.QUOTE

My point was they seem to cancel UK domestics where traveling by rail to CDG,AMS, BRU, LYS, NCE is much shorter by rail than some UK domestics

Actually not exactly true all the times, given the frequency of some short haul routes and passenger numbers quickly building up.

Some of these high value J and F fares will connect to short haul so may be disgruntled and untrusting of BA

My point was they cancel domestics where as CDG, AMS, BRU, LYS, NCE can be reached by tail much quicker than ABZ or INV

The good and the bad of BA in one day.

Was due to fly BHD - LHR - IST in business on Tuesday morning. Early departure from home and when on the train to meet my daughter, who was taking us the last little bit to BHD, I turned on my phone. Up comes a message, flight from BHD cancelled. We were re-booked from 9.45 to 1545, with a new connection out of Lhr to IST at 18.20. Of course, the 15.45 was delayed by just over one hour, we parked on stand at Lhr at 18.00. Missed connection. Went to the flight connection desk in T5 to see what was happening and when we gave our name, the lady behind the counter handed us two C class tickets for a Turkish Airlines flight at 22.30. Ok we had a long day, as we landed in IST at about 3.45am on Wednesday, with a connection at 6.20, but apart from being tired, we didn't suffer much harm. What did impress us was the fact that we had been re-booked without even having to ask. Why can't they be that good all the time?

Rebooking in that fashion only came about due to last minute panic and decision at high level to try and avoid some of the repeat inevitable fall out. When, as you say, it should always have been like that. So predictable and relatively easily improved/implemented

I bet Alex Cruz would never have done it.

I expect that you have seen this from the USA, what chance here?
Almost $1m Fine over Covid refunds

'Slightly longer' - what an absolute joke. These people were unable to get through to BA for MONTHS. Their fine should be doubled for saying that.

BA said the only route to refunds was to contact this non-existent call centre. Nothing through the website or anything else.

We were booked at the same time with Jet2. We got an email saying that flights were cancelled and they were arranging full refunds to everyone, and apologised for it looking like taking up to a month. Three weeks on, and our money just turned up back from Jet2 in our account. We didn't have to do anything.

QF seem to be working hard and progressing with Project Sunrise ready for when the A350-10's arrive. Why Can't BA who have these aircraft look at a similar project? They could be a leader in this field.

BA have gradually been cutting the destinations they serve in Australia - it's not a core market for them.

Once SQ started it chopped big chunks out of the potential market. The rise of the ME airlines (flying from UK regional airports) has hammered the flow eastbound via LHR for BA.

There is a small market for direct flights to Australia - and Qantas will fill it as they have the onward connections (and the Loyalty Programme) at the east end .

TBH there aren't many really profitable routes out of London that require such long non-stop flights.

Regarding refunds, flight changes. I've had no issue with BA, flights to The US & Europe either changed with no fees and refunds processed in a few days during the pandemic. Yes, it took a while to get through but that can only be expected. People seem to forget that airport, airline staff go sick and office based staff, such as the call centre staff, were under the same working restrictions as others. Other airlines l had to correspond with such as a well known Middle Eastern carrier weren't so easy to deal with despite having a dedicated number etc and being a top tier 'guest'.

I think that BA will always serve Sydney in some shape or form - other cities will be served direct by Qantas towards the end of the decade

Jet2 put most other airlines to shame. No wonder they are doing so well.

I live in Western Australia. We used to have ( I am talking 30 years ago now), a daily BA service to London via Singapore. In my younger years , I flew on it many times in Club, upstairs on the 747. ( although if I remember correctly, some 74,s had Y class up stairs). Anyway, used to be my favourite way to get to Europe, when I was working there and “ commuting” from WA.

I think you are right. BA had the chance to drop it after the pandemic but as soon as they were able to, they reinstated the flight.

Goldeneye
BA I believe is the only European airline operating to Sydney, and probably Australia now. The ME 3 and Singapore Airline have demolished BA on the routes to Australia and indeed NZ.

