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Manchester-2

Old 10th Jun 2018, 08:34
  #1681 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,189
Am I the only one that is not getting into a overheated frenzy of salivation over more new services ? I find using this airport is a depressing miserable experience and the thought of more services nothing to shout about. The infrastructure is 10 years behind capacity and the new TP barely adds new aircraft parking and the benefit (if any) will not be seen fully for another 10 years- by which time it will already be inadequate. As someone who regularly shells out £2K-£4K for a ticket, what I see is a very high cost airport with a remarkably low level of service.
Maybe some people on here should get back down to earth & think about improving the passenger experience BEFORE adding more services.
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Old 10th Jun 2018, 08:52
  #1682 (permalink)  
zfw
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Somewhere else
Posts: 83
Originally Posted by Mr A Tis View Post
Am I the only one that is not getting into a overheated frenzy of salivation over more new services ? I find using this airport is a depressing miserable experience and the thought of more services nothing to shout about. The infrastructure is 10 years behind capacity and the new TP barely adds new aircraft parking and the benefit (if any) will not be seen fully for another 10 years- by which time it will already be inadequate. As someone who regularly shells out £2K-£4K for a ticket, what I see is a very high cost airport with a remarkably low level of service.
Maybe some people on here should get back down to earth & think about improving the passenger experience BEFORE adding more services.
Tend to agree it has been getting worse over the years and a management team that seems clueless and full of its own self importance and grandstanding, heres another latest survey thingy widely available on the net,
The world's best and worst airlines and airports | Daily Mail Online
and it places MAG firmly in the bottom at 136 for Manchester and 140 out of 141 for Stansted. It wouldnt be so bad if they said "right, lets take it on board what the customers are telling us and do something about it" instead of blowing their own trumpet as to how good they are and a Premium European airport.

Unfortunately this is what the customers think.

Manchester Airport Customer Reviews | SKYTRAX
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Old 10th Jun 2018, 09:39
  #1683 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: The foot of Mt. Belzoni.
Posts: 2,023
I'm with you Mr A Tis.

The airport seems constantly soliciting more services than it has the capacity to handle. It's not a new phenomenon either. I remember Delta and QANTAS, often sitting on the taxiway near the engine-test facility for up to 40 minutes because there was nowhere to park. New services would often be announced with a fanfare of trumpets from Olympic House. 12-18 months later, we would ask 'has the LOT been in today'?......Oh, no they've finished. Look at the number of operators who have been and gone over the years.

Is the 'Manchester experience' being nurtured at the other 2 MAG sites, I wonder? I hope not. In the past, EGNX was a great little airport.
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Old 10th Jun 2018, 10:51
  #1684 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: North West UK
Posts: 520
Although I frequently have a pop at the airport, I have to say that last week I was very pleasantly surprised. I flew out later afternoon from T1 with security taking about ten minutes at most and arriving back on Friday morning, passport control was empty for the Europeans (although the queue for non-Europeans was Horrendous). Arrived and left by train which was also painless and I discovered it is quicker to walk from the station to T1 via the ground than take the overhead route.
Espada III is offline  
Old 10th Jun 2018, 21:51
  #1685 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Manchester, England
Posts: 557
Originally Posted by Mr A Tis View Post
Am I the only one that is not getting into a overheated frenzy of salivation over more new services ? I find using this airport is a depressing miserable experience and the thought of more services nothing to shout about. The infrastructure is 10 years behind capacity and the new TP barely adds new aircraft parking and the benefit (if any) will not be seen fully for another 10 years- by which time it will already be inadequate. As someone who regularly shells out £2K-£4K for a ticket, what I see is a very high cost airport with a remarkably low level of service.
Maybe some people on here should get back down to earth & think about improving the passenger experience BEFORE adding more services.
Manchester, so much to answer for. I confess to being a MAN-fan but also a critical friend of the Global Gateway for the North. No one is pretending that the experience of transiting MAN is a world class one, it isn't. It will be better for some than others partly dependent on timings etc and sheer good/bad luck. But expensive?, what doest Thou mean, Sir? For airlines? Looking at Heathrow's fees and charges I would say not. For the passenger, you can choose to pay for what you want, most airport's charge a premium for goods and services because they've got you captive.

