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-   -   Jet2 4 (https://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes/466290-jet2-4-a.html)

paully 4th Sep 2014 16:18

Lighty..if you beleive that and truely, you aint no lawyer.............The real ones, worldwide are making a lot of money out of stuff written on the internet....Shed is right..

Tip..might be a good idea to delete your comment before the MODS have a word

HOODED 4th Sep 2014 16:25

Lighty89. With due respect "Death Trap" is a strong statement. An old car can be called such even if it has a valid MOT. Jet2 maintain their aircraft to CAA standards and they all have C of As. Yes they have an old fleet and as a result more tech issues, but Death Traps....Really? Feel free to shoot me down. I am not a lawyer just an Aircraft engineer with a PPL. You are entitled to your opinion and I mine but I feel I may know a little more about flight safety than you.

Lighty89 4th Sep 2014 16:27

Yes I know I understand it was a strongly worded statement. One which I thought I was entitled to express on this forum, as Internet forums are usually for debate - obviously not this one.

This is not an area of law which I have a great knowledge in, so I will take notice of the "warnings" that have been given.

The post has since been deleted.

ATNotts 4th Sep 2014 16:48

Balair


ATNotts,

Two of your quotes;

"I ask, it is really wise to fan the flames of "bad publicity", putting Monarch employee's jobs at risk? Personally I consider it bad form, and something that we shouldn't be indulging in in these forums."

"Is this the second or third time this season that Jet2 has closed EMA's runway?
They are going to have to watch themselves, else the national press will get hold of the story, and that could have consequences. I suppose that because Jet2 don't serve London, they aren't that interested though!"

It seems your concerns for airline's employees are rather selective...!
I would take issue with you.

The stuff being put around about Monarch is for the most part half truths and conjecture that could put jobs at risk.

The incident yesterday with Jet2 was FACT, and as I feared the National Press, and BBC are coming forward with barmy reports that won't do Jet2, or, sadly, their employees any good. This isn't the first time that Jet2 has got into the news this year for what could be termed safety related issues. It doesn't take me to put employees jobs at risk, the bad luck (and hopefully it is just bad luck) that Jet2 have suffered has done it on it's own.

Shed-on-a-Pole 4th Sep 2014 17:15

Lighty89 - Yes, we're all allowed to express an opinion ("free speech"). What we're not allowed to do is libel others ("break the law"). As a lawyer, I'd expect you to be familiar with that concept. And the law applies generally, not just to this particular forum.

As for your "I know what you said is unfounded" (referring to me), please enlighten me. Which bit of my posting is "unfounded" and why?

rudolf 4th Sep 2014 18:41


Jet2 G-GDFP, 737-800 just diverted from over the English Channel into Stansted
on emergency 7700. Glasgow - Reus.
Medical emergency.

tophat27dt 4th Sep 2014 18:50

medical emergency?
 
How do you know that? If I was suffering cardiac arrest at 38000 i would prefer to be put down in Jersey rather than Stansted!!

rudolf 4th Sep 2014 18:52

Who said cardiac arrest?

737-800 into Jersey, good luck!

mikeygd 4th Sep 2014 19:19

LS121 was reported as a medical emergency. Presumably the time taken to descend from 38000 to anywhere meant Stansted was a sensible choice, even though they were over the channel at the time.

It's now back on its way. Flightradar24.com - Live flight tracker!

Mr Angry from Purley 4th Sep 2014 19:24

Jet 2 had a previous at EMA in June was over and done in about 15 mins no diversions needed.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/plane_...k/14367781375/

Check Mags On 4th Sep 2014 19:48

Light 89
 
Seems that EC-ISY is not as blessed as you may think.
I think it is also worth adding that with the very rigorous safety and reporting culture in the UK, NOTHING goes unreported.
I do not have the same confidence that countries outside our shorelines have the same culture.

Incident: Privilege Style B752 near Valencia on Nov 3rd 2008, navigation problems

LN-KGL 4th Sep 2014 20:42

Lighty89, pprune.org is a US based site and hence US laws are working here.

LNIDA, LN-NON is the oldest 737-800, but DY still has 9 737-300, all older than LN-NON, and the almost 25 year old wart hog LN-KKW is the oldest of the DY fleet. To link this to Jet2, LN-KKW is younger than all Jet2 G-CEL_ registered 737-300. All 737-300 in the DY fleet will be gone by the end of 2015 and in 2015 they only will have 5 737-300 in their fleet (all 4 leased 737-300 and 3 leased old 737-800 will be returned to lessor at the end of this year, among the three 737-800 is LN-NON).

LNIDA 4th Sep 2014 21:40

LN-KGL
 
Yes very much aware of the 300's as you say due to be phased out in late 14/15 but i was specifically referring to the NG fleet to support my assertion that as aircraft age they become less reliable, not unsafe of course, but its been said before sooner or later one of these events won't be handled correctly....

