Bungling MAN on Boxing Day
 

Heard a good one today. MAN ran out of de-icer for the aircraft.

Most of the BA flts have next info , this was all down to the weather at MAN on boxing day morning. Rumour has it that two of the three de-icing machines were out of service.

All the A/C bays were like glass. Tugs had trouble pushing aircraft back.

Seems to me manchester is more interested in saving money than running a real airport.


So say's the slug .................

Isn't deicing done by the handling agents and not the airport? BA do their own, the other handling agents do all others!

spannersatcx

you are correct but the problem is all the handling agents draw from the one tank of fluid provided by the Airport Authority.

Seem to remember a couple of weeks ago, some guys working around the storage tanks.


So say's the slug ................

To ice or not De -ice?
 

Have you ever tried BRU (belgium) airport? It snows 1 or two days a year but what two days...! Last time they ran out of de-icing fluid after one wing was done (company rules forces us to re-start full de-icing sequence), the second truck got stuck with gear problems and could move. ==> more than 1 hour to de-ice than blocked by a queue of 20 at holding point for 30' ==> back to de-icing platform....
The next day, coming back from NS, airport closed because covered by 20 cm of snow. Not even a single clean rwy, not to speak about taxiways: one almost needed a sledge to disembark:*

spannersatcx

The airlines are responsible for deicing the aircraft and often contract it to the handling agent, who in turn may use a supplier. The airports are responsible for deicing the runway and taxiway and this is what appears to have gone wrong in this instance.

symphonyangel, agreed. :ok:

Heard a story that a de-icer at LHR only de-iced part of the wing of a BA A319 today, and claimed the whole thing had been covered. Only after inspection from the flight crew did they realise that was not the case, and had to call them back.

Rather worrying.

Arrived at work today [Manch ATC] to find the "Usual" ..........Delays...
Unfortunately...Every Flipping Airline does **** All to alleviate the "problem"
E.G. ABC101...no de-icer....
Does "ABC" post a delay? NO WAY
What happens?....not a lot until the FlightPlan "Drops" out of the ATC "system"
Then ABC calls for "start"....no flightplan,
Why? Not my prob.....ATC will "sort" it
Airlines, read your SOPs
Big Airlines Sort yourselves out, along with the Rest
IF a delay of +15 mins is anticipated you MUST tell ATC
watp,iktch

Bungling MAN on Boxing Day
 

I am getting sick and tired with "the airport is not responsible for" kind of statement. The SLF pays, a little in MAN a LOT MORE in some other brand new (3 year old) airports to have a safe smooth access to the air-transport system.

I frankly don't give a s%it of who is responsible for the delivering baggage, cleaning the loos, or de-icing the aircraft. I want to move fast from the sidewalk or the bus-stop to my aircraft. So if there is a problem with a provider of a service (ex de-icing or slow baggage delivering) I want the fat cats of the airport operating company to find a solution fast (like yesterday) not to post stupid signs saying that those services are provided by an other company.

It is a pitty that the SLF does not know how much is the airport tax and claim a right to vote those fat cats out of the office. (OK I am dreaming)


rant off


Rwy in Sight

Runway In Sight

I applaud you.


Aviaco

In all the years I worked at Heathrow I only experienced snow on a handful of occasions but, of course, plenty of occasions when there was ice. I don't know the technical details but following one forecast of freezing conditions they sprayed a runway.... with the wrong mixture and 27L immediately changed into a skating rink!!

The place simply couldn't cope with snow (hopefully it's changed now). We used to sit back watching the Fred Karno goings on and wonder what the Canadian and Scandinavian crews thought of the place.

It also has to be said, that whats the point of attempting to clear the taxiways, when you dont give a flying f@ck about the bays.

On the day in question all the work areas on the bays were left covered in ice and snow. its a wonder that nobody was injured. People were trying to load and unload a/c on sheet ice. a/c were taken off some of the bays because they were unsafe to load pax on. Only for the airport to allocate another a/c to that same bay.

It was like watching the bungles on childrens tv.


So say's the slug ..........

Dear Slug

Why do you have an apostrophe in says ?

Operating from a remote stand at Man during the problem period. The tragedy is that it's a liablility issue. It was a total ice-rink and yet the bays and stairs had not been de-iced. Why? Same liability issue if you were to clear the snow from the pavement in front of your own home. YOU become liable if someone slips because they can then sue you for not clearing it properly. If you leave it as it is and someone slips it is ' an act of god' or ' force majaer'.
Our pax had to walk to an aircraft in trecherous conditions for this very reason. No one wants to accept responsibility. Life really is beginning to suck!

flaps one


To show its me and no other.



So say's the slug ................

Rwy in Sight - Does that mean you think the airport should get involved with the management of the airlines that fail to reach the On Time performance targets as set by the airport authorities, or perhaps get involved in the crewing depts of airlines who don't seem to be able to roster effectively? I thought not.

I haven't worked at MAN but I have worked at a couple of other large apts, and whether you like it or not, the a/c de-icing is the responsibility of either the individual airline or the handling agent. They buy in the very expensive de-icing machinery and the equally expensive de-icing fluid based on an expected usage, which is based on past years usages factored to take account of any business decline or increase.

The Airport is responsible for the de-icing of runways, taxiways, stands, roads etc. I cannot think that it would be any improvement whatsoever for the apts to take over responsibility for de-icing the a/c.

Running out of de-icer is rarely down to poor planning by the Handling Agents but is more normally down to production and delivery difficulties with the de-ice manufacturer or an unexpected cold snap which suddenly has EVERYONE calling the supplier for more fluid.

So you're ill informed rant at the 'fat cats' of MAN apt seems to be a long way wide of the mark.

Apparently BA at Manchester made a PA apologising for "their incompetence" last night.....

There is nothing like a spell of frost/snow to catch every airport out. I have seen total chaos from JFK to European airports at the first sign of snow. There is little to differentiate them.

The best cock-up that I ever took part in was one winter in the RAF. The snow came and every snow plan was actioned with some success. The ploughs plowed and the shovels shovelled; Sadly, not one aircraft moved as the only vehicle on the station that had not bee prepped for the cold...was the de-icing truck.

Without anti-freeze in the radiator, the engine block was frozen solid!

We talk about liability issues here. noboody will clear the ice for fear of being liable. but yet people are expected to go out and work on these aircraft.

Therefore are we to say that in the interests of the workers and passengers, that we should SHUT down the airport in these bad conditions. thus saving the companies from being liable.

not such a bad idea is it.

So say's the slug