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Flybe-9

Old 13th Jan 2019, 08:52
  #1381 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Plymouth
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Personally if this deal does go ahead, and at the moment its more 50/50. I would expect Christine to resign immediately afterwards, she has dragged an airline which Saad had spent 3 years grappling to get the finances back in order, and just thrown everything across the office. Hopefully this will be her last job in aviation as her track record is poor.

If it does go through, I think the Flybe name will be around for only 18 months as Virgin will quickly want to get rid. Hopefully the Q400s and current E175 will all get interior refreshes, the state of the seats to say the least is appalling. The only questions I have is whether FAS will stay as it currently is in Exeter, its a profitable part of the Flybe Group, but its whether Virgin want another engineering base/training centre in a part of the country it doesn't serve much.

Someone did raise the idea of the 5 ATR72s transferring to Stobart's side, would the even be allowed legally on the contract Flybe signed? Or since its a new company would that contract be void?
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 09:00
  #1382 (permalink)  
 
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It isn’t like Virgin Atlantic gets no feed at all. They do have the ‘Worldwide by EasyJet’ deal at Gatwick, which the general scheme is expanding, and wouldn’t be surprising if one day ended up at Manchester.

The question for expansion is how that will be facilitated. More aircraft for VS LH, or more flying by DL allowing VS aircraft to be freed up to fly from MAN?
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 09:49
  #1383 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by racedo View Post
Nobody undertakes a rescue in business unless there is a massive and substantial financial return for doing so.
Heathrow and Gatwick slots? Though I heard a rumour FlyBE sold their Gatwick slots in the last few weeks for £4m.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 09:56
  #1384 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Blackfriar View Post
Heathrow and Gatwick slots? Though I heard a rumour FlyBE sold their Gatwick slots in the last few weeks for £4m.
Not a rumour - see post 1345 above
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 10:21
  #1385 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by EI-BUD View Post
Which ever way this goes, my guys is significant pruning of the network will take place. Consider, similar to some AF CDG routes operated in cooperation with BE, BE does the morning flights, meaning AF don't need a night stop.

Apply that to KL and AF across the UK, you've plenty of use for the fleet, and then feeding Virgin at MAN and LHR, maybe even rebrand Virgin Regional, or Virgin Lite ....
you can prune the routes but if you can't drop the airframe leases, you are stuck with the cost. If Flybe had gone bust the leases would have died, but as it has been bought, every liability continues. Maybe there was a restructuring plan in place that needs some money to tide the business over, but given the incompetence of Flybe management over the years that seems unlikely.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 11:59
  #1386 (permalink)  
 
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I think those of you who think that this will just be flybe with Virgin branding or don’t believe that everything could change from route network to aircraft will be sadly mistaken.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 12:12
  #1387 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by runway30 View Post
I think those of you who think that this will just be flybe with Virgin branding or donít believe that everything could change from route network to aircraft will be sadly mistaken.
In that case, why buy them and not just wait?
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 12:22
  #1388 (permalink)  
 
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Slots and continuity perhaps. No need to build from ground upwards, just utilise whats in place, and then trim and/or develop accordingly routes to fit future plans.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 12:43
  #1389 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB View Post
In that case, why buy them and not just wait?
I completely agree with you, I would much rather start with a clean sheet. However Virgin tried that with Little Red and failed and flybe comes with an awful lot of passengers for £2.2m.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 13:01
  #1390 (permalink)  
 
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They couldn't start with a clean sheet - that's the whole point behind the structure of the deal. If Flybe went bankrupt - which appears to have been imminent given the £2.2 million purchase price and the immediate £20 million cash injection - then the Heathrow slots would have reverted to BA as insolvency would have been a default under the slot lease agreement. To keep the Heathrow slots, Flybe had to stay in business and so the low purchase price behind the deal recognises that the new owners of the business will - if the transaction goes through - have to take on a lot of liabilities which they would have been able to wash away in a CVA or an administration. The cash from the Gatwick slot sale will probably tide them over for a week or two until negotiations with the card providers can take place to unblock some of the forward ticket sales and the £20m "loan" - aka emergency cash injection - goes in. Once / if the deal is complete, then the £80m injection is the clean-up money needed to sort out the mess and recapitalise the business.

