Teesside-2
Points I raised some time ago.One operator on the routes then two,then one then none.
Teesside airport apart from the heady days of Globespan and tourist boom...has never had a market for schedules,or really much else.
Covid is the original spanner in the works..for all airports and airlines..it will be years before even the biggest get markets back.
I fear for all..large and small.
In Teesside’s case..the mayors pot will run out eventually..what then? I suspect his master plan has been revisited a few times this year!
Teesside airport apart from the heady days of Globespan and tourist boom...has never had a market for schedules,or really much else.
Covid is the original spanner in the works..for all airports and airlines..it will be years before even the biggest get markets back.
I fear for all..large and small.
In Teesside’s case..the mayors pot will run out eventually..what then? I suspect his master plan has been revisited a few times this year!
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With this argument you could say Southend shouldn't have anything.
With regard to a commercial agreement, the Mayor may be technically correct in saying that they pay nothing to Eastern but if Eastern have a 'unbelievable' deal how long can the airport sustain the terms of that deal. Also Logan would be entitled to request the same. My personal belief is Logam have been encouraged to effectively break that 'unbelievable' deal with Eastern. Meaning the terms are good but not as good before and you'll end up with one on each route on lesser terms than Eastern originally had.
I'm not entirely sure why people are going 'nuts' over this. As some have said COVID has and will change habits. ALL airports will suffer consequences.
I actually think Teesside is better placed to ride out the storm than say LBA or NCL in that they have a diverse commercial base, they were starting from a relatively low position so any new routes will be a plus rather than replacing what was there. Teesside hasnt really lost routes!
The mayor is investing which says alot to the locals and the companies you re trying to attract.
On the Mayors money as far as I can tell the airport is still on track, even an independent report states this. Now that may change if COVID drags on or the recovery in aviation is slower than anticipated. Remember most of the route at Teesside will be UK so less need for COVID testing and proof. So in theory that should help.
Let's stop bitching and moaning about money it's been allocated and the mayor is doing what he promised.
Let's not worry to much about routes etc as until we have some normality no one really has an idea and i include airlines and the airport in that.
Why cant you look at the positives. The airport hasnt folded in what surely would of finished it off under Peel. They are investing and employing companies/people to help with refurbishment of the terminal. They are engaging with the locals which is giving them some hope, confidence and something to look forward too in the future.
Teesside airport is still providing vital services in a local and national environment.
Constructive criticism is fine but outright moaning is boring!
Onion - I would agree on the whole, but would raise a few points/questions.
1. I know the victorious get to write the history but some of the Mayor's rhetoric gets a bit tiresome - Balkan were agreed with Peel, he didn't save the airport from closure (it was potential closure - the terminology used by Peel was actually very similar to that has been used by the Mayor - in simple terms 'use it or lose it'). Oh, and TUI aren't coming back till 2022
2. The whole Loganair/Eastern situation is 'odd'. It stretches credulity to believe that Eastern launched the services they did last year at their own commercial risk, and then to have another company come and replicate it 12 months later? Then look at London - launch LCY then within weeks launch LHR with no interline agreements. Are they commercial decisions Eastern would have taken on their own?
3. The money being spent - at least £3m being spent in the next few months on terminal improvements for a handful of regional a/c each day and half a dozen 737/320's a week seems excessive.especially 'at this time'. As Highwideandugly has asked on a number of occasions, is this the most effective use of taxpayers money?
4. Where's Stobart? Have they really been given 25% of the airport? For what?
1. I know the victorious get to write the history but some of the Mayor's rhetoric gets a bit tiresome - Balkan were agreed with Peel, he didn't save the airport from closure (it was potential closure - the terminology used by Peel was actually very similar to that has been used by the Mayor - in simple terms 'use it or lose it'). Oh, and TUI aren't coming back till 2022
2. The whole Loganair/Eastern situation is 'odd'. It stretches credulity to believe that Eastern launched the services they did last year at their own commercial risk, and then to have another company come and replicate it 12 months later? Then look at London - launch LCY then within weeks launch LHR with no interline agreements. Are they commercial decisions Eastern would have taken on their own?
3. The money being spent - at least £3m being spent in the next few months on terminal improvements for a handful of regional a/c each day and half a dozen 737/320's a week seems excessive.especially 'at this time'. As Highwideandugly has asked on a number of occasions, is this the most effective use of taxpayers money?
4. Where's Stobart? Have they really been given 25% of the airport? For what?
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SWBKCK
1. I understand the view its the victor who writes history, but actions speak louder than words. I agree what is said may sound similar when taken as just words.
Peel made promises that were never kept, the Mayor is making good on his promises. At the end of the day I am under no illusion that if the airport isnt viable then it will be closed/mothballed or turned into a purely GA field.
Balkans yes, but did Peel get the 2nd weekly flight or was that the airports as now?
Plus i think everyone knows TUI are coming back in 2022 and not this year...... I take you are referring to the report that states the airport is on track? They themselves know this and so the report is still valid.
2. Yes Logan and Eastern is strange.
I dont believe the commercial risk at the time of launch was purely Easterns, I'm sure there were press releases stating as much! How that commerical agreement reads is anyones guess. Giving money and commercial risk are slightly different things. As such I stand by the statement that the Mayor maybe right in that they arent handing money over!
The LCY and LHR I think should be view as it is, an opportunity to bring LHR back to MME. I think we can all agree in COVID MME was never going to support 2 London destinations. The fact is COVID provided an opportunity for the LHR and they took it at short notice. I suspect in the hope of gaining the slots long term! Quite simply it's a commercial opportunity and brave decision that may or may not work. Yes interline/ or codeshare would of helped but it was I believe a fast paced commercial decision, so I'm hoping that would of come later. Was it purely Eastern idea who knows but if they gained the slots and grandfather rights then it was worth the gamble.
