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airforced 16th Feb 2013 08:24


extra legroom seats
I heard they are removing extra legroom seats due to a "sneak through" of legislation on APD from this crazy UK government.

Apparently extra leg room seats are now charged a higher APD rate (note 3):
HM Revenue & Customs: Rates of Air Passenger Duty

and see 2.5, lowest class of travel:
HM Revenue & Customs

The normal seats onboard would be charged APD at the reduced rate and the extra legroom seats would be at standard rate (as they are being marketed as a premium) placing an extra £63 tax on the seat! I doubt many people would want to pay an extra £63 in tax for extra legroom! Looks like they are going for the best option, to remove the extra legroom and maximize "normal seats" onboard to have one class charging APD at the reduced rate.

Another victory for business by this government, on top of EU261 from the great European Union http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...ies/wibble.gif

What are we doing; the UK would be better off without this government and out the EU, but that's another discussion, somewhere else!

obs
Sorry osbidian but that's a load of tosh. Nothing at all to do with APD. All Jet2 seats are economy irrespective of extra legroom or not and therefore the standard APD applies.

They are removing the extra legroom seats for two reasons. More bums on seats on their flights and a seemingly lack of take up for the extra legroom seats. Another reason I'm told is that their 757s are non-standard configuration which means if one goes tech (which they do every now and again) it makes life difficult when they come to swap them round. Standardizing the seating will help them get over such problems.

There are still some legroom seats but the majority are being removed gaining Jet2 about another six rows of seats on a 757 I'm told.

Don't believe everything you read on here (except this post obviously!)

MISTAKE: Not 6 rows of seats as shown above but 6 seats. Apologies.

brian_dromey 16th Feb 2013 09:27

I think there is a certain amount of truth in extra legroom seats attracting the higher rate of APD, depending on the exact interpretation of the legislation underlying the APD tax. I recall when BD scrapped "business class" and introduced "economy extra" (which was equivalent to business class in all but name) there was talk that "economy extra" should attract the higher rate of APD. I don't think it ever happened that the higher rate of APD was charged. The legislation does not speak of "cabins" per se but does refer to enhanced or upgraded levels of service, even within one cabin.

It may be that APD has nothing to do with the LS decision to remove extra legroom seats as Aer Lingus and easyJet certainly dont charge extra APD on their extra legroom seats.

TartinTon 16th Feb 2013 10:11

airforced, you're wrong on this one. All airlines who have added extra legroom seats whether they are designated economy or not are being pursued by HMRC.

The key phrase to note from HMRC is:

Note: If any selection criteria, for seating passengers in the premium cabin or seating, involves extra cost to the passenger for that benefit or the possibility of selection has been offered or advertised prior to the decision to select them, then the operator is deemed to have created more than one class of travel on that aircraft and those passengers are liable for APD at the standard rate.

i.e. if the airline charges extra for the legroom seat then the standard and not the lower rate applies in their eyes.

Some airlines are fighting it, clearly J2 has decided they're onto a hiding to nothing by taking on HMRC and have chosen to remove the seats.

All it will do is result in a poorer product on offer to the public thanks to HMRC.

I might add that they are looking to apply this retrospectively going back 6 years.......

mizake the mizzen 16th Feb 2013 13:32

B757
 
The maximum config on a B757 is 235 seats (design limit).
Jet2 B757s have 229 I believe.
Therefore they are adding 1 (one) row of 6 abreast. to bring the total to 235.
Extra leg room seats around the Emergency Exits (Doors 1,2 and 3) are obligatory to allow for rapid exit in an emergency.
I don't ever remember Thomson or Thomas Cook selling these Emergency exit extra leg room seats on their 757s with a higher APD charge (but I stand to be corrected).

BasilFawlty 16th Feb 2013 13:42

Max. on a 752 is 238, subject to the exit-configuration. Jet2 752's are currently in 224, 229 and 232 layouts, therefore everything will be standardised to 235.

peachair732 16th Feb 2013 17:53

Oh no! One of the reasons Iv taken Jet2 757s are because of the extra leg room over TCX and TOM 757s, I think its a mistake for Jet2 to go to cattle car charter config in the 757 but this move is not an unexpected one!

Any talk of fleet moderniasation? I think they are in the same position as TCX and TOM with the ageing 757 but then Jet2 have those 737-300s and some of the older 737-800s. Would be nice to see them ploughing a bit of their profit in to updating the fleet.

chaps2011 16th Feb 2013 18:30

Steadly flow of B738 joining fleet now but won`t be brand new as costs are far
to high for either leasing or buying and Jet2 have high summer usage but very low in winter

Chaps

bluepilot 16th Feb 2013 19:47

big difference between Jet2 and TOM/ TCX is the seat design, you get about 2" more legroom with the standard seat compared to other operators. so going back to 235 config now all the aircraft have them fitted is a good move.

CabinCrewe 17th Feb 2013 09:18

arent the newer style TOM Recaros (not ex FCA) identical to Jet 2 ?

