Coronavirus Impact on Air Travel
Thread Starter
4 flights in recent weeks on Ryanair and Easyjet, there was no discussion, negotiation or debate. There were not all UK based aircraft so clear there was a consistent policy................ you are wearing your mask. I noticed and got told as did others to make sure mask covered face and nose as FAs checked people everytime they walked up and down when airborne.
One thing I will say is that fresh breath mints needed at end of every flight, mouth tastes grim and masks ok for 2 hrs max and then a new dispoable one needed. Bearing in mind this is summer I would suggest in wet weather it would be worse.
One thing I will say is that fresh breath mints needed at end of every flight, mouth tastes grim and masks ok for 2 hrs max and then a new dispoable one needed. Bearing in mind this is summer I would suggest in wet weather it would be worse.
I'm inclined to agree with racedo on this - it sounds as if the TUI crew on this particular flight were lax. Every other flight I've been on since the beginning of July, the cabin crew have been strict about enforcing the "wear a mask or have a very good excuse" rule
I suppose, in defence of the cabin staff, if you're confronted with a bunch of 18 - 30s who have decided they aren't going to comply, when some of whom may well have been inebriated what choices do they have? Probably the only sanction worth threatening them with would be diverting and kicking them off, but financially times are hard for airlines, and it matters not how many country court judgements they might get against the offenders, the extra cost of a diversion is never going to be recovered.
Incidentally, there are no "very good excuses" for not wearing a mask; you knew the rules when you booked and if you feel you can't wear one, then you shouldn't have booked. And similarly, if you have a true medical condition that means you can't wear a mask, then don't fly. Simple!
Incidentally, there are no "very good excuses" for not wearing a mask; you knew the rules when you booked and if you feel you can't wear one, then you shouldn't have booked. And similarly, if you have a true medical condition that means you can't wear a mask, then don't fly. Simple!
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When I flew to/from Tenerife in July/August with another operator the rules were strictly enforced. I would like to hear the cabin crew's version of events. Cabin crew are not police personnel and the primary responsibility for correctly wearing a face covering rests with the individual.
Why didn't the lady who was featured on the media this morning getting her moment of fame politely mention to the adjacent passenger that they were not wearing the face covering correctly and/or mention her concerns to the cabin crew?
Did the BBC go on a "fishing expedition" to get these testimonials?
Another point which crossed my mind. From the legal standpoint is non compliance from wearing a face mask inflight a criminal offence under the terms of the ANO? I accept that it will doubtless be against the airlines' terms of conditions of carriage. But if cabin crew asked police to meet aircraft on arrival for non-compliant passenger(s) to be "dealt with" can they/would they be charged for committing an offence?
Why didn't the lady who was featured on the media this morning getting her moment of fame politely mention to the adjacent passenger that they were not wearing the face covering correctly and/or mention her concerns to the cabin crew?
Did the BBC go on a "fishing expedition" to get these testimonials?
Another point which crossed my mind. From the legal standpoint is non compliance from wearing a face mask inflight a criminal offence under the terms of the ANO? I accept that it will doubtless be against the airlines' terms of conditions of carriage. But if cabin crew asked police to meet aircraft on arrival for non-compliant passenger(s) to be "dealt with" can they/would they be charged for committing an offence?
Last edited by fireflybob; 31st Aug 2020 at 15:36.
Thread Starter
If FA's as we are always told are their for "passenger safety" then clearly some are not doing their jobs based on Govt guidelines.
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What realistically can the crew do ? There was an incident at MAN last month when the crew refused to open the door upon arrival until the Police arrived due to an individual refusing to wear a mask. The Police initially refused to attend (Which tells you a lot) and when they did - 40mins after arrival, the crew were warned that they cannot hold passengers as it is classed as false imprisoment.
Crew of the airline have now been advised to simply log the incident and to not challeng the individual.
Crew of the airline have now been advised to simply log the incident and to not challeng the individual.
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I witnessed for myself on Saturday the indoor part of an amusement park where - despite very obvious signs at the entrances stating masks were mandatory - comfortably under 10% complied. And it was very busy.
Before anyone asks we were in the cafe section for coffee and cake so didn’t have to mask up, and spent the rest of the time outside.
In relation to aviation the point I’m making is the number of people unwilling to wear masks once they feel they can get away with it will grow and grow.
Before anyone asks we were in the cafe section for coffee and cake so didn’t have to mask up, and spent the rest of the time outside.
In relation to aviation the point I’m making is the number of people unwilling to wear masks once they feel they can get away with it will grow and grow.
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As a virologist, the behaviour of some passengers on that TUI flight was unacceptable and compounded by the lack of any sort of monitoring by cabin crew. Posts here talk about the options, what can the cabin crew do etc. It is very simple. People get asked to put on their mask or return to their seats. The cabin crew know or should know who is sitting in which seat, details etc...So ask them once to put the mask on. If they don't comply then that's it. They never fly again. Ever. Then the message will get through their thick skulls.
This is not a 'polite' virus. Tie for us to stop pussy-footing around in my professional opinion.
