Airlines, Airports & Routes Topics about airports, routes and airline business.

Southampton-3

Old 14th Dec 2022, 08:13
  #1141 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: 50+ north
Posts: 1,288
Received 20 Likes on 9 Posts
Originally Posted by gkmeech
Work has started to re-route a Southern Water sewage pipe to allow the start of concrete laying for the extension in April 2023. Finish date will be a few months later.
Graham
Any indication whether the large gas main running adjacent to the aerodrome boundary is impacted? From memory it's north of what will need to be excavated for the extension, but may impact the access road to the "Navigator Quarter" which, if there is to be any improvement (or no reduction!) to 02 declared distances, the road will need to be put in a cutting to avoid the standard nominal road surface +4.8 metres (ie high sided vehicles allowance) that needs to be added for by way of obstacles on the road.

Last edited by TCAS FAN; 15th Dec 2022 at 14:57. Reason: punctuation
TCAS FAN is offline  
Old 14th Dec 2022, 18:18
  #1142 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: South
Age: 44
Posts: 808
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 3 Posts
Originally Posted by rog747
There is no need to be so rude #1131
Rivet Joint - If My post was to much to the point then apologies for the bluntness -but no blunter than your rant

Seasons Greetings to you all.
You say that yet the posts following mine have proved my point that some of the posters on the SOU thread donít think before they speak. They are so quick to post a negative story because for some strange reason they get a kick out of being negative about an inanimate object. Let that sink in. The mods really should be removing trolls with a long history of derailing this thread and antagonising others.

for the 150th time we have the debate of BOH v SOU and whether they can attract a low cost operator. Two simple indisputable facts. One, if you havenít already realised there is a certain low cost operator with orange planes already operating at SOU. Two, no business on the planet invests in infrastructure without a good business case. In fact, itís a prerequisite to shareholder approval. As the airport themselves have said itís hard to survive with the current routes/operators I think itís safe to say they are aiming to accommodate a low cost operator.

If anyone has a genuine intellectual argument to counteract the above facts or at the very least wants to engage in informed debate then great. We are all entitled to our opinions but if there are posters that continue to cut and paste the same negative comments in the hope it makes other posters experience of this forum less enjoyable then surely it is agreed they have no place on this forum.

The runway works have started. Shouldnít this be an overwhelmingly positive thread at the moment?

Rivet Joint is offline  
Old 16th Dec 2022, 06:34
  #1143 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Age: 67
Posts: 868
Received 52 Likes on 27 Posts
Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
You say that yet the posts following mine have proved my point that some of the posters on the SOU thread donít think before they speak. They are so quick to post a negative story because for some strange reason they get a kick out of being negative about an inanimate object. Let that sink in. The mods really should be removing trolls with a long history of derailing this thread and antagonising others.

for the 150th time we have the debate of BOH v SOU and whether they can attract a low cost operator. Two simple indisputable facts. One, if you havenít already realised there is a certain low cost operator with orange planes already operating at SOU. Two, no business on the planet invests in infrastructure without a good business case. In fact, itís a prerequisite to shareholder approval. As the airport themselves have said itís hard to survive with the current routes/operators I think itís safe to say they are aiming to accommodate a low cost operator.

If anyone has a genuine intellectual argument to counteract the above facts or at the very least wants to engage in informed debate then great. We are all entitled to our opinions but if there are posters that continue to cut and paste the same negative comments in the hope it makes other posters experience of this forum less enjoyable then surely it is agreed they have no place on this forum.

The runway works have started. Shouldnít this be an overwhelmingly positive thread at the moment?
Many thanks for your Post.

I agree that we do already have a LCC in situ at SOU; the ''Orange'' one for some years; but it is only purely seasonal, operates only one single route, and not using a 'based' aircraft but flies in from home base at GVA then back home again (same as BOH)
That is not being negative but purely stating the Obs.

I am sure most debaters on here do want to see a 'based' airline at SOU (such as Flybe once were, and Easyjet/Ryanair who were once both at SEN)

We will have to wait and see...
So many parameters occurring in the Mix- the Economy, the Runway work, and staff levels at SOU etc.



rog747 is offline  
Old 16th Dec 2022, 09:45
  #1144 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 553
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by rog747
Many thanks for your Post.

I agree that we do already have a LCC in situ at SOU; the ''Orange'' one for some years; but it is only purely seasonal, operates only one single route, and not using a 'based' aircraft but flies in from home base at GVA then back home again (same as BOH)
That is not being negative but purely stating the Obs.