Johnny [email protected] Pants 17th Feb 2013 09:33

Peachair 732
 
It's just the additional rows of extra legroom seats that are to be withdrawn, the seat pitch will remain the same and you won't notice any difference from previous Jet2 experiences in that respect, so you'll still have the space that you were expecting when you booked:ok:.

Mr @ Spotty M 17th Feb 2013 10:19

Johnny [email protected] Pants
 
Seat pitch is measured between two points on the seat, it is officially not measured between the seat attachment points.
That is why seat cushions are sculptured inward at the base of the seat back, it is not for comfort, but to meet regulations.
Once the seat attachment distance has been determined to meet that requirement, that is used for the configuration drawing (LOPA) which the engineers use for installing the seats.
So if a row of seats is added, as is in this case, the seat pitch will reduce in the removed area to match the rest of the aircraft.
You are correct in that you will get the seat pitch that you have booked.

bluepilot 18th Feb 2013 03:22

@cabincrewe,

No they are not the same.

LBIA 20th Feb 2013 13:58

Jet2ís Christmas Shopping trips to New York are now on sale. Flights will again be operating to Newark using Boeing 757's from Leeds/Bradford, East Midlands, Glasgow, Newcastle and new for this year 2x additional departures will be offered from Manchester.

East Midlands x1 = THU 14/11
Glasgow x1 = THU 14/11
Leeds/Bradford X2 = THU 05/12 & 12/12
Manchester x2 = THU 21/11 & 12/12
Newcastle x2 = THU 21/11 & 05/12

Ivan aromer 20th Feb 2013 19:47

New york.
 
the idea of going across the pond in a 757 with no IFE, seats that don't recline and food that at best is inedible. Not for my or mine thanks.

GAZMO 20th Feb 2013 19:54

New Jet2 route from BFS to Salzberg weekly on Saturday from Dec 2013

TSR2 20th Feb 2013 20:00


and food that at best is inedible
On our last three return flights with Jet2 we had booked in-flight meals and I have to say that we found the quality of the food to be excellent.

Ringwayman 21st Feb 2013 06:21

One wonders how people coped when 707s and DC8 were plying across the Atlantic back in the day. Nor even 727s and DC6s/DC7s. Are we now so molly-coddled that we need to have IFE to keep ourselves amused on journeys?

paully 21st Feb 2013 07:30

Ringwayman

You are so right. I can even remember the introduction of the 747-100 the first to show films on screens mounted on the walls of the centre galley and toilet block, but this is the Facebook generation who simply get bored when left to their own devices for more than 10 minutes :rolleyes:

airforced 21st Feb 2013 07:59


New york.
the idea of going across the pond in a 757 with no IFE, seats that don't recline and food that at best is inedible. Not for my or mine thanks.
In some respects I have to agree with you.

The Acro seats on Jet2 are abysmal in terms of comfort but the fact that they don't recline is a bonus. There's nothing worse than having your meal tray shoved in your face for hours on end with the plonker in front, who has subjected you to this discomfort, not really getting much benefit from reclining his seat anyway.

No IFE is also a bonus in my view.

Until last year I always sung the praises of the in flight meals provided by Jet2 but after a flight to HER and back I will join you in lambasting their offerings. They have tried to cut costs and increase profits (probably successfully) but the resulting product on offer isn't worth buying.

purplehelmet 21st Feb 2013 08:53

i thought jet2 had IFE on some of the longer routes? for a fee they had a small screen that hooked onto the seat in front. think it was £10 per flight.

fa2fi 21st Feb 2013 09:04

I'd happily put up with the lack of IFE and the seats. Anything is better than having to change planes and faff about. Besides most people have a personal means of playing media through their phones or tablets. And the return flight is overnight where I would be sleeping and not watching anything. I for one think its well worth it.

Flying Wild 21st Feb 2013 15:50


Originally Posted by purplehelmet (Post 7706855)
i thought jet2 had IFE on some of the longer routes? for a fee they had a small screen that hooked onto the seat in front. think it was £10 per flight.

The IFE devices have been removed from service due to poor uptime and serviceability from the kit.

purplehelmet 21st Feb 2013 16:36

The IFE devices have been removed from service due to poor uptime and serviceability from the kit.
http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...ser_online.gifhttp://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...ons/report.gif thanks for the update.

GayFriendly 21st Feb 2013 16:51

Oh dear, no on-demand entertainment for a 7 hour flight to JFK. The world ends. Of course, each to their own but I pity those who can't manage a few hours without needing to watch some Hollywood drivel or playing repetitive computer games. Whatever happened to reading a book, listening to music or shock, horror talking to the person next to you.....I would agree with comments made about the food though, after my last Jet2 'meal' I now take my own on board. i'm sure Jet2 will do well with these flights, lack of IFE and bad food notwithstanding

Charlie98 4th Mar 2013 17:06

Boeing 757 gasper vents
 
Do Jet2's 757 fleet have gasper vents? I've got to fly with them this summer and I do like to have some air flowing towards me, to be honest ill be lucky if I don't get a 16 hour delay :yuk:;)

Drive4it 4th Mar 2013 18:18

Banjul - The Gambia
 
Hi.

