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DjerbaDevil 22nd Apr 2015 23:29

Agreed that the Titan A320 would be the most likely cancellation. The back up/relief aircraft should be a couple of the B757s regrouped at LBA and MAN bases. Nevertheless G-JZHD will probably end up at LBA or MAN until it has proved its reliability.
With this ‘new’ B738 addition it is almost certain to be a Boeing order announcement for the future.

Yorkshire_Pudding 23rd Apr 2015 09:25


With this ‘new’ B738 addition it is almost certain to be a Boeing order announcement for the future.
Easyjet went from all Boeing to all airbus.
Monarch is going all airbus to all Boeing.

So no, not necessarily as you suggest.

DjerbaDevil 23rd Apr 2015 13:36


Monarch is going all airbus to all Boeing.
No chance IMO. Monarch signed an LOI (Letter of Intent) with Boeing for the B737MAX, when they were attracting the attention of a would be buyer and it gave the distinct impression of being a PR excercise. Added to which they said that they would get the aircraft in 2018, which is impossible. Firstly the B737MAX is scheduled for first deliveries in 2017 and, when Monarch signed their LOI, there were already 2000 firm orders for the aircraft. Boeing can only manage to manufacture 500 B737s per year, so even if they started to mass produce the B737MAX on 1 January 2017 (most unlikely), they would not be able to serve the Monarch order until 2021. In the meantime, there would not appear to have been any updated news that the LOI has been converted to a firm order by Monarch. Meanwhile more and more firm orders have been added to the waiting list for the B737MAX, which at present stand at about 3,000 (six years production).

janeyTA 23rd Apr 2015 14:22


Monarch signed an LOI (Letter of Intent) with Boeing for the B737MAX, when they were attracting the attention of a would be buyer and it gave the distinct impression of being a PR excercise
Boeing: Boeing UK - Boeing, Monarch Airlines Finalize Order for 30 737 MAX 8s


So does that mean it's finalised order, or a letter of intent that was signed earlier last year.

Leeds Spotter 23rd Apr 2015 15:49

This order was placed 7 days after Greybull Capital bought out Monarch and invested £125m in the company.
Should be treated as a PR exercise until we see some financial figures of how Monarch is trading in is new guise as a LCC.
At the moment there selling off the company silver, the aircraft purchased new two years ago, have now been sold of and replaced by aircraft 14 years old, an aircraft replacement plan in line with Jet2.
The £125m is working capital, no money in the pot for new aircraft, this years second hand purchases has been funded by sales of newer aircraft.

Serenity 23rd Apr 2015 16:30

Suggest Leeds spotter gets his facts straight!!
Every sentence in that post is incorrect!!!

SWBKCB 23rd Apr 2015 17:24

Ignoring the MAX debate, MON had previously switched from Boeing to Airbus, as well as the EZY example so not impossible, although any new aircraft order seems unlikely in my opinion (that should have them reaching for their contract signing pens... :ok: )

compton3bravo 23rd Apr 2015 18:03

Come on Leeds Spotter you can do better than that - what utter tosh in that post. As somebody else has said all your comments are completely untrue, e.g. Monarch do not buy aircraft they LEASE them.

Sean Dillon 23rd Apr 2015 20:52

Really?!? A spotter write something on here, with bizarre and extream confidence, that is complete and utter rubbish about this airline/industry!

Any cancellation at this stage of any of wet/damp lease by the way, will be subject to heavy penalties...and the Dart Group can't afford that or an order of either new type! Guess there are certain things you don't get from Airliner World!

Always a pleasure to see you guys too 'ATIS' - after listening to our management during last summer, long may you prosper...you have a quality' brand!

galwaypilot 24th Apr 2015 07:00

Jet2 A320 Announcement
 
So I hear it's widely rumoured (don't laugh!) that Jet2.com will be making an announcement at the next Paris air show that they are replacing the 733 with the A320. The initial order will be about 20 planes. I believe Norwegian is dumping their A320 options or a portion of at least, and Jet2 are taking them on after seeking finance from Bank of America I believe.

Again like most airlines I do appreciate rumours don't turn fact until you see it with your own eyes.

Jet2_738 24th Apr 2015 12:46


Again like most airlines I do appreciate rumours don't turn fact until you see it with your own eyes.
I agree^

A change of type seems really unlikely to an airline like Jet2. I know that EZY did it, but Jet2's business model isn't similar to EZY at all. The A320 replacing the 733 is ridiculous (I know its only a rumour) - Jet2 have already stared replacing them with bigger 738's. The 733's will operate in service until they need to be scrapped, and by that time, Jet2 will have built up a network of enough 738's. I'd expect the oldest 733QC's to be converted into just Cargo, as they come to the end of their lives. The younger ones in the fleet - i.e G-GDFL will stick around for quite a while yet. Operating a mixed fleet is more expensive than running a fleet of the same type and it seems rather pointless operating a 180-seat Airbus, when they could operate a 189-seat Boeing, and have it fit in with the rest of the fleet. :ok:

DjerbaDevil 24th Apr 2015 13:33


A change of type seems really unlikely to an airline like Jet2.
It could be done quite simply. The A320NEO does have 189 passengers in a one class layout, so that’s one objection solved. Then JET2 has 7 bases and they are already allocating their three Boeing types to certain bases. The clearest example is Glasgow which is all B738s. It would therefore be possible to allocate new A320NEOs to specific bases and the mixed fleet would not therefore create any major headaches. Further, with the A320NEO being a 189 seater, it could be swapped for a B738 at any time.
One other advantage is the more spacious cockpit of the A320NEO that would delight Sean Dillon. Doubtless if it comes about it probably means the CEO was thinking of him.