As for passenger surveys and travel trade awards, whether complimentary or critical I pay them no heed as they are highly subjective and often display a lack of understanding of the air transport world. OTP is a much-abused measure and flawed in its recording, it's also true that many of the factors affecting it are outside the direct control of the airport.

MAN is investing a lot of money in TP. Yes it could have come sooner. It won't be Changi or Doha when finished because we have a democracy in this country which requires accountability over any spending in the public domain, and vanity projects are frowned upon.

Ask yourself this. Why do you use MAN? I'll give you my answer. I use MAN because on my doorstep I have an airport where I can fly to a large number of destinations, such as Los Angeles where I recently flew directly in 10 hours for £460 return. The alternatives via LHR / DUB etc started at twice that price and took a minimum of 15 hours. Imagine living in Lyon, France's second city with a nice modern airport all payed for by the State, and from where you can fly to errr, nowhere in the USA. MAN has such an incredible range of services. Whilst I would agree that ideally using an airport should be a pleasant experience, what is its ultimate purpose? Right! - to get you to where you want to go. Manchester gets you to a lot of places and why wouldn't we want yet more destinations? Far from being clueless, MAN's management are landing big fish almost weekly whilst the wannabes of Europe look on. Manchester displays the great Northern tradition of demanding and offering value for money. Airlines don't pay a fat tariff to access a huge market of 20+ million people and many industries. Passengers get an almost un-rivalled range of air services at a non-capital/hub airport. They don't get marble and glass, they get an airport experience which sometimes has its trials but will get better in the coming years. No airline is at MAN to slot sit or wave their flag like at Heathrow, they are here to make a profit, something they can't at many so called 'nice' airports, it seems. I wonder why.

Apologies if I my post has wandered a little, but it's in the ball park.
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Old 11th Jun 2018, 05:25
  #1686 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Stockport
Age: 52
Posts: 225
Originally Posted by ZOOKER View Post
I'm with you Mr A Tis.

The airport seems constantly soliciting more services than it has the capacity to handle. It's not a new phenomenon either. I remember Delta and QANTAS, often sitting on the taxiway near the engine-test facility for up to 40 minutes because there was nowhere to park. New services would often be announced with a fanfare of trumpets from Olympic House. 12-18 months later, we would ask 'has the LOT been in today'?......Oh, no they've finished. Look at the number of operators who have been and gone over the years.

Is the 'Manchester experience' being nurtured at the other 2 MAG sites, I wonder? I hope not. In the past, EGNX was a great little airport.
MAN has started a major investment programme so things will improve. You need the services to pay for this and at the end the day at sparkling new airport with no services isn't much use.
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Old 11th Jun 2018, 09:02
  #1687 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: stockport
Posts: 60
Perfectly said Roverman, we are so lucky to have OUR airport on the doorstep. I live in Stockport so its a small distance to worldwide services. You are correct it depends on when you travel,i have been through twice on return trips since the new year and they were stress free experiences. I am traveling again on Thursday through terminal 1, i may comment on my experience at a later date. Cheers Sam
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Old 11th Jun 2018, 19:55
  #1688 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: The foot of Mt. Belzoni.
Posts: 2,023
"Sparkling new airport".

Loving your work Domy.
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Old 11th Jun 2018, 20:48
  #1689 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,189
i have been through twice on return trips since the new year and they were stress free experiences
Twice in 6 months covering 3 terminals hardly in a position to get a grasp on what's going on.

My experiences are constantly dire, but yes I do get the odd good day- but very rarely.

Dropped off the Vice President of Marketing for a major global electronics company today into T1, Queues to drop off, an hour to bag drop and nearly as long for security. I just asked if he could rate Manchester T1 experience from 1-10. His reply was sorry doesn't even cut zero.
Disbelieve all the surveys you want, but the place is getting a severely bad name from premium pax.