Cheers
Mr Mac

thought it was now a profitable predictable operation for them now with no need to consider any alteration?

Even QANTAS are picky - Adelaide for example is almost always via Sydney or Melbourne these days - much easier to get SQ (or Emirates pre Covid) via SIN

Not strictly they will send you via Singapore and on to London on the big bus west, to Perth to connect to the 789 or via Dubai on their partner and from their to almost all major airports in the EU and UK Qantas on Emirates is a massive revenue capacity and network driver for the kangaroo!!!!

I don't think BA will follow Qantas with Ultra Long Haul flights given it would require a small sub fleet of aircraft and BA & IAG's inherent cautiousness with capital expenditure.

BA could have pre-empted Qantas launching Perth non-stop with the 787 if they wanted to.

It is a safe assumption that BA will stick with Sydney - even though dropping it would free up long haul aircraft it desperately needs.

Given the prices I was quoted last year they must do well out of it - you'd have to be crazy to fly BA (or QANTAS) on that route

The SYD is only a 789 these days, very much a token. When we went a few years ago, had SQ all the way in PE on 380 and was brilliant.

Think thats a deliberate ploy rather than an after-thought. Very fuel efficient, includes a F cabin (which a lot now don’t) and reasonable cargo. Is seasonally even a 777-300ER. And was now profitable.

I have just been talking to a rather unhappy BA Gold Card member who turned up to fly LHR to Palma and flight was cancelled,when checking in. They offered a flight the following day to Minorca and that was the best they could do.

She subsequently re booked with EasyJet and flew Gatwick to Palma the following day.

Unbeknown to her she was sat next to a BA pilot, who after she had told her tail of woe to, produced his phone and showed the screen for BA operation which he said he should not do, but he said everything coloured Blue, BA had no crew for and these flights would be cancelled. The lady said there were pages of them !!

I think BA need to come clean, as she said looking into July and August she for sees plenty of unhappy passengers and stressed employees.

Cheers
Mr Mac

Just had this very conversation with a serving pilot. Frequent requests from the company to cover trips but already working to the max so unable.

Wonder how the pay negotiations are doing :rolleyes:​​​​​​​

Etops
They obviously have a big issue and you would think that a management team would realise this and have some contingency plan in place rather than trying to muddle through ie cancel now not when people are checking in.

I have not used BA for along time,partly due to this type of management, though Mrs Mac informs me we have lots of BA air miles through AMEX though I have queried why we would use them, given their issues even for free.

Cheers
Mr Mac

It’s not just BA with this problem, lots of airlines haven’t enough crew to operate schedules incl TUI Lufthansa etc

I had a school group of 68 booked and paid to BA travelling 02 July LHR to FCO
Yesterday BA cancelled their flight, no reason given, no alternative offered.
fortunately it is within 14 days, so we have rebooked our group on alternative flights, and will now try and obtain all the costs and EU261 from a really very disappointing airline.
BA are just a disappointment !

SC
I have had an issue earlier this year with Lufthansa, but they changed my flight time by 12 hrs and rerouted me, but at least they got me there, not just cancelled and or offered to be flown to a different island !!

They are doing this in a planned way as confirmed by others above so they know they are going to do it already why disappoint people literally as they board as in the ladies case or just before departure as in the case above.

It’s just awful management, and shoving the problem down to the ground staff and CC when they have had little control of this is dodging the issue.

It’s just wrong on so many levels and BA has been heading this way for a number of years but the buffers look to be in sight so time for some drastic action. You can’t fly planes without A/C or crew so time to make your schedule fit your resources and not bury your head in the sand.
Cheers
Mr Mac

I think it's common corporate practice in many industries for senior management to push problems around under resourcing to junior staff. I don't think British Airways or the airline industry is in any way unique at its tendency to do this.

Last summer BA were under resourced. It was only when the CAA wrote a stroppy public letter that BA (or Easyjet) started to ensure what they were selling matched operational resource capabilities.

