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PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)
-   Airlines, Airports & Routes (https://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes-85/)
-   -   TUI Airways (https://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes/600845-tui-airways.html)

compton3bravo 11th Oct 2019 10:09
Noticed all the extra capacity is in the Midlands, North and Scotland nothing in the South where some slots maybe available at Gatwick, or the West Country. Comments please.

rog747 11th Oct 2019 10:15
EXT, BRS CWL all had TCX/MT IT flights - I gather CWL was summer only - not sure if EXT was the same, and EXT had no based TCK a/c there so I have been told)

Whether TUI/TOM will pick up the TCX slack at these airports remains to be seen, but TUI have used 3rd party airlines such as Alba Star Freebird and Norwegian to fly their packages for a few years to some destinations.

ROC10 11th Oct 2019 11:16
Originally Posted by rog747 (Post 10591856)
EXT, BRS CWL all had TCX/MT IT flights - I gather CWL was summer only - not sure if EXT was the same, and EXT had no based TCK a/c there so I have been told)

Whether TUI/TOM will pick up the TCX slack at these airports remains to be seen, but TUI have used 3rd party airlines such as Alba Star Freebird and Norwegian to fly their packages for a few years to some destinations.
TCX certainly didn’t have an aircraft based at EXT so I’m guessing they must’ve just sold holidays on TOM flights.

rog747 11th Oct 2019 15:10
Originally Posted by ROC10 (Post 10591917)


TCX certainly didn’t have an aircraft based at EXT so I’m guessing they must’ve just sold holidays on TOM flights.
Methinks my mistake about TCX having an EXT a/c - I think that was a while back - apologies

MerchantVenturer 11th Oct 2019 19:25
Thomas Cook at CWL was a single aircraft A321 summer base with no winter service, which has been the case for a number of years, although until a year or so ago it was an A320.

BRS was 3 x A321 in summer although for part of the summer one of the 321s was replaced by a 320 in a pre-planned move. In winter BRS was a single A321 base.

As has been said, EXT had no Thomas Cook presence.

Thomas Cook was handling around 500,000 passenger journeys annually at BRS so some scope there for other carriers/tour companies if they have a mind.

liam4393 12th Oct 2019 09:56
Wondering if the more 757’s are now getting another stay of execution given TCX situation? Dummy booking (I think!) shows GLA has a 757 based again next summer. When I tried to book previously on that same route, appeared to be 737.

pabely 12th Oct 2019 10:09
Originally Posted by liam4393 (Post 10592559)
Wondering if the more 757’s are now getting another stay of execution given TCX situation? Dummy booking (I think!) shows GLA has a 757 based again next summer. When I tried to book previously on that same route, appeared to be 737.
Two 757 are leased in to help cover Max issues, the other 9 757 were due to be retired this winter but that plan is now on indefinite hold. I assume some of these frames would have found their way to freight operators after conversions, but must now be a headache for them as well.

VickersVicount 12th Oct 2019 12:48
to replace TCX capacity GLA would need more than the TUI 757 again (it already had 1x 757 returned S19 instead of planned 2x 737). 2x757 would only be back to where they were year before. Would need an extra based to 3+ to make any gains/impact

ROC10 12th Oct 2019 23:09
Originally Posted by liam4393 (Post 10592559)
Wondering if the more 757’s are now getting another stay of execution given TCX situation? Dummy booking (I think!) shows GLA has a 757 based again next summer. When I tried to book previously on that same route, appeared to be 737.
Just out of curiosity, how did you manage to get to a seat map for a S20 booking? Pretty sure TUI’s seat maps only become available much closer to the departure date. Unless there’s some other way you’re able to tell the aircraft type but TUI don’t put it on their website. I’m also doubtful they’ll have finalised plans for GLA as I’d imagine they’d certainly be more than slightly hopeful that the MAX will be there next summer.

liam4393 13th Oct 2019 06:25
Originally Posted by ROC10 (Post 10593012)


Just out of curiosity, how did you manage to get to a seat map for a S20 booking? Pretty sure TUI’s seat maps only become available much closer to the departure date. Unless there’s some other way you’re able to tell the aircraft type but TUI don’t put it on their website. I’m also doubtful they’ll have finalised plans for GLA as I’d imagine they’d certainly be more than slightly hopeful that the MAX will be there next summer.
You can tell by the number of extra legroom seats available to book. 757’s will have 18 seats at the most (being rows 8, 10 and 11 A-F) whereas 737’s including the MAX as far as I’m aware have 9 seats at the most (can’t remember the specific seats, but 3 rows D-F). The dummy bookings I did came up with extra legrooms seats of between 12 and 15 seats available. Note these are not the ‘Seats with Extra Space’ which are the emergency exit rows on TUI.