Hence any further passenger expansion without facilities in place first will only add to that negative passenger experience.

We don't want sparkles- we want trouble free travel.

Last edited by Mr A Tis; 11th Jun 2018 at 22:54.
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Old 11th Jun 2018, 20:59
  #1690 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Valencia
Posts: 180
Just wish some of you guys could see what is regarded as a "decent" airport outside your limited experiences in Europe. I travel extensively in Asia and many Chinese cities, some of which you have probably never heard of, far outshine what Mancunians put up with on a daily basis.....in my honest opinion, MAN is really third world and will probably never catch up Asia as far as airport construction and efficiency are concerned. God knows what those coming off Cathay, Singapore and Hainan think of MAN.

Seems to me that far too many on this forum spend far too much time making excuses for and accepting a third class product at MAN. I will be through T3 next week and am certainly not looking forward to the experience based on past experiences in the last 18 months.

Oh, and BTW, I am originally from Cheshire and worked in the NW for many years and have seen MAN's growth over the years.
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Old 11th Jun 2018, 21:15
  #1691 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: London
Posts: 2,962
If MAN had billions upon billions of pounds, cheap labour, cheap materials and a government not concerned with the environment and people’s rights to give off large swathes of land, then I’m sure they too could have the glamour palaces of Hamad, Guangzhou, Incheon and so on.

its not excuses, it’s living within your means. Yes, the experience at MAN can be trying at times, but, To compare the experience at MAN with the likes of Changi is completely pointless and borderline absurd.

Yes, the T2 development is probably 10 years too late, but, we are where we are. The fact is, MAN are now trying to right it’s wrongs with the redevelopment. It’s not so much about expansion, but more, improvement.

I could go on, but I’ll probably just face the barrage of belittling comments as usual so I’ll accept them in cribs and drabs rather than one big hit.

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Old 11th Jun 2018, 21:25
  #1692 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: The brighter side of life.
Posts: 35
I travel through Dubai roughly 30 times a year and find the experience seamless, excellent lounges, the most extensive and best value duty free in the world, fast security, boarding direct from the lounges but what never fails to amuse and disappoint me at the same time is that my passport works flawlessly in the UAE E-gates every time in a matter of seconds when entering and leaving the country, (also the case in Australia and Singapore) yet in my home country, where Iím directed without choice to the e-border, I enter the gate, stand there for what feels like an age when thereís a huge queue of people behind you watching, until the machine finally decides to spit me out and send me for manual processing. Every single time without fail both at Manchester and Heathrow. Out of Manchesterís hands but angers me off so much whenever I enter the UK.

On top top of that, having flown through Manchester 21 times this year as a passenger, mostly to/from Dubai, what shocks me is that I board in a mega terminal displaying 21st century travel at its best only to disembark into the 70s in some creeky, cold and decrepit pier, up and down stairs, in some cases with queues back down the escalators to immigration.

And then traveling through T3, I just brace myself for the worst. It used to be the best place to fly out of in Manchester a decade ago, a calm and relaxing terminal and now itís just chaos. Even though staff at security will always see that Iím a well prepared traveller with my belt, laptop and liquids in hand before I approach them, they still find it necessary to talk to me and everyone else as if we are 2 year olds at kindergarten.

Then again, I think this is just modern day England shining through. All profits, no pride.
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Old 12th Jun 2018, 06:41
  #1693 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Stockport
Age: 52
Posts: 225
Originally Posted by CabinCrew747 View Post
I travel through Dubai roughly 30 times a year and find the experience seamless, excellent lounges, the most extensive and best value duty free in the world, fast security, boarding direct from the lounges but what never fails to amuse and disappoint me at the same time is that my passport works flawlessly in the UAE E-gates every time in a matter of seconds when entering and leaving the country, (also the case in Australia and Singapore) yet in my home country, where Iím directed without choice to the e-border, I enter the gate, stand there for what feels like an age when thereís a huge queue of people behind you watching, until the machine finally decides to spit me out and send me for manual processing. Every single time without fail both at Manchester and Heathrow. Out of Manchesterís hands but angers me off so much whenever I enter the UK.