DJ6
If the lists come to pass which seems evident they will then never mind last summer they appear to be in the same position and not learned anything from last year’s experience.

You cannot run a full flying schedule without the required aircraft and crew and support staff to go with it. If you have only enough resources to run 2/3rd of your schedule for example, then then that is what you have to do , not just ignore it and hope it doesn’t come to pass. An old saying is failure to plan is to plan to fail and this saga smacks of it.

Cheers
Mr Mac

It’s notable that Sean Doyle, after being put forward for media interviews to sell a positive vision for the airline, seems to have largely disappeared from view.

Maybe there is work going on in the background with the new Ops Director but the public will be unforgiving of another summer of disruption.

I do recall from long ago that the CAA was absolutely hot on scheduled carriers, at least UK ones, operating what they had timetabled and sold. It was always an ops concern that they had to do so, as they could be pulled up for "not having the resources to run their scheduled operation". There were cancellations for weather etc, but the CAA were no slouches at spotting just what was a real weather issue, and what was just ops convenience. In case of shortage, carriers would need to charter in to cover services, even those carrying just a handful. I seem to recall an account of one day an F27-sized service having been covered by a 737 hired in from Europe. In particular there was scrutiny of cancellations just done for low passenger loads - you had to have zero bookings both ways to get away with that one.

Somehow this was all just lost, and now it seems carriers can do what they like without any comeback.

Flight prices
 

Looking at flight prices to Naples from London towards the end of July. easyJet coming up around £600 for 3 people, Ryanair around £700, British Airways? £3000! Now I get that you can't always compare flight prices in isolation and I understand that it's a peak travelling period due to school holidays but who is paying these prices for an Economy Basic fare out of LHR?? Are they priced to stop people from booking with them to ease passenger numbers? Be interested to hear people's opinions

I guess that’s my point, surely they’d at least be flying Economy Plus or Business (which was around £5k)rather than Economy Basic

The people with that sort of money will have fancy BA Amex cards anyway..

Customers demand that an economy basic fare be offered in addition to an economy plus fare. I don't believe BA ever guaranteed that the economy basic fare would be cheap in absolute terms - the only requirement is that that the economy basic fare would cost less than the economy plus fare.
On 24-July, flying LHR-NAP one way mid-morning, your choice (per person) is
Economy basic £761
Economy plus £794
Business - £1,108.
BA have done their bit in offering you a choice of different fare families to suit your needs. It seems unfair to blame an airline for providing more choice instead of doing what other airlines sometimes do - namely marking the economy basic fare as "sold out" and allowing sales of only economy plus and business fares.
If BA set the price on the same Heathrow-Naples flight as Economy Basic - £261, Economy Plus - £794, then many passengers would just send their suitcase by separate courier and pay only for Economy Basic - and BA as a company seeking to make a profit for shareholders would lose potential fare revenue

"Freedom of choice" means you pay just for what you need/want and thus potentially "cheaper". "Freedom of choice" does not necessarily mean "cheap"
If instead you seek "cheap" and don't want to pay £761 for a one-way LHR-Naples, you may prefer to fly out of LHR mid-afternoon on the same date at a less popular time for £266 in Economy Basic and save yourself £496 per person. Or if cost of a basic fare is the only thing that matters to you, fly Stansted-Naples with Ryanair on the same day in the afternoon for £132.

On 24-July, there are 10 flights at different times of day from 4 London-area airports to Naples, offered by 5 different, reputable and independent airlines - BA, Easyjet, Jet2, Ryanair and TUI, with different levels of cusomer service. As a formally trained economist, it looks to me like a competitive market that is functioning well, albeit with a high level of customer demand for travel on 24-July.

Travelled on Euroflyer yesterday. Grim is an understatement and will not be repeated.

Passengers near me and including me all positively compared RYR as a much better customer experience. Who’d have thought it.

​​​​​​​Announcement due tomorrow.

Oddly I know some well off folk who really object to shelling out for PE etc on short haul - anything under 4 hours they're happy to suffer in the back if the upgrade has to come out of their pocket .