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Thomas Cook-2

Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:24
  #1301 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by virginblue View Post
Condor CEO has said that they have enough cash on their hands to continue for the time being and are negotiating for a state-guaranteed credit. Not sure if in times of flight shame and climate strike politicians will be inclined to do so.

Another issue really is where that would lead Condor to as their fleet renewal is long overdue as most of their fleet is more or less scrap metal value except for some newer A321-200s
It will be interesting to see what happens next with Condor and whether the government loan is to tide them over until a buyer is found or if it will facilitate an orderly closure like with Air Berlin 2 years ago. You mention about climate strikes etc., I'd say at this time people's jobs and livelihoods are more of an immediate concern for the German government here than the climate strike brigade, as well as ensuring no holidaymakers are stranded (or at least they should be).

You're right though about the Condor fleet. The 767's are old and I'm not sure what the status is with the ownership/leases of the narrowbodies. A widebody renewal programme will be needed in the short-to-medium term if Condor ultimately survives, which won't be cheap.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:26
  #1302 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Officer Kite View Post
Care to expand on that?
TC Belgium (Neckerman) is now in council, all bookings are temporarily closed.
But booked outbound flights continue momentarely by Brussels Airlines.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:31
  #1303 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by timmermc View Post
TC Belgium (Neckerman) is now in council, all bookings are temporarely closed.
But booked outbound flights continue momentarely by Brussels Airlines.
I was interested in the 'confirmed fact' that thomas cook uk was going to survive, as stated by that poster just before midnight last night.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:44
  #1304 (permalink)  
 
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I expect AirTanker will be planning to have their leased A330s returned to Brize Norton as soon as possible. Not sure what will become of those aircraft in the immediate future; back to the tanker/transport role or perhaps another airline customer. I suppose it's possible they could form part of the repatriation programme, given that they are not TCX aircraft.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:52
  #1305 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 116d View Post
I'd say at this time people's jobs and livelihoods are more of an immediate concern for the German government here than the climate strike brigade, as well as ensuring no holidaymakers are stranded (or at least they should be).
Big differences as far as the AB collapse is concerned:
- AB was weeks before a general election and a much bigger media event (the Thomas Cook drama has gone largely unnoticed in Germany, unlike in the UK)
- AB was before climate strikes etc. You will be aware of the fact that the German government just last week decided to introduce additional taxes on flight tickets to discourage people from flying across Europe for a tenner.
- AB was much bigger fish in the pan
- AB's collapse, just as the recent insolvency of Germania, has not resulted in market disruption, so politicians will see less need to do something as the market sorted itself out after AB and ST.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:54
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Originally Posted by Ranger One View Post
This may be a cretinously stupid question, but it's occurred to me before when an operator has gone under.

Why could the government not effectively nationalise the company, temporarily, for a couple of weeks? Take the AOC & OL into government hands, pay the bills, commandeer the planes, and continue to operate the thing on a one-way basis, flying out empty, bringing customers home roughly on schedule? The planes are there, the crews are there and know the routes, would that not be more efficient and convenient than an ad hoc charter and repatriation operation? An orderly wind-down of flying operations, underwritten by government, rather than a hard ground stop with all these TCX aircraft sitting around doing nothing?

I mean there must be a reason it isn't done, but as an aviating kind of guy rather than management or bean counter, I can't see it.

Sympathy to all the TCX guys & gals.
Lease co's want their planes, what would be Insurance claim if ex employee does something like the German pilot did ?

Service running at a substantial loss so once you step in to keep it running you are responsible for everything.

Easier to shut down, contract in planes with specific plan to get people home.

