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Durham Tees Valley-7

Old 27th Nov 2017, 15:07
  #161 (permalink)  
 
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Think A320 is too big for me more an ERJ 170 or SSJ route, we shall see.
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Old 27th Nov 2017, 15:33
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Don't forget these are the only direct flight from North East of England. So there will be no direct competition for passengers from Newcastle Airport or Leeds Bradford Airport to this destination.
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Old 27th Nov 2017, 19:21
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Interesting and welcome news...little confused..is this a change in policy and tact from PEEL..I thought they had stated a concentration on business routes?
GIB is a big void in the NE. Could be a winner?

Of course that means more staff all round.. so more outgoings..which correct me if I am wrong..PEEL threw out established operators?

New times and the fight back begins?..
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Old 27th Nov 2017, 21:06
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Why would they need more staff?
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Old 27th Nov 2017, 21:21
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Originally Posted by JollyTraveller
It will be interesting to which aircraft type Superbreak decide to use. I know Gib airport has a environment which means the airport has set requirements / restrictions on pilot and aircraft type.
I noticed the other airlines mostly use Airbus A320 which fits Durham Tees Valley Airports operation levels perfect.
Prior to their collapse Monarch were planning on retaining their A320s to allow continued operation into Gibraltar, as 737s I believe are right on the brink of what can be handled, that said Enter Air recently landed one and interestingly that's who Super Break are using on the Seville route...

Originally Posted by highwideandugly
Of course that means more staff all round.. so more outgoings..which correct me if I am wrong..PEEL threw out established operators?
I think this will fall into the same category as the one-off charters despite being a little bit more elaborate. I think it all comes down to how much an operator is willing to pay, something which the big operators such as TUI think is beneath them.
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Old 28th Nov 2017, 04:52
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The way it reads is that it'll be a one off flight from most of those airports listed, with one of them, probably EMA or BFS, getting 2 departures.
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Old 28th Nov 2017, 15:36
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I think it all comes down to how much an operator is willing to pay, something which the big operators such as TUI think is beneath them.
R-R - can you clarify, were TUI not meeting the terms of the contract they had with Peel?
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Old 28th Nov 2017, 23:31
  #168 (permalink)  
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I'm sure they were, but thanks to Ryanair such operators expect everything for nothing all of the time.
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 08:46
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It's been a tough 10 years for North East airports, Leeds Bradford and Newcastle have been having a crazy war to win business from airlines and tour operators. They have been offering loss making deals on the landing fees and airport charges to win that business.

It looks like Peel Group made a smart move by keeping Durham Tees Valley out of this battle, It now looks to be coming to end now AMP own both Leeds Bradford and Newcastle. This may mean airlines start looking at using Durham Tees Valley Airport again to keep the landing fees and airport charges lower at Newcastle and Leeds Bradford.
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 10:06
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JT.. Are you quite sure no incentives are in place for Loganair?..

It has been a tough year for them you are right..record breaking passengers and movements at both airports..Newcastle just passed 5,000,000 in November for the year,earliest in 10 years..and meanwhile DTV struggles to reach 1972 levels..am I missing something in your post?
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 11:28
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Highwideandugly,

I don't know what incentives are in place for Loganair but I'm sure something will be offered for them basing operations at any airport at an agreed set level. Loganair are planning to open a base at Durham Tees Valley Airport early 2018. Not sure what new routes they plan to operate from Durham Tees Valley.

You seem to missing the point that Newcastle airport and Leeds Bradford airport have built up huge debts while trying get the business from Airlines / Tour operates. Durham Tees Valley Airport hasn't built up huge debts.

Newcastle Airports passengers numbers have also been down for the last 10 years. Newcastle had 5,431,976 passengers back in 2006. Newcastle airport has less passengers from it had back 2006 & 2007(5,650,716) and the debts & liabilities have continued to grow. Nial Group Limited last accounts (group of companies accounts made up to 31 December 2016) published on 27th September 2017 at companies house show barrowings of 362,150,000.

