Coronavirus Impact on Air Travel
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Honestly have come to the conclusion that you do not believe much at all in what you post & quite obviously pluck random arguments from the air...
...Perhaps much like a third rate polemicist.
...Perhaps much like a third rate polemicist.
Spain just announced that from 23rd Nov ALL arrivals from red zone countries (currently includes uk) will have to show proof of negative test within 72 hours of arrival.
That will certainly not help the tourist trade and travel industry.
That will certainly not help the tourist trade and travel industry.
Thread Starter
Reminds me again how long did it take from start to finding something ?
Here it is less than 6 months and media pump it as the panacea with people, even on here there are this demanding everybody be pumped with the "all new vaccine" or you will lose all your rights.
Here it is less than 6 months and media pump it as the panacea with people, even on here there are this demanding everybody be pumped with the "all new vaccine" or you will lose all your rights.
It is perhaps worth remembering, that medical knowledge and technology has advanced considerably.
The structure of DNA was discovered less than 70 years ago. When smallpox was eradicated 40 years ago, DNA sequencing was in its infancy. The first cloned mammal, Dolly the Sheep, was created 24 years ago. The first mRNA antiviral therapy for humans was licenced by the US Food and Drug Administration 22 years ago
I'm not saying that Pfizer's or other vaccines are without side effects. However, just because something in 2020 was solved in a tenth the time it might have taken 40 years ago does not mean it must be treated with the caution accorded to a snake oil salesman, although compulsion of medication is the easiest way to scare an adult population into outright refusal. The financial incentive provided to big pharma for new therapies conditional on sufficient transparency to allow for scientific peer review has led to far greater increases in life expectancy over the last 100 years than many people imagine
The structure of DNA was discovered less than 70 years ago. When smallpox was eradicated 40 years ago, DNA sequencing was in its infancy. The first cloned mammal, Dolly the Sheep, was created 24 years ago. The first mRNA antiviral therapy for humans was licenced by the US Food and Drug Administration 22 years ago
I'm not saying that Pfizer's or other vaccines are without side effects. However, just because something in 2020 was solved in a tenth the time it might have taken 40 years ago does not mean it must be treated with the caution accorded to a snake oil salesman, although compulsion of medication is the easiest way to scare an adult population into outright refusal. The financial incentive provided to big pharma for new therapies conditional on sufficient transparency to allow for scientific peer review has led to far greater increases in life expectancy over the last 100 years than many people imagine
Last edited by davidjohnson6; 11th Nov 2020 at 23:54.
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One thing is for sure and that is we can’t carry on as we are now for an indefinite period. Rising unemployment, failing companies, a collapsing economy and national debt that is now out of control. It is going to be take a new vaccine or more of the same for years to come. Simple choice.
For those that want to see the aviation industry saved and back to previous levels there is no other option than vaccination.
For those that want to see the aviation industry saved and back to previous levels there is no other option than vaccination.
Last edited by LTNman; 12th Nov 2020 at 06:09.
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Already mentioned here but here is the report from Spain about testing that will affect all U.K. travellers.
https://www.janetanscombe.com/news/s...-november.html
https://www.janetanscombe.com/news/s...-november.html
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Completely agree with David. The analogy I like to make is that of war. WW2 and the Cold War era ushered in an incredible amount of technological change in a short space of time. Calamities and large scale threats are the precursors to the best of humanity's discoveries. They focuse talent, effort and collaboration. You don't always need time on your side to be sure of and test an outcome. That's an old fashioned way of thinking. Agile working methods and smart working with parallel works streams on the go at once works just as well.
Secondly, malaria is not worldwide spread (because of mosquitoes not being able to survive in any conditions); although there are a few deaths, caused by malaria, in Europe every year, there are imported cases. By the way, and without denying the importance of this disease, one million deaths every year is more than twice the actual number (405,000 in 2018, ref. WHO (2019). World Malaria Report 2019. Switzerland: World Health Organization. pp. xii–xiii, 4–10.). Just to compare, the current pandemic killed 1.3 million persons this year.
Thirdly, i guess - no in fact, I am sure - that a large share of people, in the risky regions, will be quite happy to get the vaccine, when the current experiments are completed.
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Racedo, another thing to bare in mind is that it's largely going to be the older population (the same people whom we sacrificed our economy, jobs and livelihoods so they can live another 5 to 10 years) who will get the vaccine first. There will be plenty of time for further detailed studies about side effects. They need protection now, they'll get it and in another few years when we're approaching high risk ourselves all will be smoothed out.
I haven't perhaps worded this in the most respectful way possible but I hope my point is well made.
I haven't perhaps worded this in the most respectful way possible but I hope my point is well made.
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Already mentioned here but here is the report from Spain about testing that will affect all U.K. travellers.
https://www.janetanscombe.com/news/s...-november.html
https://www.janetanscombe.com/news/s...-november.html
I have no problem paying for a test, we booked our Spanish trip in January and intend to go as long as our flights are still operating and of course now we need to ensure we get tested no later than 72hrs prior to arrival. I am looking at Boots and Superdrug for testing and hope appointments can be booked in advance to guarantee we can travel...and on top of all this, I hope the devolved governments of our "United Kingdom" ensure borders can be crossed i.e. England/Wales, I know some people from Wales will have to travel into England to get the PCR test.
