning saying we are looking to fly a set airspeed which is quicker than LRC. So the claims of faster, further and higher still ring true but just not as true as first claimed.:p

Now are there any miltary folks in here with opinions on this subject?

all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced

wonder what the civvie twerp will come back with next :ok: