More resignations at easyJet...
Guest
Posts: n/a
So Max
What is easyJet's mission at the moment? Low cost or not?
Your CEO's leader in your in flite mag doesn't tally with my experience over recent months.
I'm not an EJ knocker, but am a confused customer who is paying higher prices from STN than the 'service' levels and punctuality supports.
Also, saw 4 staff from Groundstar decline to assist with our flight last week, choosing to return to the main terminal instead. your gate staff were clearly furious and subsequently complaining loudly by 'phone .... by the time it was sorted out, we were 30 mins late, even though the flight before arrived early.
This was double not clever (a) being late and (b) letting the paying pax hear.
I admire your support of your company and upbeat approach, but have just booked my next 5 trips to Prague with CSA.
What is easyJet's mission at the moment? Low cost or not?
Your CEO's leader in your in flite mag doesn't tally with my experience over recent months.
I'm not an EJ knocker, but am a confused customer who is paying higher prices from STN than the 'service' levels and punctuality supports.
Also, saw 4 staff from Groundstar decline to assist with our flight last week, choosing to return to the main terminal instead. your gate staff were clearly furious and subsequently complaining loudly by 'phone .... by the time it was sorted out, we were 30 mins late, even though the flight before arrived early.
This was double not clever (a) being late and (b) letting the paying pax hear.
I admire your support of your company and upbeat approach, but have just booked my next 5 trips to Prague with CSA.
Paxing All Over The World
I am biased in EZYs favour - as I live only 19 (road) miles from LTN and prices would have to be VERY much lower for me to go anywhere else. That said - I have no cause for doubting my continued support, and recommendation, of them.
Of course some of their prices are high. That is the name of the game. If I knew that I needed to get to BCN and could book 364 days in advance - it would be cheaper than going next week!
Should EZY have bought GO? We will not know for sure for at least another two years. Should they have spent time looking into DBA? Probably not but I suspect that they started that process before knowing that GO was available. I sit to be corrected.
All that we are seeing is a company undergoing change. The big difference is that we can see that change happening publicly because of PPRuNe for which Many Thanks! I am given to believe that the third word in the title is Rumour?
Most other UK companies do not have a place like this - so the comments stay internal and in the pub. That is one of the aspects of the Web that we have not yet adjusted to.
I can see that for those crew and office staff that have been with the company since it's beginning may not like how things are today. That was always going to happen. Unless a company is started small with the intention of remaining small(!), then the growing pains are going to be painful. Other folk, who join the company now, may like it and - if the growth continues - find that in another five years that "Easy is not the company that I joined".
Have I been delayed by EZY in the past? Yes. Have I been delayed by BA in the past? Yes. Have I been delayed on the roads and the railways??? That is the nature of today's travel. Congestion of all pathways, coupled with a simultaneous desire to get as many journeys per day for revenue (bus/rail/plane) means that we shall have these problems for the forseeable future. All companies will continue to outource key functions to save money and that can make the line management of those functions very difficult. (I have been there, not in the airline biz but in IT). The only possibility for a carrier is to minimise the problems, as they cannot be eradicated.
Unless RW and the others bring the airline to it's knees, I shall continue to travel with them.
Of course some of their prices are high. That is the name of the game. If I knew that I needed to get to BCN and could book 364 days in advance - it would be cheaper than going next week!
Should EZY have bought GO? We will not know for sure for at least another two years. Should they have spent time looking into DBA? Probably not but I suspect that they started that process before knowing that GO was available. I sit to be corrected.
All that we are seeing is a company undergoing change. The big difference is that we can see that change happening publicly because of PPRuNe for which Many Thanks! I am given to believe that the third word in the title is Rumour?
Most other UK companies do not have a place like this - so the comments stay internal and in the pub. That is one of the aspects of the Web that we have not yet adjusted to.
I can see that for those crew and office staff that have been with the company since it's beginning may not like how things are today. That was always going to happen. Unless a company is started small with the intention of remaining small(!), then the growing pains are going to be painful. Other folk, who join the company now, may like it and - if the growth continues - find that in another five years that "Easy is not the company that I joined".
Have I been delayed by EZY in the past? Yes. Have I been delayed by BA in the past? Yes. Have I been delayed on the roads and the railways??? That is the nature of today's travel. Congestion of all pathways, coupled with a simultaneous desire to get as many journeys per day for revenue (bus/rail/plane) means that we shall have these problems for the forseeable future. All companies will continue to outource key functions to save money and that can make the line management of those functions very difficult. (I have been there, not in the airline biz but in IT). The only possibility for a carrier is to minimise the problems, as they cannot be eradicated.
Unless RW and the others bring the airline to it's knees, I shall continue to travel with them.
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There's never been a better time for air passengers in Europe!
RW's leading sentence in this month's in- flight mag has got it spot on - there's never been a better time etc. And you yourself (Final 3 Greens) have proved it. Answer this question - without easyJet and the other low-cost carriers explosive growth into a deregulated shorthaul airline marketplace, would you (and millions of others) have access to some of the stunning good value fares on offer by the major airlines such as CSA?
Not just CSA of course but also BA, BMi, FlyBe, KLM, etc. etc. The honest answer is "No" you would not have access to this form of travel so cheaply. I am sorry that you think we are too expensive on the STN-PRG route, but that's only one route and we plan to fly >25million people this year - so I am sure you will have other opportunities to compare the price.
Yield management is not my dept I'm afraid, I assume that we pay some really good brains to work there and if we're not filling the aeroplanes then the price comes down - put in simplistic terms. From what you tell me about pricing at STN, I guess either the loads are good and/or you are booking late.
It's true to say we're not all the way home with integration of the two airlines just yet, but there are plenty of peeps working on it and in some areas/airports the whole thing is swinging along nicely. (You probably won't be seeing any of the pilots in those bases making contributions on this august forum however). As evidenced by your comments re ground handling we have still have a way to go in some areas.
RW's figures in his leading article look about right to me from what I know of our operation and his comments on routes are also true. The main thing that springs out of it for me is the difference in our business plan and that of our main competitor in the market place. We really don't think that the average passenger (business or otherwise) wants to land in a field 70 kms away from the city they're trying to visit.
Time will tell of course whether we're right or not and it will be interesting to see what becomes of the whole sector over the next decade or so. One thing's for sure, the majors have had it in shorthaul jet ops, the market has changed forever and now the consumer knows it. There's never been a better time to fly in/to Europe - maybe the lead article had a bit more truth in it than you thought Final?
Cheery Bye, Mad Max.
There's never been a better time to fly in/to Europe
Not just CSA of course but also BA, BMi, FlyBe, KLM, etc. etc. The honest answer is "No" you would not have access to this form of travel so cheaply. I am sorry that you think we are too expensive on the STN-PRG route, but that's only one route and we plan to fly >25million people this year - so I am sure you will have other opportunities to compare the price.
Yield management is not my dept I'm afraid, I assume that we pay some really good brains to work there and if we're not filling the aeroplanes then the price comes down - put in simplistic terms. From what you tell me about pricing at STN, I guess either the loads are good and/or you are booking late.
It's true to say we're not all the way home with integration of the two airlines just yet, but there are plenty of peeps working on it and in some areas/airports the whole thing is swinging along nicely. (You probably won't be seeing any of the pilots in those bases making contributions on this august forum however). As evidenced by your comments re ground handling we have still have a way to go in some areas.
RW's figures in his leading article look about right to me from what I know of our operation and his comments on routes are also true. The main thing that springs out of it for me is the difference in our business plan and that of our main competitor in the market place. We really don't think that the average passenger (business or otherwise) wants to land in a field 70 kms away from the city they're trying to visit.
Time will tell of course whether we're right or not and it will be interesting to see what becomes of the whole sector over the next decade or so. One thing's for sure, the majors have had it in shorthaul jet ops, the market has changed forever and now the consumer knows it. There's never been a better time to fly in/to Europe - maybe the lead article had a bit more truth in it than you thought Final?
Cheery Bye, Mad Max.
There's never been a better time to fly in/to Europe
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: north
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MM
You obviously go along with the theory that Ryan Air operate to airports which are too far from city centres.
Where is the evidence that this is the case.
There are so many reasons people choose to travel , and I do not believe that the primary objective for many is to get to the city centre.
EasyJet has positioned itself in the marketplace with a higher cost base than ryanair by choosing to fly from less eficiently run more expensive airports. It is too late to change without a terminal scrap.
The company should concentrate on rectifying serious deficiencies in management.
One comment on you 2nd last post indicates you do not understand how poorly parts of the company function.
You obviously go along with the theory that Ryan Air operate to airports which are too far from city centres.
Where is the evidence that this is the case.
There are so many reasons people choose to travel , and I do not believe that the primary objective for many is to get to the city centre.
EasyJet has positioned itself in the marketplace with a higher cost base than ryanair by choosing to fly from less eficiently run more expensive airports. It is too late to change without a terminal scrap.
The company should concentrate on rectifying serious deficiencies in management.
One comment on you 2nd last post indicates you do not understand how poorly parts of the company function.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Max
I really respect your defence of your company and appreciate the tone of your reply.
I didn't say this ... I said that your fares do not support the level of service and puntuality experienced.
I'm a business traveller and tend to buy on airport location/schedule/service rather than price ... GBP230 (the highest fare I've paid recently) is perfectly okay, but the service experienced at STN recently has been ragged (okay, this can happen with any airline from time to time.)
So the message that easyJet is sending to me presently is that the cost per km ain't great and that the service on the ground/in the cabin is on a par with Ryanair, who I don't often use.
That really depends where the 70kms is, e.g. Charleroi is about 60kms from Brussels, but is quite convenient as there is door to door autoroute or the railway nearby making the transfer time to Gare du Midi around an hour - pretty good going compared to the 40 mins from Zavantem.... and the transit time through Charleroi pretty much takes away the difference, as it is a tiny airport with very fast baggage delivery. In reality STN/CRL or LCY/BRU gets me from door to door in pretty much the same time.
I don't agree with you at all. What has happened is that the majors have got a wake up call in the area of working practices and productivity. Like the dinosaurs that some of them are, the blow to the tail does take a while to get through to the brain, but they are very large and have sharp teeth 
As I said in my other post, I'm not an easyJet knocker, but I am confused by the mixed messages that I am receiving presently and have switched my PRG business to CSA for Sept/Oct as a result.
Maybe you are right that there has never been a better time to fly in Europe, but the sad bottom line is that your company is not getting my business and I would genuinely prefer to keep the cash flowing to another UK organisation.
Anyway, thanks for the courteous reply and good luck.
I really respect your defence of your company and appreciate the tone of your reply.
I am sorry that you think we are too expensive on the STN-PRG route
I'm a business traveller and tend to buy on airport location/schedule/service rather than price ... GBP230 (the highest fare I've paid recently) is perfectly okay, but the service experienced at STN recently has been ragged (okay, this can happen with any airline from time to time.)
So the message that easyJet is sending to me presently is that the cost per km ain't great and that the service on the ground/in the cabin is on a par with Ryanair, who I don't often use.
We really don't think that the average passenger (business or otherwise) wants to land in a field 70 kms away from the city they're trying to visit.
One thing's for sure, the majors have had it in shorthaul jet ops
As I said in my other post, I'm not an easyJet knocker, but I am confused by the mixed messages that I am receiving presently and have switched my PRG business to CSA for Sept/Oct as a result.
Maybe you are right that there has never been a better time to fly in Europe, but the sad bottom line is that your company is not getting my business and I would genuinely prefer to keep the cash flowing to another UK organisation.
Anyway, thanks for the courteous reply and good luck.