On top top of that, having flown through Manchester 21 times this year as a passenger, mostly to/from Dubai, what shocks me is that I board in a mega terminal displaying 21st century travel at its best only to disembark into the 70s in some creeky, cold and decrepit pier, up and down stairs, in some cases with queues back down the escalators to immigration.

And then traveling through T3, I just brace myself for the worst. It used to be the best place to fly out of in Manchester a decade ago, a calm and relaxing terminal and now itís just chaos. Even though staff at security will always see that Iím a well prepared traveller with my belt, laptop and liquids in hand before I approach them, they still find it necessary to talk to me and everyone else as if we are 2 year olds at kindergarten.

Then again, I think this is just modern day England shining through. All profits, no pride.
Not wanting to be too political but one issue I have noticed in the bars, restaurants etc. at the airport is an apparent staff shortage. There is definitely an absence of E. European staff compared to a couple of years ago. These don't appear to have been replaced by as many eager young Brits wanting to do these jobs, hence the slow service and long queus etc. at certain times. I know many voted for Brexit and it's just one factor amongst others I'm sure but I don't think it's helped improve the service.
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Old 12th Jun 2018, 08:30
  #1694 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: East London
Age: 36
Posts: 970
Iíd concur with the last poster. Having never used MAN before as I reside in the south Iíve now used it a few times in the last few months because of the SEN service as it saves me time and money compared to the train.

Iíve used all three departures - 08:25, 17:00 and 20:45. My experience is consistent in security being absolutely fine and staff courteous, facilities clean, good wi-fi plus very generous at 4 hours free, and workstations and power being available around the gates (in T3). The frustration has been unacceptable queues for the food outlets to the point that I gave up once and didnít even bother another couple of times. Last time (am flight) one unit had no queue but I soon realised why - neither did it have any food available as theyíd already sold out, except for a few muffins. Iíve learnt to grab something at Piccadilly before arriving if Iím hungry.
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Old 12th Jun 2018, 09:47
  #1695 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Uk
Posts: 171
I did an exercise during the last week whereby I noted all TCX and VS long-haul movements so I could better grasp their schedules and the TCX one threw up a couple of questions.
1. How come there is different flight numbers for some routes despite departure time being at the same time. For example TCX2924 to LAS leaves at 9.15 on Tues and Sat, and TCX 2640 leaves at the same time to LAS on a Sun. Why not keep the same flight number?. (there is also 3 different flight numbers for JFK, 2852 Mon, Weds, Fri, 2848 Tues, Thurs, Sat and 2866 on Sun)
2. Also how come the same flight number does flights to the same destination at different times during different days. For example TCX2604 does MCO at 11.00 on Mon however on Weds and Fri it leaves at 12.00.
Also a question from the VS schedule:
ATL has been A333 for the last few weeks. It goes back to A332 next week, is this due to the 4th A332 being ready for service or are we taking back one from LGW?.

If anyone would like the spreadsheet don't hesitate to message me.
azz767 is online now  
Old 12th Jun 2018, 15:07
  #1696 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 606
London Stansted's new long haul routes drive growth

Manchester Airportís traffic was flat year on year (-0.7%). Growth is expected to return to Manchester during the busy summer season, as other airlines fill slots vacated by Monarch Airlines, which ceased trading in October 2017.
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Old 12th Jun 2018, 16:09
  #1697 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Where the next project takes me
Posts: 130
It surprises me somewhat that MAG and others prefer to badge the airport as a 'Northern Gateway'. It sounds peripheral and almost self-deprecating.
In my opinion this panders to a London-centric view of the world outside the M25.