The press have already latched on to Jet2 incidents, it won't take long before the age of the airframes are in the red tops, yes BA operate some very old 400's out of LGW but they've had them and maintained them from new.

If you look at the ASL freighter (now scrapped) that shut EMA earlier in the year when the MLG leg detached, you are only ever a flight away from a PR nightmare, press don't give a stuff if its freighter, no human interest, no story, put a 148 on board different ball game.

VC10man 5th Sep 2014 09:14

I don't think BA has any 747 services from Gatwick.

I would sooner fly on an old BA 747 any day rather on a fifth hand old 737-300 on Jet2. I flew from Vancouver on a BA 747 which was taken out of service the next day. I felt sorry for the old girl, she seemed pretty good to me!!!

I can understand passengers getting frightened when they don't know what is happening. It is a disgrace that the tannoy was not working or even the megaphone, it just shows what the maintenance is like.

It is the same thing at airports when there is a delay, if only people were told the truth they wouldn't get so frustrated.

Johnny [email protected] Pants 5th Sep 2014 09:32


It is a disgrace that the tannoy was not working or even the megaphone, it just shows what the maintenance is like.
Be careful what you imply in what you write.

The PA failing to work was NOTHING to do with maintenance, it was related to the fault that caused the smoke/fumes, as were many of the other abnormalities during the event.

The 300's have 2 megaphones, one at the front and one at the rear, they are stowed in hat racks. They are checked every day for functionality. I can only surmise that with the passengers up and about and in the way the CC at the front couldn't access theirs, and the CC at the back didn't know what was occurring as he/she sits rearward facing and has a bulk-head between her and the cabin.

I'd also like to take umbrage at

It is the same thing at airports when there is a delay, if only people were told the truth they wouldn't get so frustrated.
Most people are given information when delays occur, sometimes it's best not to go into too much technical detail, and sometimes the detail isn't available. In addition many people don't listen to announcements so they think they've been left in the dark when they just haven't listened. And sometimes the original plan for the delay changes so passengers think that they have been led along, when actually they really haven't.

Little rant over, just remains to congratulate the crew for a job well done under very unusual circumstances:D

Alycidon 5th Sep 2014 10:00

VC10man
 
just a guess, but I think LNIDA was referring to the B737-400s which BA operate out of LGW and would certainly be more relevant to the thread

VC10man 5th Sep 2014 15:14

Alycidon thanks for that, my mistake!

Jonny FP if the passengers haven't been told what to do you can understand why they panic.

When I'm being served my drinks on a flight and the attendants have difficulty finding change and the drinks, I sometimes wonder how they would react in an emergency. I'm sure they are fully trained and would cope well, but I just wonder.

I've had to wait for a flight at a small and horrible Greek airport. All I want is information. If the flight is delayed 5 hours I could go out and have a meal. I do not expect them to tell me that the plane is very old and they have had to take bits of another! I wouldn't want to start worrying.

I.m not a Jet2 fan, I usually chose Thomson, Ryanair or Monarch. They have newish planes, I think some of Thomson's old 737-800s were sold to Jet2. But now Monarch are leaving my local airport, I might have to use them. I even used to go on Baby!

SWBKCB 5th Sep 2014 15:55


And sometimes the original plan for the delay changes so passengers think that they have been led along, when actually they really haven't.
Absolutely true - delays are often very dynamic events, with things changing by the minute (and usually just after you've given pax the latest update...)

TOM100 5th Sep 2014 15:57

I guess the difference is CC at some of the
LCCs and Charter might only get a day or two
service training and 3-4 weeks SEP and AvMed training.

Have you seen how much stuff is crammed into those trollies. A lot of the charters carry more boxes of stuff in the hold for the return.

All airlines 'rob' parts from other aircraft to try and maintain
schedule integrity especially if you don't have a replacement part immediately to hand and say the other aircraft is on a longer turnaround
allowing more time to get the new part.

Why not just swap to the serviceable aircraft ? Could be for a variety of reasons:- different engine ratings, different config of fuel tanks (some aircraft same type have additional tanks) , different configurations ! All airlines do it and as long as done correctly, perfect safe.

Two out of the three airlines you prefer I know do it regularly - I have no personal experience of FR.

Lighty89 5th Sep 2014 16:13

Jet2 in the news again today...

Travellers abandon Jet2 flight from Malaga after passenger sparks panic by taking photos | Mail Online

LNIDA 5th Sep 2014 16:27

You couldn't make this stuff up?????????whats wrong with these people?

taxi_driver 5th Sep 2014 17:28

AAIB have been upto East Mids to take a look, so I would guess a formal report into the incident/evacuation will be published in due course..

Shed-on-a-Pole 5th Sep 2014 18:05

We know it all happened on the runway!
 