Last edited by Final 3 Greens; 20th Jun 2003 at 08:26.
Paxing All Over The World
foundation digger
As I understand it, MoL chooses airports that are practically empty and offers them loads of pax. When they like the idea of that - he gets them to give massive discounts or actually pay him money. Nothing wrong in that - but it is another facet and not amongst the reasons that you state.
I also understand that, having delivered you to the out of town airport, the bus into town is often run by FR? Very neat, you have to admire him and I am sure that he will lift many people. Not me but enough to allow him to beat BA, which appears to be his driving force.
As to the change in short haul jet ops? I think that it has changed for ever and the majors are going to have a problem adjusting to the smaller market. The next big change will be if the Euro greens tax jet fuel. But that's another discussion!
EasyJet has positioned itself in the marketplace with a higher cost base than ryanair by choosing to fly from less efficiently run more expensive airports.
I also understand that, having delivered you to the out of town airport, the bus into town is often run by FR? Very neat, you have to admire him and I am sure that he will lift many people. Not me but enough to allow him to beat BA, which appears to be his driving force.
As to the change in short haul jet ops? I think that it has changed for ever and the majors are going to have a problem adjusting to the smaller market. The next big change will be if the Euro greens tax jet fuel. But that's another discussion!
short flights long nights
I have a question...to everyone except Ryan Air staff. I want ALL of your input, I dont care which airline you work for BIG, small. Low Cost, BIG COST, all answers are welcome, except Ryan Air. (And no offence to you Ryan people, I just dont wont you in this thred)
The question is.... Are we dissappearing down a plug hole trying to chase Ryanair? Everyone seems to be on the LOW COST BASH!! I think the facts are , we all cant do it. Yes, there is a demand for it. So I suggest, why dont we leave this stuff to MOL, let him rule the world with 1 pound fares, BUT I THINK there is another world, were people will pay more for service/ destinations/ food/ clean aircraft/what ever..maybe we should stop chasing each other "down the drain", let MOL have his fun...and get back to having a viable industry. (I mean not the one that MOL supports, one that can AFFORD to train its pilots and I could go on)
Ok Rant over
The question is.... Are we dissappearing down a plug hole trying to chase Ryanair? Everyone seems to be on the LOW COST BASH!! I think the facts are , we all cant do it. Yes, there is a demand for it. So I suggest, why dont we leave this stuff to MOL, let him rule the world with 1 pound fares, BUT I THINK there is another world, were people will pay more for service/ destinations/ food/ clean aircraft/what ever..maybe we should stop chasing each other "down the drain", let MOL have his fun...and get back to having a viable industry. (I mean not the one that MOL supports, one that can AFFORD to train its pilots and I could go on)
Ok Rant over
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Manchester, England
Age: 58
Posts: 897
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Apologies if I'm being obtuse, but no one seems to have spotted that there are actually 3 types of carrier in the scheduled game these days, rather than full service/budget. The budget carriers actually break down into 2 categories - those that are trying to undercut the majors on matching routes (ie Easyjet, Flybe) and those that are trying to put leisure passengers somewhere near(ish) where they want to be (ie Ryanair). As such I'm not convinced that Easyjet and Ryanair are really direct competitors. Of course they have many things in common, and compete on a handful of routes, but I reckon that Ryanair aim at leisure travellers (though happy to collect any business travellers who come along) whereas Easyjet aim at a more even balance, which probably allows them to charge slightly higher average fares (as opposed to the headline fares) which covers the increased costbase of using more major airports. Easyjet then have a balancing act between charging a bit more than Ryanair, but keeping the costs low enough to undercut the majors. The bucket and spade flights they do are a bit different, as they are not competing with the majors as much as the charters (and their scheduled incarnations), but here I think they are competing on the convenience of daily flights as much as price.
As such it is sometimes hard to understand the obsession that Easyjet and Ryanair have for each others antics, but I suppose it gives their respective PR departments something to fill their day.