GAXLN 13th Oct 2019 06:34
Originally Posted by compton3bravo (Post 10591850)
Noticed all the extra capacity is in the Midlands, North and Scotland nothing in the South where some slots maybe available at Gatwick, or the West Country. Comments please.
They have sent a clear and early message to jet2.com as to their intentions in the north. Decision now for jet2.com as to what capacity they add and where. TUI probably hoping that it will influence jet2.com’s plans for capacity increases (i.e. moderate). Risk for TUI is that it may prompt the opening of new bases elsewhere as others have suggested so that they don’t have their own way in the south or will TUI be left to fight it out with easyJet holidays. Interesting times indeed for the UK holiday market as to what summer 20 eventually looks like and especially if pound continues to recover.

ROC10 13th Oct 2019 11:49
Originally Posted by liam4393 (Post 10593139)


You can tell by the number of extra legroom seats available to book. 757’s will have 18 seats at the most (being rows 8, 10 and 11 A-F) whereas 737’s including the MAX as far as I’m aware have 9 seats at the most (can’t remember the specific seats, but 3 rows D-F). The dummy bookings I did came up with extra legrooms seats of between 12 and 15 seats available. Note these are not the ‘Seats with Extra Space’ which are the emergency exit rows on TUI.
Normally I’d agree with that logic, however, I happen to flying on a TUI flight from EDI in December (should be MAX but will be 738 if issues not resolved) and thus have access to the seat map. As can be seen from the image, the 738/MAX now seems to have 21 Extra Leg Room seats on top of the 12 Extra Space seats.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....5d77f325a.jpeg

Cazza_fly 13th Oct 2019 14:37
Originally Posted by ROC10 (Post 10593338)


Normally I’d agree with that logic, however, I happen to flying on a TUI flight from EDI in December (should be MAX but will be 738 if issues not resolved) and thus have access to the seat map. As can be seen from the image, the 738/MAX now seems to have 21 Extra Leg Room seats on top of the 12 Extra Space seats.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....5d77f325a.jpeg
Presumably this is due to the narrower toilets installed at the rear, enabling the rear section seats (aft of the overwing exits) to be pushes further back towards them. Hence then allowing a couple of extra rows with 2-3 extra inches of legroom...

ROC10 13th Oct 2019 18:49
Originally Posted by Cazza_fly (Post 10593424)
Presumably this is due to the narrower toilets installed at the rear, enabling the rear section seats (aft of the overwing exits) to be pushes further back towards them. Hence then allowing a couple of extra rows with 2-3 extra inches of legroom...
Is that specific to the MAX? Meaning that if the 738 is subbed in (certainly will be for part of, if not all of, W19) these will not actually be Extra Legroom seats?

Or have the 738s been modified (or in the process of being modified)?

Cazza_fly 13th Oct 2019 18:54
Originally Posted by ROC10 (Post 10593555)


Is that specific to the MAX? Meaning that if the 738 is subbed in (certainly will be for part of, if not all of, W19) these will not actually be Extra Legroom seats?

Or have the 738s been modified (or in the process of being modified)?
No 738s have been modified. It's also caused issues with pax already this summer on flights that were planned to be on MAXs but now on 738s. It's actually a poor idea of TOM not to have had exactly the same cabin layouts to avoid that issue alone.

ROC10 13th Oct 2019 19:11
Originally Posted by Cazza_fly (Post 10593558)
No 738s have been modified. It's also caused issues with pax already this summer on flights that were planned to be on MAXs but now on 738s. It's actually a poor idea of TOM not to have had exactly the same cabin layouts to avoid that issue alone.
I can certainly imagine that being problematic – common sense would suggest to sell all with 738 layout and offer upgrades later but they’ll have their reasoning.