Sad to see a company so systematically destroyed by mis-management in such a short space of time.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 13:18
  #1391 (permalink)  
 
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Agree with your conclusion Albert but this a lot of company to turnaround just to hold on to some Heathrow slots.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 13:25
  #1392 (permalink)  
 
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Sorry - I am sure the Manchester hub operation also has good value to Virgin in future, as does greater control of AMS and CDG slots for KLM and Air France, as shareholders in VS. It is not exclusively about Heathrow slots, but that has to be a major part of the equation even if those slots don't end up remaining on UK domestic routes when the restrictions on their use become less onerous 15 months from now. Put it another way, the fact that the Gatwick slots are sold - and to Vueling of all people - makes it pretty clear that Gatwick isn't really part of the picture.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 14:02
  #1393 (permalink)  
 
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Clearly the various press releases stressing the importance of MAN, LHR and SEN didn’t tell the whole story. AMS and CDG are important too but because they weren’t mentioned I wonder if the AMS and CDG feed will be handed over to Stobart?
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 14:03
  #1394 (permalink)  
 
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There is much posted on here about Flybe operations after it's purchase by Virgin/Stobart, however I am surprised that there has been little or no comment from EXT on it's affect there, from an HQ and management employment point of view. Perhaps there is too much uncertainty. My thoughts are with the staff during this difficult time.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 14:06
  #1395 (permalink)  
 
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From what I've heard, the mood in Exeter is very similar to that of the private investor shareholder base in Flybe - one of shock and upset about how the company has ended up here as quickly as it has, particularly after some of the bullish statements from the Chairman and CEO in relatively recent times. It is a poor outcome all round. I can't help but wonder whether time spent getting elected to the board of IATA and running gender-based equality campaigns in the industry might not have been better invested in running the business.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 14:45
  #1396 (permalink)  
 
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You have to lay the blame with the Chairman who must have had a dispute with Saad Hammad resulting in his departure and then appointing Christine, a flawed appointment based on her record at the time.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 14:46
  #1397 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Albert Hall View Post
I can't help but wonder whether time spent getting elected to the board of IATA and running gender-based equality campaigns in the industry might not have been better invested in running the business.
Something which I said repeatedly time and time again on here only a few months ago. This is the main reason why Christine should resign once this deal takes effect.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 15:15
  #1398 (permalink)  
 
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At the risk of being unkind in her first week, does anyone think that the previous experience of the CEO demonstrates an ability to come up with a successful strategy?

My post from 17th January 2017. This is one time I would have preferred to not have been correct.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 15:21
  #1399 (permalink)  
V12
 
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IMHO, The Chairman has been there through it all and must carry full responsibility for his management team. He appoints the CEOs and he terminates them. He has to approve and own the strategy. There's no one else to blame given the time elapsed. Whilst previous management may have signed off on the disastrous Embraer contract, the Chairman was aware of that before he joined and has to own responsibility when staying.
The Board should have long ago recognised they did not have the knowledge and skills to successfully manage this airline out of its past woes and through current turbulent times, and it missed the opportunity to recruit better people 3 years ago. The rest of the airline staff, the shareholders (and the travelling punters) have all been let down very badly. I'm very glad the airline has been saved from the inevitable but just feel it shouldn't have ended this way.

Just hope we don't have to watch the Board disappear into the sunset with fat cheques in their pockets. Failures like these should not be rewarded.

Other insiders can correct me if I have been unfair.
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Old 13th Jan 2019, 15:34
  #1400 (permalink)  
 
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Has a date been set for the Flybe shareholders to vote on the takeover ?
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