I see that the cited Malaga flight was stranded "ON THE RUNWAY" for two hours according to the loons writing for the Daily Fail. The MEN also made the same error.

Just curious we know that journalists regularly trawl the pages of PPRuNe. Can one of you please explain why so many of your peers who make a living from writing seem incapable of understanding the simple word 'RUNWAY'. How technical do you think this word is? Most primary schoolkids know what a runway is! Have journalists lost all pride in maintaining basic professional standards?

Of course, if the commonly cited "on the runway" pieces were actually true we'd have some great stories! Not just the consequent mega-delays either. I personally loved the one in which the England squad returning home from the World Cup "disembarked on the runway". Now that would have been worth watching better box-office than the matches by far!

Seriously, journos, get a grip! There is NO EXCUSE for professional writers to misuse such a simple word.

paully 5th Sep 2014 19:32

Journos
 
Shed

The proper Journos, the ones that used to write professional stuff, were regarded as being too expensive and fired. In their place they hired wannabees who dreamed of having their names on a newspaper by line. The owners didnt care these kids could barely string two sentences together, let alone spell, but hey they were cheap :rolleyes:

Sadly too many parallels with aviation( and other professionals) for comfort..

Ivan aromer 5th Sep 2014 20:23

Jet2
 
Travellers abandon Jet2 flight from Malaga after passenger sparks panic by taking photos | Mail Online
What totally awful reporting. I don't think the title of journalism is relevant in this case.

INeedTheFull90 6th Sep 2014 11:56

Planes + 'won't somebody please think of the children' = your bread and butter mail online story.

People will do anything for their 15 minutes of twitter fame or to get their ugly mugs in a local rag.

Aluminium shuffler 6th Sep 2014 13:34

Where do you guys think the Tim Messenger character in Hot Fuzz came from? That is the standard of modern journalism. It's hardly worth reading or watching the news anymore - the accuracy is so poor and the agendas so driven than the reports bear scant comparison to reality.

Leeds Spotter 8th Sep 2014 14:49

Airbus A330 and Boeing 737 upgrades.
 
Both manufacturers stated at Farnborough they are now in a position to revamp 25 year old airframes. These will be fitted with new fuselage, new wings and new engines.
The whole package will be the 10th of the cost of a new plane with a 14% fuel improvement on todays aircraft.
Both manufactuers stated they will make more profit going down this route as against developing new generations of this series.
This would seem to encourage the business plan of Jet2 and be a logical way to increase the life of an airframe.
Both manufactuers saw only these two types as having the quantity flying necessary to put these plans in place.
Therefore we could in the next 25 years on this site have to either complain about a 50 year old airframe or check if it has had a revamp.
Both companies obviously have no issues putting their name and resources to encouraging airlines to keep them flying way passed todays old age.

DaveReidUK 8th Sep 2014 15:24

Do you understand anything at all about aircraft design, manufacture or certification?

Lighty89 8th Sep 2014 18:40

Seems they had some trouble today again.

http://s28.postimg.org/6sid3xfgd/image.jpg

BurtonSangalang 8th Sep 2014 19:50

Jet2 Malaga incident
 
The report is so factually incorrect, it makes one wonder how many facts in other fields of news are actually true!:ugh:

lagerlout 8th Sep 2014 20:32

delays
 
I dare say you could look up any reasonable sized airline any day during the summer and you will read about plenty of delays.....

Not really sure what the point is in posting the tweet?

Good job they had a standby to pick up the slack.

fa2fi 8th Sep 2014 20:36

I have a mate in Facebook (who rather scaringly is learning to do his PPL) got caught up in a delay on a BA flight with #BAsucks on his tweet. People, even those who should know better, turn to social media to whinge about anything. Take a look at McDonalds FB page to see what pathetic things people twist about. It doesn't matter who you are or what line of work you're in you're likely to get social media idiots having a go.

Lord Spandex Masher 8th Sep 2014 20:42


Originally Posted by lagerlout (Post 8647021)
Not really sure what the point is in posting the tweet?

Check his post history. Seems he's got a bit of a hard on for Jet2.

paully 9th Sep 2014 09:57

Ah yes the social meeja.........the exclusive preserve of over excited teenagers and spotty faced oiks...Its not much use for anything else:rolleyes:

SCANDIC 9th Sep 2014 17:58

One of the Monarch 75's is in it's way to Jet2 at the end of the summer.

Charlie98 9th Sep 2014 19:32

Do you have a source for this? Seems rather strange to be taking on more 757s at this stage!

CabinCrewe 9th Sep 2014 19:37

...at a great price, why would they not take another well loved 757 !

Charlie98 9th Sep 2014 20:25

Of course we want to see more! Maybe they should take the 10 we are loosing this winter! Seriously though, if this is true its a great development, would this mean NCL could keep a 75?

EK77WNCL 9th Sep 2014 22:14

All I can say is get in, glad to see some of the old birds living on!


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