US - UK Bilateral Open Skies
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US - UK Bilateral Open Skies
According to The Irish Times, quoting the FT, 5th March 2018, the early discussions on an open skies agreement between the UK and US post 2019 are not to the liking of the UK.
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/...ence-1.3415499
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One person attending the London meetings to “put Humpty Dumpty back together” said: “You can’t just scratch out ‘EU’ and put in ‘UK’.”
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Paxing All Over The World
The Chancellor was speaking up about the problems for the industry once !st April goes by and it's less than 365 days. Sadly, the folks who have seen the problem from day one, have not been able to get their voice heard.
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The Chancellor was speaking up about the problems for the industry once !st April goes by and it's less than 365 days. Sadly, the folks who have seen the problem from day one, have not been able to get their voice heard.
The reality is US/UK is already open to and operated by US and UK airlines. Norwegian fly UK registered B787s on a UK AOC, they also fly Irish registered 737-MAXs on an Irish AOC. Like EZY, they could move the aircraft to the sister AOC and G- them.
What real changes are being threatened in reality?
Will American no longer be transferring a huge % of it's LHR inbound traffic onto BA short haul? Not in US interests.
Will Delta have to sell up their stake in VS? Not in US interests.
Will BA be forced to stop flying Paris-US? Already happening as Open Skies is closing and the routes are being Level-ed.
It would be interesting to know what the realistic threat is here. Unless the administration go the full Trump and stop BA, DY and VS flying to the US in which case AA,UA and DL would also be blocked and we have an enormous self inflicted wound to transatlantic commerce.
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If you read the Financial Times report, the talks were held in secret in January, and quickly broke down as the US would only offer a standard bilateral agreement. The killer clause to that is that it requires airlines to be majority owned and controlled by parties from their country of origin. Under EU-US open skies that means EU owned (I assume Norway are included in this) airlines can operate anywhere in the US. However with Virgin being substantially owned by Delta and Air France; BA being an IAG subsidiary, and Norwegian being, well Norwegian there lies the problem.
A graphic illustration that the bigger the imbalance between partners, the more likely the smaller partner loses out. Unlikely to be the only example over the next year or so.
A graphic illustration that the bigger the imbalance between partners, the more likely the smaller partner loses out. Unlikely to be the only example over the next year or so.
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No one gagged anyone.
The reality is US/UK is already open to and operated by US and UK airlines. Norwegian fly UK registered B787s on a UK AOC, they also fly Irish registered 737-MAXs on an Irish AOC. Like EZY, they could move the aircraft to the sister AOC and G- them.
What real changes are being threatened in reality?
Will American no longer be transferring a huge % of it's LHR inbound traffic onto BA short haul? Not in US interests.
Will Delta have to sell up their stake in VS? Not in US interests.
Will BA be forced to stop flying Paris-US? Already happening as Open Skies is closing and the routes are being Level-ed.
It would be interesting to know what the realistic threat is here. Unless the administration go the full Trump and stop BA, DY and VS flying to the US in which case AA,UA and DL would also be blocked and we have an enormous self inflicted wound to transatlantic commerce.
The reality is US/UK is already open to and operated by US and UK airlines. Norwegian fly UK registered B787s on a UK AOC, they also fly Irish registered 737-MAXs on an Irish AOC. Like EZY, they could move the aircraft to the sister AOC and G- them.
What real changes are being threatened in reality?
Will American no longer be transferring a huge % of it's LHR inbound traffic onto BA short haul? Not in US interests.
Will Delta have to sell up their stake in VS? Not in US interests.
Will BA be forced to stop flying Paris-US? Already happening as Open Skies is closing and the routes are being Level-ed.
It would be interesting to know what the realistic threat is here. Unless the administration go the full Trump and stop BA, DY and VS flying to the US in which case AA,UA and DL would also be blocked and we have an enormous self inflicted wound to transatlantic commerce.
"Will American no longer be transferring a huge % of it's LHR inbound traffic onto BA short haul? Not in US interests."
"Will Delta have to sell up their stake in VS? Not in US interests."
Neither of these will make any difference to the US. Delta and AA will both cope just fine without these agreements. Probably wont have a huge affect on the UK airlines either - Virgin might struggle a bit, BA wont even notice.
"Will BA be forced to stop flying Paris-US? Already happening as Open Skies is closing and the routes are being Level-ed." Both owned by the same company, it's just changing the name on the door. Immaterial anyway, its EU-US, not affected by these negotiations.
The big problem is going to come with untangling ownerships. BA is now tightly integrated in to IAG, which if the US gets their way, at least half of it would need to be sold off. BA would need to be sold off. Likewise AF/KLM will need to sell their stake in Virgin, and Norwegian will need to sell a stake in their UK division.
It's all going to be a nightmare. Also bear in mind this isnt going to be unique to the US-UK market. The same issues will crop up for EU-UK negotiations, possibly even some other countries that have accepted EU ownership of a UK airline, may now decide this is no longer the case.
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Article leaked by NAS in a Ryanair style scaremongering exercise. They are the only ones realistically likely to lose out in any new deal and they clearly know it. With their employment model and current terms and conditions I won’t be losing sleep over them.
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Neither of these will make any difference to the US. Delta and AA will both cope just fine without these agreements. Probably wont have a huge affect on the UK airlines either - Virgin might struggle a bit, BA wont even notice.
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Scaremongering? Look at the behaviour of the current US administration. They are tearing up trade agreements at a rate of knots. Why assume this will go in the UK favour.
Please show an actual example of anything material that the Trump administration has done to actually benefit the UK.
Please show an actual example of anything material that the Trump administration has done to actually benefit the UK.
Please show an actual example of anything material that the Trump administration has done to actually benefit the UK..
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What will happen to the Heathrow model and BA re connectivity OR are the EU negotiators hell bent on destroying this in order to attract passengers to Paris and Frankfurt.
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