Jet2_738 24th Apr 2015 20:49


The A320NEO does have 189 passengers in a one class layout, so that’s one objection solved.
If we are increasing capacity, and buying new aircraft, does a logical solution not lie in the 737MAX-8,-9 or especially the 737MAX 200 - an extra 11 seats, and more economic - less fuel consumption, similar parts library...

But anyway, new aircraft are unlikely to Jet2. Maybe when the 737MAX comes out, and the 737NG prices fall, then Jet2 might consider buying new then. But lets hope a new aircraft order comes sooner rather than later. :ok:

DjerbaDevil 24th Apr 2015 22:35


Norwegian is dumping their A320 options or a portion of at least, and Jet2 are taking them on after seeking finance from Bank of America I believe.
If the above works out, then the Airbus 320NEO order makes sense. The B738MAX will begin flying in two years’ time and with a backlog of 3000 orders in the pipeline and a manufaturiung rate of 500 airframes per year, any order today would mean waiting 8+ years for delivery.
JET2 don’t have the time to wait if they plan on renewing their 27year+ fleet of B733s and B757s, of which there are about 20. The best they could do as an alternative is to continue to buy/lease second hand 10+ year old B738s.

Incidently my preference would be for Boeing....but needs must.

LNIDA 24th Apr 2015 23:55

Norwegian dumping 320Neo........don't think so
 
First off Norwegian do not at this stage plan to operate the A320Neo they ordered them (along with a lot of Max's) because the deal was so good, they will go to AAA (Arctic Asset Aviation) they ordered them because in recent years its been the lease companies making a lot of money out of having aircraft that airlines can't get their hands on, that is what AAA is about.

So if Jet2 did go down this path they would be leasing them from AAA

Norwegian plans to restart its growth plans in 2016 and is looking at 25% PA compared with 5% this year. 2016 see 4 x 787-900 delivered in addition to the 8 787-800 now in service, added to which there will be around 25 new build 738's the LGW operation will switch to G reg mid year for both fleets.

I suspect if Jet2 are looking for new build kit they will as an existing Boeing customer play the what will you give us to switch game with Airbus, but this isn't 2001 anymore both companies have huge order backlogs.

The drop in oil price will buy Jet2 a breathing space but likely lead to more economic growth and more orders.

Its worth noting that AAA could equally offer up the 738/MAX for lease, it was at the time Europe's biggest aircraft order

galwaypilot 25th Apr 2015 10:24

Well it's all very interesting. Because at a recent management base visit the new DFO (ex-Cp) strongly hinted to the fact the there are A320's on the way. Though the CEO stated Jet2's expansion plans consist of an addition of 4-5 planes to the fleet every year until the fleet reaches about 75 aircraft.

This to me sounds right, as whether it's an SOP change or buying an aeroplane, they have a very slow and cautious attitude to the deduction making process. I feel that's their management style. However this move if true seems to contradict that! Plus considering they don't fly during the winter, how will this change their business model?!

Johnny [email protected] Pants 25th Apr 2015 11:46

Interesting times
 
I have kept myself to myself for quite some time here, which those of you that know me will know that I have found hard given some of the drivel that has been raised by certain forum members, particularly the ones who appear to wish the hand that allegedly feeds them a great ill.

I know that improvements can be made throughout the business, but show me a business where this isn't the case. The "droves" of pilots leaving is hardly a surprise to most of us, after all it is BA that are hoovering up and Jet2 is not alone is losing crew. Some have left for other pastures, I know, but they are few and far between.

Nobody seems to have shown any interest in this bit of news relating to Jet2 and it's relationship with BALPA from last week.

Bird & Bird wins landmark case relating to the scope of collective bargaining with trade unions | Jet2.com

That seems to have cleared up the situation and the Jet2 management involved in this can now concentrate their efforts towards moving the business further forward without the distraction of having to be involved in meetings about court cases etc etc.

Ivan aromer 25th Apr 2015 14:01

Galwaypilot
 
You mention the DFO (ex CP). Does this mean that TWE has gone?

nonfrequentflyer_NCL 25th Apr 2015 14:46

Love to think there'll be some newer aircraft at Jet2 before August. Especially flying out of NCL.

galwaypilot 25th Apr 2015 15:58

Jet2 4
 
Well PD is DFO and BM is now CP! So yea to TWE is no longer in that position. Deputy DFO is in the process of being filled.

As for BALPA etc. I can't comment on that as I really don't have an opinion. Pluses and minuses on that topic. I would just like to know what the thoughts are on the A320 development.


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