It now looks like AMP Capital have started a finance recover plan which has seen them take control of Leeds Bradford airport and take on debts & liabilities of that airport, but it now means AMP Capital can increase the landing fees and airport charges at both airports.

Last edited by JollyTraveller; 29th Nov 2017 at 13:35.
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 14:05
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So are you saying that AMP have effectively cornered the North East market and will start to co-ordinate prices to improve returns, meaning airlines will look to DTVA as an alternative?

Last edited by SWBKCB; 29th Nov 2017 at 14:18.
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 14:30
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You may find that with AMP Capital reportedly paying off some if not all its debts owned as part of the deal when it acquired LBA from Bridgepoint Capital, They will now be in an even better position to offer new and improved incentives to the airlines and tour operators to set up shop there
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 16:24
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"So are you saying that AMP have effectively cornered the North East market and will start to co-ordinate prices to improve returns, meaning airlines will look to DTVA as an alternative? "

The main problem AMP face at both airports is the huge debt and losses. They need find a balance that means they make enough profit to start paying the growing debts back. The easiest way for AMP to achieve this will be to start increasing the landing fees and airport charges at both airports as the current deals end.

Once that starts happening it is more likely that surrounding airports like Durham Tees Valley, Doncaster Sheffield, Humberside, Manchester will start picking up some routes that would have went Newcastle airport and Leeds Bradford airport.

"You may find that with AMP Capital reportedly paying off some if not all its debts owned as part of the deal when it acquired LBA from Bridgepoint Capital, They will now be in an even better position to offer new and improved incentives to the airlines and tour operators to set up shop there "

Less debt will make it easier to make profit at Leeds Bradford Airport but the airports business still needs make a lot money before AMP see any profit on the deal. The crazy incentives are the main reason Leeds Bradford has lost over 100 million in the last 10 years.


Leeds Bradford airport is going need more support from Newcastle airport because Leeds Bradford has lot more competition for passengers & flights due to its location. It's also held back by poor location and facilities.
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 16:56
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The main problem AMP face at both airports is the huge debt and losses.
Debts only a problem if you can't repay it and it starts constraining the business, if it's being invested into assets which grow the business it can be a good thing.
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Old 30th Nov 2017, 17:32
  #176 (permalink)  
 
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WAs the KLM Diversion due to xwinds and cleared runway width/ breaking action?
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Old 30th Nov 2017, 21:11
  #177 (permalink)  
 
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Looking at the NOTAMs the airport was SNOCLO briefly today, and when the runway was open some taxiways were on and off closed. Suppose this is the queue for the armchair experts to start with the "little bit of snow and the place grinds to a halt" posts now...
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Old 1st Dec 2017, 01:27
  #178 (permalink)  
 
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These Debts are very substantial and will only grow, given the under reported brewing war between Saudi and it's Allies and Iran.
That would push up oil prices and may cause routes to be cut.
Airlines come and go seems madness to begin so much debt at NCL then buy LBA with terrible debt and some vain hope of building a new taxiway and runway/ terminal extensions.
If Monarch went owing less.
What happens to the airports ( genuine question I'm not up on this stuff ) do they go bankrupt.
In that event is there protection to keep them running or do they shut up shop ?
Didn't a couple of new Spanish airports one ended up a ruin. But both went under before opening .
Only Castelon has a few flights now .
Ryanair being in there.
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Old 1st Dec 2017, 06:02
  #179 (permalink)  
 
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This debate is on the wrong thread! As far as I know Monarch were paid to fly from LBA, so they owed nothing, perhaps the airport lost revenue from returning passengers.

Last edited by N707ZS; 1st Dec 2017 at 12:32.
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Old 1st Dec 2017, 11:52
  #180 (permalink)  
 
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While looking for stats about Reddish South Station ( one train / one way / one day per week !! ) I came across this today.

https://www.aol.co.uk/news/2017/12/0...way-station-n/


Presumably car parking is fairly cheap at DTV, then....
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