So I think this probably suggests that the above rumour around GLA having a 757 again next year is probably not true and that the additional extra legroom seats simply confirm what we know – GLA is planned to be a MAX-only base (as it was for S19). Of course, GLA may see the 1x738 and 1x757 arrangement again next year as it did this year; however this seems unlikely, especially if CPEV and OOBG are to be wfu this winter as has been suggested previously. I’d imagine LGW/MAN/BHX will probably have priority with 757s next year, with GLA and BRS probably each losing their final 757 in the next few weeks (757s were not even meant to be based at either base this summer).

LBAflyer22 13th Oct 2019 21:11
Originally Posted by GAXLN (Post 10593141)
They have sent a clear and early message to jet2.com as to their intentions in the north. Decision now for jet2.com as to what capacity they add and where. TUI probably hoping that it will influence jet2.com’s plans for capacity increases (i.e. moderate). Risk for TUI is that it may prompt the opening of new bases elsewhere as others have suggested so that they don’t have their own way in the south or will TUI be left to fight it out with easyJet holidays. Interesting times indeed for the UK holiday market as to what summer 20 eventually looks like and especially if pound continues to recover.
They may have sent a message but if i was in the board room of Jet2 i'm sure i wouldn't be as worried as the other way. Why? Well Jet2 has no new aircraft orders (unlike TUI which has the no-fly MAX). Thet sounds odd however they don't build orders into fleet plan, like TUI, for them not to be delivered to suddenly scramble to the ACMI market or cancel and consolidate. On top of this - Jet2 already has established relationship with ACMI operators Air Tanker (lead to believe 3 A330 in MAN next year), Titan (3 A321 in STN this year, could easily probably grow that number and add them elsewhere in the network) and SmartLynx. As well as other operators - Air Europa (previous) and for a short period of time this month Evelop. They also like going into the used market and have been effective with this. TUI yet to do this.

TUI have a more difficult few months ahead over Jet2 due to the fleet. They spread themselves everywhere but thinly with the fleet and unable to compete on frequencies with Jet2 from regional airports (look at NCL-DLM for example of Jet2 5 v TUI 3, NCL-TFS Jet2 5 v TUI 2). TUI have advised they are adding 2,000,000 extra seats - i'm waiting with baited breath to find out where, to where, how many. This is what makes me also hold with baited breath - they've said put a lot into the press release with no evidence. Jet2 do the other way round, do the work, evidence it with flights on sale & in the timetable and then the press release.

737James 14th Oct 2019 10:24
I had an interesting catch up on Saturday with some ex colleagues that are now at BHX with TUI , We was talking about the TCX situation at Birmingham and the drop in capacity for the summer. They have said that they have heard that BHX is due to be getting at least one 787 for short haul in summer 20. They have been told that at present they are planning two 757s at BHX the rest being 738 or Max’s if get required clearance. Another thing that they mentioned was about in flight WIFI being installed on all the fleet this winter not sure if any other crew have heard this. Personally I am not sure about this as would have thought that Tui would be using this in their advertising as its selling tool against Jet2

ROC10 14th Oct 2019 10:44
Originally Posted by 737James (Post 10593986)
I had an interesting catch up on Saturday with some ex colleagues that are now at BHX with TUI , We was talking about the TCX situation at Birmingham and the drop in capacity for the summer. They have said that they have heard that BHX is due to be getting at least one 787 for short haul in summer 20. They have been told that at present they are planning two 757s at BHX the rest being 738 or Max’s if get required clearance. Another thing that they mentioned was about in flight WIFI being installed on all the fleet this winter not sure if any other crew have heard this. Personally I am not sure about this as would have thought that Tui would be using this in their advertising as its selling tool against Jet2
I think the WiFi is already on the MAXs right? Would seem silly to install this on the 757/767 and possibly older 738s but I guess it would be a good opportunity to install it on the newer aircraft, especially the 787s where it should definitely be.

Yeehaw22 14th Oct 2019 11:21
It's not wifi internet. It's just an onboard network. No internet access and was being trialled on a couple of the max aircraft.


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