This is not a 'polite' virus. Tie for us to stop pussy-footing around in my professional opinion.
Thread Starter
Land in a country where you have to quarantine for 2 weeks on return from, kick miscreants off plane and ask other airlines to block them flying with them. Maybe expensive but next time people know Airline policy and every other airline stands behind them. Try and get back from Greece when flight banned.
Any chance of getting an ANO so that the Captain can order them to mask up and stay masked, and if they don't comply, divert and offload? Preferably a country with mandatory incoming quarantine and a fine on return to the UK plus blacklisting for further flights?
So many selfish people around these days. They may be low or no risk, but some of us aren't and it's not always obvious who.
So many selfish people around these days. They may be low or no risk, but some of us aren't and it's not always obvious who.
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Some extreme views on the need for masks here..Your argument could be regarded as flawed though. Wales do not believe that the science supports these muzzles..Now if they were the panacea to this virus, they'd be dying in lumps there, but the infection rates are actually low..
Not everyone buys into face masks especially the chief medical officer for Wales...Rightly or wrongly that opposition is growing especially as we were told months ago that they were useless..
There are always 2 sides to every argument
Not everyone buys into face masks especially the chief medical officer for Wales...Rightly or wrongly that opposition is growing especially as we were told months ago that they were useless..
There are always 2 sides to every argument
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The problem is we want compliance but are always afraid to enforce it for fear of losing our liberal self-worth. You can't tackle such a serious problem through half-arsed measures.
Frankly, I couldn't care one iota if, a) there are mixed opinions, or b) whether any one individual "buys into" face masks. When you "buy into" travel on public transport you "buy into" the rules and regulations in place at the time, which haven't been put there by Bill Gates, an alien from Mars or those pesky Ruskies, they have been put in place on advise from the WHO, and also by most experts in the field worldwide; and yes, I know you'll be able to point to scientists you say the opposite, just as you can to scientists who don't believe in man made global warming.
If you wish to use such services you obey the rules, and frankly a diversion of a flight, or halting of a bus or train is perfectly reasonable if people refuse to work to the rules. We hear that cabin crew feel unable to enforce instructions handed down by the airline for fear up upsetting people, if that is the case then a couple of burly (unarmed!) sky marshals on flights prone to misbehaviour may be a solution. I don't know if Simon Calder was correct to the letter of the law, but he said this morning that instructions from the aircraft commander must be aboyed under the Air Navigation Order. That being the case the covidiots don't have a leg to stand on.
If you wish to use such services you obey the rules, and frankly a diversion of a flight, or halting of a bus or train is perfectly reasonable if people refuse to work to the rules. We hear that cabin crew feel unable to enforce instructions handed down by the airline for fear up upsetting people, if that is the case then a couple of burly (unarmed!) sky marshals on flights prone to misbehaviour may be a solution. I don't know if Simon Calder was correct to the letter of the law, but he said this morning that instructions from the aircraft commander must be aboyed under the Air Navigation Order. That being the case the covidiots don't have a leg to stand on.
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Personally I'm not convinced about masks. However, if I fly on an airline, or go to an establishment, that require masks to be worn, I will do so. Alternatively I have the choice not fly with said carrier or go to said establishment.
Many here will be aware of considerable speculation that Portugal will be put back onto the quarantine list by the UK later this week. Air fares for Portugal-UK seem to have risen much more than UK-Portugal, with a peak fare for returning to the UK on Friday, just before the expected deadline for return without quarantine, suggesting people are taking this seriously.
This is perhaps unfortunate for airlines which have recently added flights on UK-Portugal routes. There has been discussion above about Sweden going onto the UK's 'permitted' list. If this happens, do people foresee airlines adding capacity to UK-Sweden routes, while possibly dropping a few UK-Portugal rotations ?
This is perhaps unfortunate for airlines which have recently added flights on UK-Portugal routes. There has been discussion above about Sweden going onto the UK's 'permitted' list. If this happens, do people foresee airlines adding capacity to UK-Sweden routes, while possibly dropping a few UK-Portugal rotations ?
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Frankly, I couldn't care one iota if, a) there are mixed opinions, or b) whether any one individual "buys into" face masks. When you "buy into" travel on public transport you "buy into" the rules and regulations in place at the time, which haven't been put there by Bill Gates, an alien from Mars or those pesky Ruskies, they have been put in place on advise from the WHO, and also by most experts in the field worldwide; and yes, I know you'll be able to point to scientists you say the opposite, just as you can to scientists who don't believe in man made global warming.
So people should listen to scientists but are perfectly entitled to their own opinions.
I certainly agree that if you are required to wear a mask in a setting such as on board an aircraft then you should shut up and do so.
No I'd not forgotten, but science and scientific opinion evolves, if it didn't then we'd still be sitting here believing the sun rotates the earth, and that you can cure virtually any illness with leaches. People are entitled to their own opinions for sure, but whether that extends to peddling lies at demos in Berlin and London, and making patently false claims about vaccination, 5G causing Covid-19 and the like and the like I really am not so sure. I'm not suggesting anyone posting here is doing any of that, you can be sure. Nobody here is that stupid / devious.