As such it is sometimes hard to understand the obsession that Easyjet and Ryanair have for each others antics, but I suppose it gives their respective PR departments something to fill their day.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Egcc
Posts: 1,695
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
fd
nothing to do with attitude, just a personal choice about where I would fly to. If I was going to Glasgow I would want to go to Glasgow, not Ayr. Simple as that. Sure, plenty of people are happy with Ayr and then paying extra to get to Glasgow in terms of time and money, that's their choice, again nothing to do with attitude.
My last post was a simple reply to your question;
So Glasgow was my example of where this is the case for me. So cheer up and accept that fee paying punters have opinions that may be different from your inside view.
PP
nothing to do with attitude, just a personal choice about where I would fly to. If I was going to Glasgow I would want to go to Glasgow, not Ayr. Simple as that. Sure, plenty of people are happy with Ayr and then paying extra to get to Glasgow in terms of time and money, that's their choice, again nothing to do with attitude.
My last post was a simple reply to your question;
You obviously go along with the theory that Ryan Air operate to airports which are too far from city centres.Where is the evidence that this is the case?
PP
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 1,091
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I tend to avoid travelling on any easy jet flight scheduled for later in the day, since the risks for delay are too great. I recently payed 220 GBP from STN to Edinburgh, where I was asked to help clean the cabin - to assure us of low prices in the future. Last week i paid 1200GBP to BA for a economy flight from LHR - Helsinki - LHR - EDI - LHR. I got a 'deli' bag with a bit of processed cheese from BA from LHR to Helsinki. The Finnair code-share was substantially better with a hot meal. My BA flight to Edi was four hours late, and i was offered another naff snack. I must take my hat of to the skipper and his crew who dealt with a plane full of irate passengers.
All in all, EZY are getting more expensive, BA are dumming down their service. Presumably they'll meet in the middle?
All in all, EZY are getting more expensive, BA are dumming down their service. Presumably they'll meet in the middle?
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Allendale, Northumberland
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No Sponsor: you really are the word that ladies hate.
You were NOT asked to clean the cabin. The fast turnrounds and cheap prices are achieved by having the cabin crew clean the cabin rather than have expensive and delaying cleaning companies clean the a/c after every sector. A short domestic sector should not generate SO much rubbish. You were asked to hand in your rubbish to the crew in the descent as they came throught through the cabin rather than stuff it in the seat back or throw it on the floor like the animal you probably are. All the crew were probably doing were trying to make you aware of this. I constantly despair of pax (particularly parents) who just throw cr@p on the floor as if they lived in a midden.
Recently ( I wear four bars) I had a cabin crew into discretion on a long four sector day AGP-LTN and to try and help them out and during my cruise pa explained that they they had had a long tiring day and had to clean the a/c so would the pax please help them by handing any rubbish to them in the descent. One @rsehole father of 4 stood up in the cabin and shouted "did you `ear that! They want us to clean the plane for them" He then went around the a/c encouraging the other pax to trash the jet, which many of them did.
You were NOT asked to clean the cabin. The fast turnrounds and cheap prices are achieved by having the cabin crew clean the cabin rather than have expensive and delaying cleaning companies clean the a/c after every sector. A short domestic sector should not generate SO much rubbish. You were asked to hand in your rubbish to the crew in the descent as they came throught through the cabin rather than stuff it in the seat back or throw it on the floor like the animal you probably are. All the crew were probably doing were trying to make you aware of this. I constantly despair of pax (particularly parents) who just throw cr@p on the floor as if they lived in a midden.
Recently ( I wear four bars) I had a cabin crew into discretion on a long four sector day AGP-LTN and to try and help them out and during my cruise pa explained that they they had had a long tiring day and had to clean the a/c so would the pax please help them by handing any rubbish to them in the descent. One @rsehole father of 4 stood up in the cabin and shouted "did you `ear that! They want us to clean the plane for them" He then went around the a/c encouraging the other pax to trash the jet, which many of them did.