I am sure most debaters on here do want to see a 'based' airline at SOU (such as Flybe once were, and Easyjet/Ryanair who were once both at SEN)

We will have to wait and see...
So many parameters occurring in the Mix- the Economy, the Runway work, and staff levels at SOU etc.
In my humble opinion Rog747, the airport might initially try and secure some EZY non based routes with the likes of PMI, AGP, FAO, BOD, EDI, BFS, CDG etc. The market is clearly there for Med flights (BE did well on these) and regional France with 2nd homes in the Dordogne. Loganair seem very expensive on EDI and Eastern wonít last on BFS so the Orange brigade may give these a try. As you say many parameters in play but I wouldnít rule it out completely!

Last edited by SKOJB; 16th Dec 2022 at 10:56.
SKOJB is offline  
Old 16th Dec 2022, 15:12
  #1145 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Southampton
Posts: 651
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
SKOJB
The next couple of years are going to be challenging for all,especially airports. I question "The market is clearly there for Med flights (BE did well on these" as BA Southampton operation have been cutting many of there start up.med flights this year and 2023) including Ibiza!, clearly demand isnt there.There is stiff competition from BOU just down the road..As for French second homes,again there seems little progress and light demand.
The runway extension gives existing airlines the prospect of unrestricted loads in hot conditions.Easy and others will only come to airports like SOU when demand outstrips capacity at there core London bases,the demand will take some time to build,SEN has been vacated by LCCs because of contracted demand.

​​








RW20 is offline  
Old 16th Dec 2022, 15:57
  #1146 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: London Whipsnade Wildlife Park
Posts: 5,040
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
According to FR24 G-POWT Airbus A321 of Titan Airways operating the Loganair flight this evening to Glasgow. Now airborne at 1657.
Buster the Bear is offline  
Old 16th Dec 2022, 17:19
  #1147 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: London, UK
Posts: 731
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Presumably to clear backlog as believe GLA was closed due snow earlier.
willy wombat is offline  
Old 16th Dec 2022, 20:54
  #1148 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: UK
Age: 60
Posts: 2,718
Received 5 Likes on 5 Posts
Originally Posted by Buster the Bear
According to FR24 G-POWT Airbus A321 of Titan Airways operating the Loganair flight this evening to Glasgow. Now airborne at 1657.
It did a round-trip back down to SOU before positioning back to STN.

I believe this is the first 321Neo to visit SOU
Wycombe is offline  
Old 16th Dec 2022, 21:24
  #1149 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: 50+ north
Posts: 1,288
Received 20 Likes on 9 Posts
Originally Posted by Wycombe
It did a round-trip back down to SOU before positioning back to STN.

I believe this is the first 321Neo to visit SOU
I too believe that is the case, out of interest how many PAX northbound?
TCAS FAN is offline  
Old 17th Dec 2022, 04:47
  #1150 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Age: 67
Posts: 868
Received 52 Likes on 27 Posts
A321N SOU 16 DEC

Originally Posted by Wycombe
It did a round-trip back down to SOU before positioning back to STN.

I believe this is the first 321Neo to visit SOU
photo here of the landing
rog747 is offline  
Old 17th Dec 2022, 12:36
  #1151 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: South
Age: 44
Posts: 808
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 3 Posts
Originally Posted by Buster the Bear
According to FR24 G-POWT Airbus A321 of Titan Airways operating the Loganair flight this evening to Glasgow. Now airborne at 1657.
Bet this will disappoint a few on here. Shows aircraft even of that size can get in and out with some kind of load. The extension will only help with that. Great little bonus for SOU to have this happen by chance.
Rivet Joint is offline  
Old 17th Dec 2022, 13:34
  #1152 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Between the flower pots
Posts: 431
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
I can remember reading here how a very successful Southend was being compared with Southampton, which was just plodding along. That success was put down to the runway extension transforming the Essex outpost.

No one compares Southampton to Southend now. I wonder why.
Pain in the R's is offline  
Old 17th Dec 2022, 19:29
  #1153 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Southampton
Posts: 231
Received 18 Likes on 16 Posts
Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
Bet this will disappoint a few on here. Shows aircraft even of that size can get in and out with some kind of load. The extension will only help with that. Great little bonus for SOU to have this happen by chance.
A Livingston Airlines A321 EI-LVD previously called at Southampton on the 26 November 2008.

The aircraft was carrying Milan FC to play against Portsmouth FC.

The aircraft night stopped and was parked on stand 14 tail first.

I'm not aware of any other A321s visiting Southampton Airport.

