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-   -   Heathrow-2 (https://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes/599818-heathrow-2-a.html)

Skipness One Echo 23rd Feb 2018 20:55

There’s a whole thread.

https://www.pprune.org/airlines-airp...rt-london.html

DaveReidUK 23rd Feb 2018 21:53

Several, in fact.

Including one started by the poster who is asking the question:

PPRuNe: Another runway at Heathrow

4Greens 26th Feb 2018 19:49

Third runway at Heathrow
 
Have been reading the report which is many pages long. Am interested in readers views on steeper approaches using a 3.2 degree glideslope to reduce noise. It doesnt seem very much to me and can it be used in some form of instrument approach ?

Vokes55 26th Feb 2018 20:14

The problem with a steeper glide path is that depending on the aircraft type, conditions, and - quite frankly - the pilot's energy management skills, it can often be more difficult to control the speed of the aircraft, something which is of particular importance to Heathrow and Gatwick arrivals.

It would almost certainly result in more speed brake on approach, more early gear extension and, as a result, more noise. Counterproductive.

Trinity 09L 26th Feb 2018 20:29

HAL are lauding the CDA as a success. On the small Airbus gear is down later than 6 miles.
On the heavies and super heavies they stick to the norm.

DaveReidUK 26th Feb 2018 21:31


Originally Posted by 4Greens (Post 10066018)
It doesn't seem very much to me

On the contrary, it appears to be almost twice as steep as a 3 approach :O


https://www.heathrow.com/file_source...ic_468x269.png

Slightly steeper approach trial update


Originally Posted by 4Greens (Post 10066018)
can it be used in some form of instrument approach ?

In theory the ILS/MLS could have been adjusted to the steeper angle, but that would have required all landing traffic to make use of it. Instead, a 3.2 RNAV approach was created for use by the airlines participating in the trial.

PAXboy 27th Feb 2018 18:00

I wonder if the folks whose S/H rotations are being canx this week, have considered the diff if we had R3 ... :hmm:

[I'll get my hat] {AND coat as it's dashed parky today}

Mr Mac 28th Feb 2018 07:51

PAXBOY
BA always cancel short haul first, what ever the reason. A bus up the M6 to MAN after a long haul flight is one of the reasons I no longer use BA or LHR. I think other northern based FF may also have a similar view. -6c up here today but still got out to office,though a bit lonely as gritters in this part of West Yorkshire appear to be a bit hens teeth like today, 4x4 very useful for going up hill even if just a big toboggan going down if not careful !

DaveReidUK 28th Feb 2018 11:45


Originally Posted by Mr Mac (Post 10067813)
PAXBOY
BA always cancel short haul first, what ever the reason.

Though not exclusively - according to thebasource.com, yesterday's cancellations also included LAX and JFK rotations.

But it's true that most of the canx were short-haul, affecting the following LHR routes:

ABZ, AMS, ARN, BRU, BSL, CDG, CPH, DME, DUB, DUS, EDI, FRA, GLA, GVA, HAM, LBA, LIN, MAD, MAN, MUC, NCL, OSL, TLS, TXL and ZRH

destinationsky 28th Feb 2018 11:56


Originally Posted by DaveReidUK (Post 10066111)
On the contrary, it appears to be almost twice as steep as a 3 approach :O


https://www.heathrow.com/file_source...ic_468x269.png

Slightly steeper approach trial update



In theory the ILS/MLS could have been adjusted to the steeper angle, but that would have required all landing traffic to make use of it. Instead, a 3.2 RNAV approach was created for use by the airlines participating in the trial.

Incorrect - the ILS could not have been adjusted as the glide slope would physically need to be moved to accommodate the extra angle. Some aircraft utilising LHR at the time of the initial trial were also not certified to fly above a 3.15 angle. You are also unable to offer CATIII approaches over 3.15 so resilience would take a hit. The RNAV was the best option and allowed HAL to keep a CATIII approach in place for resilience

DaveReidUK 28th Feb 2018 12:09


Originally Posted by destinationsky (Post 10068076)
Incorrect - the ILS could not have been adjusted as the glide slope would physically need to be moved to accommodate the extra angle. Some aircraft utilising LHR at the time of the initial trial were also not certified to fly above a 3.15 angle. You are also unable to offer CATIII approaches over 3.15 so resilience would take a hit. The RNAV was the best option and allowed HAL to keep a CATIII approach in place for resilience

Er, yes - that's why I said "in theory", with the caveat that it wouldn't have been practicable for a variety of reasons. :O

destinationsky 28th Feb 2018 12:50

Anything is possible "in theory" :-)

Trinity 09L 28th Feb 2018 15:32

Clapham
 
In Clapham they have more to worry about the noise of emergency vehicles darting around 24/7, and if they looked up they take there eye of the ball watching out for robbers on scooters and rogue cyclists

Navpi 7th Mar 2018 20:35

https://amp.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/ryanair-boss-attacks-heathrow-expansion-cost-36675472.html?__twitter_impression=true

Navpi 11th Mar 2018 10:24

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/uk-australia-non-stop-flight-qantas-airlines-16-hours-double-price-travel-a7704616.html?amp&__twitter_impression=true

118.70 11th Mar 2018 21:11

It's rather like the pic that Heathrow are putting out to give the impression that plane emissions don't affect anywhere outside the airport boundary


https://t.co/lNJRVyP948
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DX60nmZX4AA66BS.jpghttps://pbs.twimg.com/media/DX60nmZX4AA66BS.jpghttp://

Trinity 09L 11th Mar 2018 23:38

In fig 2 above, which particular aircraft does that departure.Half the runway used and a steep climb on full power? If it is westbound what are all those large buildings to the west?

Heathrow Harry 12th Mar 2018 16:33

New York.................

Skipness One Echo 12th Mar 2018 16:38

An A320 would be around 1500 ft crossing the fenceline on climbout according to fr24.
The buildings just represent buildings, the larger buildings to the west would be Slough.

Seljuk22 12th Mar 2018 18:09

Hainan will launch trice weekly Changsha service with B788 eff. 23rd March

Tianjin Airlines (plans) to launch twice weekly Tianjin-Xian-LHR service with A332 eff. 7th May


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