Last edited by Hawk; 9th Jul 2003 at 02:44.
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: London Whipsnade Wildlife Park
Posts: 5,038
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
June 22, 2003
Prufock: Sugar v Easyjet, the online punch-up
IF you’re going to pick a fight it’s always best to make sure you have a good chance of winning.
This is especially true if your opponent happens to be the forthright Amstrad entrepreneur Sir Alan Sugar. But if the other party is the equally larger-than-life Stelios Haji-Ioannou, the man who started Easyjet, it’s hard to tell who might come out best.
Back in 2001 Haji-Ioannou sent a minion to Amstrad to see if Sugar’s e-mailer device could interact with Haji-Ioannou’s Easyjet website. Sugar spent a year and a reasonable amount of wedge adjusting his web browser to accommodate the Easyjet site. A meeting eventually took place in January this year at which it was agreed that a six-week trial would be run to measure the traffic to the Easyjet site.
In March, Sugar was just a little surprised to receive a letter from Steven Walker at Norton Rose threatening legal action for the “unauthorised reproduction” of the Easyjet trademark, which he claimed was copyright infringement.
Sugar wrote back saying he was surprised to get the letter: “Amstrad had gained nothing from this exercise and Easyjet has received free advertising to generate 3,400 hits and inquiries to its website.” He told Walker to “take instructions from someone at your client who knows what he or she is doing”.
Four days later Walker relented: “Our clients have no intention to commence legal proceedings . . . Easyjet is in a state of flux and . . . has made significant changes in and additions to its personnel.”
Sugar replied, sarcastically: “The terminology that ‘Easyjet is in a state of flux’ is rather generous to say the least and one only hopes they administer the maintenance and safety of their aircraft in a far more efficient and professional manner than they do their marketing department.
“You can be assured that no- body from this company will ever approach this bunch of idiots until perhaps they have been taken over or fired by people who know what they are doing.”
It’s lucky that Easyjet is not a stock-market company with thousands of investors who might be perturbed by this incompetence. Oops, it is. Round one to Sugar.
Prufock: Sugar v Easyjet, the online punch-up
IF you’re going to pick a fight it’s always best to make sure you have a good chance of winning.
This is especially true if your opponent happens to be the forthright Amstrad entrepreneur Sir Alan Sugar. But if the other party is the equally larger-than-life Stelios Haji-Ioannou, the man who started Easyjet, it’s hard to tell who might come out best.
Back in 2001 Haji-Ioannou sent a minion to Amstrad to see if Sugar’s e-mailer device could interact with Haji-Ioannou’s Easyjet website. Sugar spent a year and a reasonable amount of wedge adjusting his web browser to accommodate the Easyjet site. A meeting eventually took place in January this year at which it was agreed that a six-week trial would be run to measure the traffic to the Easyjet site.
In March, Sugar was just a little surprised to receive a letter from Steven Walker at Norton Rose threatening legal action for the “unauthorised reproduction” of the Easyjet trademark, which he claimed was copyright infringement.
Sugar wrote back saying he was surprised to get the letter: “Amstrad had gained nothing from this exercise and Easyjet has received free advertising to generate 3,400 hits and inquiries to its website.” He told Walker to “take instructions from someone at your client who knows what he or she is doing”.
Four days later Walker relented: “Our clients have no intention to commence legal proceedings . . . Easyjet is in a state of flux and . . . has made significant changes in and additions to its personnel.”
Sugar replied, sarcastically: “The terminology that ‘Easyjet is in a state of flux’ is rather generous to say the least and one only hopes they administer the maintenance and safety of their aircraft in a far more efficient and professional manner than they do their marketing department.
“You can be assured that no- body from this company will ever approach this bunch of idiots until perhaps they have been taken over or fired by people who know what they are doing.”
It’s lucky that Easyjet is not a stock-market company with thousands of investors who might be perturbed by this incompetence. Oops, it is. Round one to Sugar.