Does anyone know what stand the aircraft in question used?
Sotonsean is offline  
Old 17th Dec 2022, 21:56
  #1154 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: UK
Age: 60
Posts: 2,718
Received 5 Likes on 5 Posts
I'm not aware of any other A321s visiting Southampton Airport.
A Small Planet one visited on a Santa Flight some years back - I forget exactly when but was at the airport when it departed
Wycombe is offline  
Old 18th Dec 2022, 04:29
  #1155 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Age: 67
Posts: 868
Received 52 Likes on 27 Posts
Quote
''Bet this will disappoint a few on here. Shows aircraft even of that size can get in and out with some kind of load. The extension will only help with that. Great little bonus for SOU to have this happen by chance''

Indeed - This week's visit by the brand new Titan A321Neo was rather snazzy -
It would have been rather handy to have asked the Titan crew to put CFU or TFS into their Computers and get the 'sums' for a SOU departure, using the current runways.

However we all know these flights were for a short Domestic sector to/from GLA; likely not with many Hold Bags as a lot of folk would be on Business,
and Def not much Fuel.
Thus a short hop to GLA or EDI is no issue for this type in/out of SOU with the current runway.
But were they actually 'full' with up to 214 pax >? (Titan's config on its new G-POWT)

Commercially though, until the runway is extended, economical loads with larger aircraft to some further afield Leisure airports cannot operate as we all know.
Palma was about the best you could get (Volotea) up to now.
Spanair used the A320 out of SOU for TFS but had to tech stop at Nantes.
The MD-83 was also used by a couple of airlines - I recall that went to Palma.

EasyJet still use the A319 and A320ceo on the SOU-GVA flights which have on occasion, had to suffer payload restrictions (A number of reasons - MEL, Weather at Destination Etc)
This is a just an 80-90 minute sector, and will usually operate Full with 156/186 pax, plus the Bags/Skis/Boots.
AFAIK their A320Neo has not been into SOU.

Once the runway work is finished, these 'new' flights (if we attract them) will need to make money; they would need to operate Full; + will have a full load of Bags.
Even with the 'nominal' Extension though, I do not foresee IMO destinations flown much beyond Faro or Malaga without perhaps still incurring a load penalty.

In the past, as mentioned, there have been several 737-800 and A321 flights in and out of SOU - all of these have been 'specials' often with no bags, on short routes, or for cruise ships, and/or a football team etc.

Flybe as we know, flew to quite a number of leisure destinations from SOU but they were using a 78 or a 118 seater aircraft -
It will be quite a jump in capacity to suddenly expect LCC or Charter carriers to fill a 186/214/235 seater aircraft.

Again, not a Negative dig here, but merely stating what the future thinking of any prospectus will be.
rog747 is offline  
Old 18th Dec 2022, 05:12
  #1156 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Southampton
Posts: 651
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
rog747
Good assessment of post runway extension future for the airport. Unfortunately certain contributors on this forum get carried away with the prospect of a few hundred extra feet of concrete.As stated before demand will not be forthcoming for some time for any LCC to dip there toe in a SOU operation,and if/when this does happen the extension will provide operations of full loads to currant destinations ,i.e. Palma,Malaga etc by A320 types in challenging weather conditions.
RW20 is offline  
Old 18th Dec 2022, 09:34
  #1157 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Looking north out to sea
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes on 4 Posts
Larger aircraft have been there in the past. Operated a 757 there a good few years ago. However, having also flown the 321, the former does stop rather better.

Performance can be easily calculated, but having stood in a cluster at the gates here for a Q400, it is the terminal that would be the issue.

Me
ItsonlyMeagain is offline  
Old 18th Dec 2022, 11:03
  #1158 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: UK
Age: 60
Posts: 2,718
Received 5 Likes on 5 Posts
AFAIK their A320Neo has not been into SOU
The SOU FB Group reports that a few did visit during the last Winter season

The Titan 321Neo that visited this week is in a "VIP" fit with 2+2 seating although I'm not sure of the capacity (Titan have various configs available). Its the same aircraft that was used to bring the England footy team back from Doha.
Wycombe is offline  
Old 18th Dec 2022, 12:20
  #1159 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: London
Posts: 750
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 1 Post
Cost

I bet the Titan 321Neo that visited this week with 2+2 seating wasn't a cheap option for loganair.
However needs must I guess.

fjencl is offline  
Old 19th Dec 2022, 10:57
  #1160 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: 50+ north
Posts: 1,288
Received 20 Likes on 9 Posts
Originally Posted by TCAS FAN
I too believe that is the case, out of interest how many PAX northbound?
Accept that other 321s have operated, remember one parked on Stand 14. Was not the the question whether it was the first 321neo?
TCAS FAN is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.