Govt run interference in anything tends to be a disaster, why involve them in something when it can be contracted in for the time period needed ?
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:56
  #1307 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by jack11111 View Post
With the internet everyone is their own travel agent. Create your own vacation online. Very easy. TOO easy.
Correct

I am not sure last time I used a travel agent to book flights and accommodation. Likely it has not been this century.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 09:57
  #1308 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by virginblue View Post
Big differences as far as the AB collapse is concerned:
- AB was weeks before a general election and a much bigger media event (the Thomas Cook drama has gone largely unnoticed in Germany, unlike in the UK)
- AB was before climate strikes etc. You will be aware of the fact that the German government just last week decided to introduce additional taxes on flight tickets to discourage people from flying across Europe for a tenner.
- AB was much bigger fish in the pan
- AB's collapse, just as the recent insolvency of Germania, has not resulted in market disruption, so politicians will see less need to do something as the market sorted itself out after AB and ST.
I think you'll find it's absolutely front page news in Germany: the main broadcaster ARD has it as their lead story. Can't post URLs yet sorry but search ARD.de and you'll find it
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:02
  #1309 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Officer Kite View Post
I was interested in the 'confirmed fact' that thomas cook uk was going to survive, as stated by that poster just before midnight last night.
Can you repost what was said ?
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:02
  #1310 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mooncrest View Post
I expect AirTanker will be planning to have their leased A330s returned to Brize Norton as soon as possible. Not sure what will become of those aircraft in the immediate future; back to the tanker/transport role or perhaps another airline customer. I suppose it's possible they could form part of the repatriation programme, given that they are not TCX aircraft.
the only aircraft flying for tcx group is flying for condor. G-VYGK
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:03
  #1311 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mooncrest View Post
I expect AirTanker will be planning to have their leased A330s returned to Brize Norton as soon as possible. Not sure what will become of those aircraft in the immediate future; back to the tanker/transport role or perhaps another airline customer. I suppose it's possible they could form part of the repatriation programme, given that they are not TCX aircraft.
GL and GM are both contracted to Jet2 until the end of Oct, then only GL will return, so that's unlikely. And GK won't be back from Condor until the end of the summer either.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:07
  #1312 (permalink)  
 
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So what Slots have TC at airports ?
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:10
  #1313 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Off Stand View Post
GL and GM are both contracted to Jet2 until the end of Oct, then only GL will return, so that's unlikely. And GK won't be back from Condor until the end of the summer either.
Thanks for the info. I confess I was unsure which AirTanker aircraft are/were flying for whom.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:14
  #1314 (permalink)  
 
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Grrr

Originally Posted by racedo View Post
Correct

I am not sure last time I used a travel agent to book flights and accommodation. Likely it has not been this century.
A couple who wanted to go to Mexico with TC and Condor this morning, departing from Brussels via Manchester, had to rebook with TUI. Extra costs 2x 400 euros.
I would not do this, who can assure me that my hotel in Cancun is still willing to take me.
People are still blindfolded in everything.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:20
  #1315 (permalink)  
 
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According to the Facebook page TUI will be holding a recruitment day at the Luton office for all affected with further details to come tomorrow.

Thoughts are with everyone affected.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:22
  #1316 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by timmermc View Post
A couple who wanted to go to Mexico with TC and Condor this morning, departing from Brussels via Manchester, had to rebook with TUI. Extra costs 2x 400 euros.
I would not do this, who can assure me that my hotel in Cancun is still willing to take me.
People are still blindfolded in everything.
True

But look it another way, IF your holiday is insured then you will get your money back completely, you still want to go on holiday. Turn up in Cancun and hotel says "No booking as TC gone bust". Holiday can tell you go away or provide a price for you to stay there knowing full well that it is empty if you don't stay. If you were hotel what would you be doing ?
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:28
  #1317 (permalink)  
 
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Unfortunately, the majority of standard travel insurances DO NOT cover airline / tour operator collapses. Often, it would be an added extra premium specifically for that. Obviously yes, some will cover but it is by no means automatic.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:43
  #1318 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Off Stand View Post
GL and GM are both contracted to Jet2 until the end of Oct, then only GL will return, so that's unlikely. And GK won't be back from Condor until the end of the summer either.
Both GL & GM are contracted to Jet2 for longer than October 19. One is currently till Nov 2022 and the other is until Nov 2025.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 10:43
  #1319 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mr A Tis View Post
Unfortunately, the majority of standard travel insurances DO NOT cover airline / tour operator collapses. Often, it would be an added extra premium specifically for that. Obviously yes, some will cover but it is by no means automatic.
Book via CC then covered and would assume most would be doing that.
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Old 23rd Sep 2019, 11:08
  #1320 (permalink)  
 
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LY-VEB Operating on Titan flight number out of Manchester to Bourgas.

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