Get a map of the British Isles and look at where Manchester Airport is. Draw a small circle around it (like a hub) and then draw lines from it to Glasgow, Edinburgh, Newcastle, Norwich, London, Southampton, Bournemouth, Exeter, Cardiff, Dublin and Belfast.....looks bang in the middle to me.

What about 'The UK's Central Gateway?
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Old 12th Jun 2018, 16:55
  #1698 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Wales
Posts: 805
Originally Posted by FFMAN View Post
It surprises me somewhat that MAG and others prefer to badge the airport as a 'Northern Gateway'. It sounds peripheral and almost self-deprecating.
In my opinion this panders to a London-centric view of the world outside the M25.

Get a map of the British Isles and look at where Manchester Airport is. Draw a small circle around it (like a hub) and then draw lines from it to Glasgow, Edinburgh, Newcastle, Norwich, London, Southampton, Bournemouth, Exeter, Cardiff, Dublin and Belfast.....looks bang in the middle to me.

What about 'The UK's Central Gateway?
Or maybe Northern Englands Gateway would be more accurate.
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Old 12th Jun 2018, 17:41
  #1699 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London
Posts: 7,085
Originally Posted by CabinCrew747 View Post
I travel through Dubai roughly 30 times a year and find the experience seamless, excellent lounges, the most extensive and best value duty free in the world, fast security, boarding direct from the lounges but what never fails to amuse and disappoint me at the same time is that my passport works flawlessly in the UAE E-gates every time in a matter of seconds when entering and leaving the country, (also the case in Australia and Singapore) yet in my home country, where Iím directed without choice to the e-border, I enter the gate, stand there for what feels like an age when thereís a huge queue of people behind you watching, until the machine finally decides to spit me out and send me for manual processing. Every single time without fail both at Manchester and Heathrow. Out of Manchesterís hands but angers me off so much whenever I enter the UK.

On top top of that, having flown through Manchester 21 times this year as a passenger, mostly to/from Dubai, what shocks me is that I board in a mega terminal displaying 21st century travel at its best only to disembark into the 70s in some creeky, cold and decrepit pier, up and down stairs, in some cases with queues back down the escalators to immigration.

And then traveling through T3, I just brace myself for the worst. It used to be the best place to fly out of in Manchester a decade ago, a calm and relaxing terminal and now itís just chaos. Even though staff at security will always see that Iím a well prepared traveller with my belt, laptop and liquids in hand before I approach them, they still find it necessary to talk to me and everyone else as if we are 2 year olds at kindergarten.

Then again, I think this is just modern day England shining through. All profits, no pride.
fair amount of evidence that uk border force see e gates . as threat to jobs. Early. versions suffered from sabotage, now they won' t switch them on as they prefer long queues to show how understaffed they are
Heathrow Harry is offline  
Old 12th Jun 2018, 18:11
  #1700 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Scotland
Posts: 146
Heathrow Harry, what utter rubbish about the e-gates. Border staff are definitely not causing queues to increase numbers, (although 40% cut in staffing levels since 2015 hasnít helped workloads welcome to austerity) if Border Force staff wanted to cause queues theyíd work to H&S rules, take their required breaks but the staff donít as they want to process passengers as quick as possible to get on with the casework that everyday generates.

The reason that the experience passengers get from gates around the world depends on databases that they use. U.K. database is different from Europe, which is different to US which is different to Canada. The gates reject people with similar names so that officers can confirm the persons identity. In U.K. some names are more common ie John Smith and that can mean people with common names having to use the manned desks. The e-gates are just another tool to aid the quicker processing of passengers that arenít of interest to Border Force. 95% of the rejection at the gates is an automated response that the gates software has decided that forever reason that person or document requires a check by an Officer to confirm that they can be admitted to the U.K.
Please remember Border Force is Law Enforcement, they monitor Sex Offenders, Counter Terrorism, Immigration Crime, Customs Crime, Human Trafficking, Forged & Counterfiet Docs this is on top of the role at the Border to identify wether that person should be admitted under the Immigration Act 71 or wether they require leave to enter. If they require leave to enter are they entitled to leave to enter.
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