Anyone know of Jet2 flying into Banjul The Gambia as of Winter 2013/14?

I would imagine to possibly replace TCX.

Thanks.

goldeneye 4th Mar 2013 18:58

TCX are not dropping BJL, flights are almost always full and is quite a moneymaker.

Maybe LS wants to get in on the action, or could be ad-hoc for someone like the Gamiba Experience.

Drive4it 4th Mar 2013 19:39

Would be great to see LS give addition to Gambia, and possibly a few different UK departure points.

righthandrule 5th Mar 2013 09:14

Banjul has been rumoured to be a new winter destination to keep the 757's busy but nothing has been officially announced.

Just an FYI, summer aircraft based as follows;

LBA - 4x 757, 8x 737-300, 1x 737-800
MAN - 4x 757, 4x 737-300, 5x 737-800
NCL - 2x 757, 4x 737-300
EMA - 1x 757, 2x 737-300, 1x 737-800
GLA - 1x 757, 1x 737-300, 2x 737-800
EDI - 5x 737-300
BFS - 2x 737-300
EMA - 2x 737-300
ALC - 2x 737-300

Total 51 aircraft. This includes 1x Titan 757 (MAN) and 2x Travel Service 737-800's (MAN & EMA) along the following standby aircraft.

LBA 1x 757 & 1x 737-300
MAN 1x 757 & 1x 737-800
ALC 1x 737-300

757 Speedbrakes 5th Mar 2013 10:11

Charlie98:

Yes, the 757 has 'gasper' vents overhead as well as vent panels on the floor.

The APU will need to be running with at least one air conditioning pack on - but if you're somewhere warm, it will be.

They are switched off during engine start as the air is required to spin the engines up. Always makes me smile when I'm sat in the back and all the pax start fiddling with the gaspers during engine start and start complaining (whiney voice)'my blower doesn't work....'

As for a 16 hr delay, you'd be extremely unlucky. I can assure you if it starts getting towards a 2 hr delay that looks like it could go to 3 hrs, the airline will be doing everything it can. Of course I should say, in fairness, the airlines do try hard not to have any delays at all........

Johnny [email protected] Pants 5th Mar 2013 11:19

Right Hand Man
 
You appear to list EMA twice my friend, suspect the 2nd time it is listed should be BLK, not EMA:ok:

ematom1 5th Mar 2013 11:28

Isn't ema 2 737-800's and 1 737-300?

jethro15 5th Mar 2013 12:17

Fleet
 
With the arrival of outstanding a/c, and including the three leased additions, shouldn't the fleet total 53 for the summer?

Charlie98 5th Mar 2013 15:24

Thanks 757, I know the 752 quite well as for start up etc and I've probably been a bit critical of Jet2, thanks again though

dwshimoda 6th Mar 2013 02:39

757SB / Charlie98...
 
...though there is one airframe (AD I think) which doesn't have gasper vents. All the others do.

Charlie98, as 757SB alluded to, Jet2.com are probably one of the airlines least likely to experience big delays!

DW.

righthandrule 6th Mar 2013 21:37

Johnny [email protected] Pants - well spotted, it was BLK not EMA!

jethro15 - fleet is 51 (52 including the freighter)

757 - AA AB AC AD AE AG AH AI AJ AK AN & Titan (11)

737-800 - FC FD FF FJ FP FR FV & 2x Travel Service (9)

737-300 -LA LB LC LD LE LF LG LH LI LJ LK LO LP LR LS LU LV LX LY LZ, FB FE FG FH FH FL FM FN FO FS FT (31) + LW frieghter

I think this summer Jet2 will be one of the most punctual airlines in the UK, last year only one standby 757 which was usually the one that was due maintenance at the particular time and consequently not able to actually act as standby. This year 5 standby aircraft, two based in ALC to bring back any stranded flights. No more putting 230 people up in a hotel cos of a tech delay, those ALC 737's will be hopping all over to bring holidaymakers home.

The96er 6th Mar 2013 21:46


I think this summer Jet2 will be one of the most punctual airlines in the UK
Jet2 have struggled all winter on a daily basis with tech delays, from MAN at least. Even with spare A/C and crews on standby, I don't think that will have much impact on what will almost certainly be a punishing summer schedule.

goldeneye 6th Mar 2013 22:11

I take it the ALC base is to help minimise EU261 claims.

TSR2 6th Mar 2013 23:51


I think this summer Jet2 will be one of the most punctual airlines in the UK
Looking at the punctuality stats for 2012, there is no doubt that Jet2 punctuality was greatly improved compared with previous years. However, they still only made 5th position out of 6 UK Low-cost Airlines. It should also be noted that the Jet2 stats are based on analysis of only 53% of their flights, so their overall final ranking could well go up or down.

Still a long way to go but heading in the right direction.

JO27 7th Mar 2013 07:03

Jethro is right. Fleet is 53 for S13. Including the Titan, there are 12 752s, plus the 9 738s and 32 733s (including freighter 'LW)


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