3. Well what else are you going to spend it on? They are creating work in times when there is little. Much better to spend it on creating jobs and keeping business afloat so they can pay taxes back into the system than to give a company £10,000 grant that will just disappear, I know that it will be used to pay bills etc and come back eventually but more does get lost along the way or leaves the area!
You wouldn't want a situation where by you are scrambling to do the work if (big) Ryanair promised 4 based aircraft from June. At least this way you are ready.
On a side note is it not wise to do the work now and have as little disruption as possible when we have some normality?
The other problem with the taxpayer money question is (and I maybe wrong) i believe the airport has the money already allocated and some of it (a good chunk) is coming from commercial borrowing as well. So the money has in effect been already allocated.
To get that back will be difficult and not only that but have you tried taking money back from any department in any organisation back into the central fund?
The money would only be handed back to the Mayor as well! It's his and his departments choice on what to do with it ultimately. Central Government are extremely unlikely to ask for it back too if that is what ultimately Highwideandugly wants.
4. Don't know!
1. I understand the view its the victor who writes history, but actions speak louder than words. I agree what is said may sound similar when taken as just words.
Peel made promises that were never kept, the Mayor is making good on his promises. At the end of the day I am under no illusion that if the airport isnt viable then it will be closed/mothballed or turned into a purely GA field.
Balkans yes, but did Peel get the 2nd weekly flight or was that the airports as now?
Plus i think everyone knows TUI are coming back in 2022 and not this year...... I take you are referring to the report that states the airport is on track? They themselves know this and so the report is still valid.
2. Yes Logan and Eastern is strange.
I dont believe the commercial risk at the time of launch was purely Easterns, I'm sure there were press releases stating as much! How that commerical agreement reads is anyones guess. Giving money and commercial risk are slightly different things. As such I stand by the statement that the Mayor maybe right in that they arent handing money over!
The LCY and LHR I think should be view as it is, an opportunity to bring LHR back to MME. I think we can all agree in COVID MME was never going to support 2 London destinations. The fact is COVID provided an opportunity for the LHR and they took it at short notice. I suspect in the hope of gaining the slots long term! Quite simply it's a commercial opportunity and brave decision that may or may not work. Yes interline/ or codeshare would of helped but it was I believe a fast paced commercial decision, so I'm hoping that would of come later. Was it purely Eastern idea who knows but if they gained the slots and grandfather rights then it was worth the gamble.
3. Well what else are you going to spend it on? They are creating work in times when there is little. Much better to spend it on creating jobs and keeping business afloat so they can pay taxes back into the system than to give a company £10,000 grant that will just disappear, I know that it will be used to pay bills etc and come back eventually but more does get lost along the way or leaves the area!
You wouldn't want a situation where by you are scrambling to do the work if (big) Ryanair promised 4 based aircraft from June. At least this way you are ready.
On a side note is it not wise to do the work now and have as little disruption as possible when we have some normality?
The other problem with the taxpayer money question is (and I maybe wrong) i believe the airport has the money already allocated and some of it (a good chunk) is coming from commercial borrowing as well. So the money has in effect been already allocated.
To get that back will be difficult and not only that but have you tried taking money back from any department in any organisation back into the central fund?
The money would only be handed back to the Mayor as well! It's his and his departments choice on what to do with it ultimately. Central Government are extremely unlikely to ask for it back too if that is what ultimately Highwideandugly wants.
4. Don't know!
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In the 15-odd years I've been involved in the airport, I can't think of a single axed route that wasn't covered in a blaze of negative media publicity. I also don't think the routes not appearing in the booking engine is conclusive.
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Good to see Loganair to Heathrow confirmed as twice daily from 8th March. Second based aircraft and good timings for business travel too. Interline agreements with some of the biggest airlines including BA, will open up easier travel across Heathrow to many worldwide destinations. How long will Eastern last on this route now... Are their days numbered or will they stay to battle it out? Time will tell I’m sure.
LOGANAIR has secured deals with some of the world’s biggest airlines, including British Airways and Emirates, to provide seamless international travel for travellers from the region.
The partnerships have been unveiled as the operator today announces a new route between Teesside International Airport and London Heathrow from March 8. It is initially planned to operate twice a day Monday to Friday with a single flight on Sundays.
The partnerships have been unveiled as the operator today announces a new route between Teesside International Airport and London Heathrow from March 8. It is initially planned to operate twice a day Monday to Friday with a single flight on Sundays.
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I have to agree with onion although the airport relies too much on Eastern, I looked at the flight schedules one day and barring for one flight it was all Eastern, I have no idea what actual deal they have with the Airport but encouraging another airline can only benefit the future of MME. Airlines seem to be dropping routes these days like the proverbial hat not helped by the Covid situation so encouraging another Airline and healthy competition must be a good backstop in securing the future of what is an important Hub for the regions prosperity.
It has certainly keep us occupied the last twelve months when Eastern was the bees knees with the big hangar unveil with the departure board for one event, Ben jumping from a Saab. Eastern looking like they could have almost moved in to Teesside with the amount of office space and routes, more routes than the airports has had in its history but the least number of passengers. Then whammy Loganair appears like a lost son from another affair. Perhaps an 80th birthday treat.
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Just a thought! Are we about to see an announcement to say Eastern and Logan have merged or one has taken the other over! Would explain the duplication some what. Just a thought.
Maybe just a coincidence that the new Loganair routes are happening roughly 12 months after Easterns started? 12 month deal ending/12 month review point kicked in?
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Looks like Eastern are rather quickly exiting stage door left. Their U.K. route network is reducing by the day and only have a substantial presence now at SOU. However this may also change over the coming weeks and months!