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Already mentioned here but here is the report from Spain about testing that will affect all U.K. travellers.
https://www.janetanscombe.com/news/s...-november.html
https://www.janetanscombe.com/news/s...-november.html
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Interesting as I'm not able to have the nose swab test as I had surgery when I was younger (and no, it wasn't a nose job ) therefore, I wonder if there will be an alternative for people like myself.
I did hear of more efficient saliva tests being developed however, I'm not sure where we are with those.
N79
) therefore, I wonder if there will be an alternative for people like myself.I did hear of more efficient saliva tests being developed however, I'm not sure where we are with those.
N79
Bahrain, Cambodia, Chile, Iceland, Laos, Qatar, Turks+Caicos and UAE go on the permitted list
Greece, apart from a few islands, goes on the naughty list
Denmark will remain on the very naughty list for 2 more weeks
Greece, apart from a few islands, goes on the naughty list
Denmark will remain on the very naughty list for 2 more weeks
Nuisance 79- note: Saliva tests have been in use at HKG airport for months. results are available in 4 hours.
I hope the Government are considering a vaccination certificate, as I would have thought, a way to start to allow international travel more freely, would be a vaccination certificate, in the way you need one for Yellow Fever.
I can only see the start of any recovery for concerts, theatres & international travel to be available for those having a vaccine certificate. It's not ideal- but if it enables the opening up of "normal" life then so be it, until such time as better solutions come along.
I hope the Government are considering a vaccination certificate, as I would have thought, a way to start to allow international travel more freely, would be a vaccination certificate, in the way you need one for Yellow Fever.
I can only see the start of any recovery for concerts, theatres & international travel to be available for those having a vaccine certificate. It's not ideal- but if it enables the opening up of "normal" life then so be it, until such time as better solutions come along.
AFAIK... Pfizer claims only that the vaccine means people do not become ill from Covid - ie do not experience symptoms like difficulty breathing. I haven't seen any claims about whether a person remains significantly infectious or not. If such a person were to remain highly infectious but does not exhibit illness, we still have a potential problem with cross-border flying (ie PCR test on arrival still needed) until large chunks of the vulnerable in society have been vaccinated
Does anyone have good quality info around this with reputable sources ?
Does anyone have good quality info around this with reputable sources ?
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AFAIK... Pfizer claims only that the vaccine means people do not become ill from Covid - ie do not experience symptoms like difficulty breathing. I haven't seen any claims about whether a person remains significantly infectious or not. If such a person were to remain highly infectious but does not exhibit illness, we still have a potential problem with cross-border flying (ie PCR test on arrival still needed) until large chunks of the vulnerable in society have been vaccinated
Does anyone have good quality info around this with reputable sources ?
Does anyone have good quality info around this with reputable sources ?
This is what Pfizer said 3 days ago:
Can the vaccine prevent severe disease?
The study is designed to detect whether the vaccine can protect against severe Covid-19 disease, Pfizer has said, but data has not yet been made public.“What we can say is that the vaccine stopped clinic symptomatic infection, but there is uncertainty over asymptomatic infection,” said Hunter. “But we will hopefully learn that as we go forward.”
So at this moment in time you are right. If all pax had the vaccine, at this moment it is uncertain whether that would guarantee they could not transmit the virus to the unprotected.
Well personally I'll be in the queue for this vaccination as soon as it is made available to me. And I hate needles! My main concern is that it won't filter down to my risk group before mid to late 2021 given the distribution logistics involved. And I daren't book international flights prior to this due to the high risk of not being permitted to travel or enter my destination jurisdiction without supporting paperwork. The other compelling consideration is being rendered much less likely to contract a life-threatening virus post-innoculation. Bring it on! I've got £££££'s worth of airline travel vouchers to redeploy and can't wait to use them ...
Nuisance 79- note: Saliva tests have been in use at HKG airport for months. results are available in 4 hours.
I hope the Government are considering a vaccination certificate, as I would have thought, a way to start to allow international travel more freely, would be a vaccination certificate, in the way you need one for Yellow Fever.
I can only see the start of any recovery for concerts, theatres & international travel to be available for those having a vaccine certificate. It's not ideal- but if it enables the opening up of "normal" life then so be it, until such time as better solutions come along.
I hope the Government are considering a vaccination certificate, as I would have thought, a way to start to allow international travel more freely, would be a vaccination certificate, in the way you need one for Yellow Fever.
I can only see the start of any recovery for concerts, theatres & international travel to be available for those having a vaccine certificate. It's not ideal- but if it enables the opening up of "normal" life then so be it, until such time as better solutions come along.
It appears clear to me that the very youngest in society will not get this vaccine for a very long time, if at all (there is no need to jab 25% of the population to gain herd immunity). There shouldn’t be a simple vaccination or not policy, although I can see governments going for it especially in the APAC region.
Clearly a vaccine should be a golden ticket to a normal life but if the numbers dwindle significantly in terms of cases or deaths, that needs to also be the time the world reopens.