Cardiff-2

[MerchantVenturer]

Originally Posted by Letsflycwl

Be interesting to see EZY reaction I guess, they’ve more of less saved BRS and made it what it is today, so imagine they will not be impressed at all. First FR and now Jet2...... would be amazing to see some “W” patterns through CWL to test the water as a result of this and to threaten BRS after all they’ve invested and done for BRS.

Makes it sound as if easyJet is some sort of charity that turned up at BRS for purely altruistic reasons and has now been spurned by an ungrateful supplicant. The reason easyJet has grown so much at BRS over most of this century is that it makes money there. Were that not the case it would not have stayed. A recent aviation analyst’s report concluded that BRS is one of the airline’s most profitable bases. The easyJet presence is mutually beneficial as the airport is very profitable for its owners, pandemic effects excepted.

That’s why airlines like easyJet, Ryanair, TUI and now Jet2 are prepared to operate a significant presence at a small airport site perched on top of a mist-laden hill, with a ski-jump size runway, poor surface connectivity in the middle of a Green Belt. Jet2 is partly a replacement for the former three-aircraft Thomas Cook operation anyway. TCX’s programme was never fully replaced by other airlines, especially its Greek and Turkish programme.

As for easyJet saving BRS - it has certainly paid a major part in the airport's growth - but it had already been saved by the time GoFly (soon to be acquired by easyJet) arrived in 2001. The real saviour was a a charismatic individual called Les Wilson who was appointed MD in 1980 at a time when the city council-owned airport was a loss-making, economic basket case supported by the long-suffering Bristol rate payers, of whom I was one. There were periodic local demands for its closure in the 1960s and 1970s. Les, whose arrival might well have been the last throw of the dice, recognised the potential of the catchment, as incidentally did Barbara Cassani (Go’s CEO) and her team twenty years later, and set about turning around the airport’s fortunes. Tragically he was killed in a motoring accident in 1995. By 2000 the airport had been growing steadily for many years and passed the 2 mppa barrier that year with its only low-cost carrier being Ryanair to Dublin, that also operated a CWL-DUB service then.

There should be no problem with aircraft parking at BRS next year. Five new stands have been built in the last few years, with more to come if the airport’s planning appeal is successful. Furthermore, the previously-based three Thomas Cook and five/six flybmi aircraft are now out of the picture, albeit larger aircraft could not use all the stands occupied by the small flybmi Embraers.

BRS’s real problem will arise if it loses its planning appeal and is stuck with a 10 mppa cap indefinitely. Had the pandemic not intervened the BRS management was projecting the 10 million annual cap being reached by the end of 2021 - it had reached a 12-month rolling total of nearly 9.2 million in February this year before the virus made its presence felt.

Perversely the pandemic might have helped BRS in the sense that it now has more time to ride out the appeal procedure, which could take a while, without the possibility of having to turn away business because its annual passenger cap had been reached.

Ryanair and TUI began some expansion at CWL (and at EXT) pre-pandemic and but for the emergency that might well have continued. It still might once aviation begins to get back to normal, or even sooner if the Jet2 arrival really does lead to some adjustment in travel patterns across Severnside. In any case if BRS is permanently capped at its current level an entirely new scenario will emerge in the South Wales/South West England aviation sector within the next few years. The Welsh Government and its airport company will certainly be watching with great interest - they both formally objected to the BRS planning application that was rejected by the local authority early this year.

[PDXCWL45]

Sadly for the planespotters there will be no non based airline operating for TUI for S21. The Monday PMI that was down as for a non based other airline has been shifted into the last evening slot on Mondays. I had hoped they'd go 3 weekly with TFS.
In summary 43 weekly departures 2 destinations lost Sharm el Sheikh and Naples, 3 based aircraft. For Summer 2020 i believe there was supposed to be 47 weekly departures.
Palma de Mallorca 6 weekly
Ibiza 3 weekly
Dalaman 3 weekly
Antalya 2 weekly
Lanzarote 2 weekly
Tenerife 2 weekly -1 weekly flight
Malaga 2 weekly
Alicante 2 weekly
Rhodes 2 weekly
Kos 2 weekly
Corfu 2 weekly
Menorca 2 weekly
Paphos 2 weekly
Zante 2 weekly
Bourgas 1 weekly
Larnaca 1 weekly
Heraklion 1 weekly
Keffalonia 1 weekly
Gran Canaria 1 weekly -1 weekly flight
Enfidha 1 weekly
Reus 1 weekly
Dubrovnik 1 weekly
Faro 1 weekly

[CWL757]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

Sadly for the planespotters there will be no non based airline operating for TUI for S21. The Monday PMI that was down as for a non based other airline has been shifted into the last evening slot on Mondays. I had hoped they'd go 3 weekly with TFS.
In summary 43 weekly departures 2 destinations lost Sharm el Sheikh and Naples, 3 based aircraft. For Summer 2020 i believe there was supposed to be 47 weekly departures.
Palma de Mallorca 6 weekly
Ibiza 3 weekly
Dalaman 3 weekly
Antalya 2 weekly
Lanzarote 2 weekly
Tenerife 2 weekly -1 weekly flight
Malaga 2 weekly
Alicante 2 weekly
Rhodes 2 weekly
Kos 2 weekly
Corfu 2 weekly
Menorca 2 weekly
Paphos 2 weekly
Zante 2 weekly
Bourgas 1 weekly
Larnaca 1 weekly
Heraklion 1 weekly
Keffalonia 1 weekly
Gran Canaria 1 weekly -1 weekly flight
Enfidha 1 weekly
Reus 1 weekly
Dubrovnik 1 weekly
Faro 1 weekly

Bittersweet really, whilst the non based was great for planespotters, it's good to see TUI purely using its own metal at CWL. It's also great to see the 3 a/c base is still happening, just a shame about SSH,NAP and The canaries being decreased though.

[PDXCWL45]

Originally Posted by CWL757

Bittersweet really, whilst the non based was great for planespotters, it's good to see TUI purely using its own metal at CWL. It's also great to see the 3 a/c base is still happening, just a shame about SSH,NAP and The canaries being decreased though.

It is a shame we won't see the likes of Freebird or Albastar or Norwegian next year but it's not surprising as considering everything going on with Covid19.
The loss of Egypt and the only Italian route is regrettable but I believe SSH is supposed to be operating in 2022 and hopefully when the cruise industry picks back up Naples will return. One good thing is that Dubrovnik wasn't cut as well.
Hopefully in the long run we might see a 4th based aircraft eventually but for now 3 will do nicely!

[yeo valley]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

It is a shame we won't see the likes of Freebird or Albastar or Norwegian next year but it's not surprising as considering everything going on with Covid19.
The loss of Egypt and the only Italian route is regrettable but I believe SSH is supposed to be operating in 2022 and hopefully when the cruise industry picks back up Naples will return. One good thing is that Dubrovnik wasn't cut as well.
Hopefully in the long run we might see a 4th based aircraft eventually but for now 3 will do nicely!

Reading on the BHX thread Norwegian wont be around next year.How true this is or someone jumping the gun i dont know,but time will tell.

[PDXCWL45]

Originally Posted by yeo valley

Reading on the BHX thread Norwegian wont be around next year.How true this is or someone jumping the gun i dont know,but time will tell.

People have been saying that about Norwegian for years!

[CWL757]

Do we know if TUI will be basing some SWG airframes here next year?

[PDXCWL45]

Originally Posted by CWL757

Do we know if TUI will be basing some SWG airframes here next year?

If the Max is in service by then I doubt it.

[yeo valley]

max

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

If the Max is in service by then I doubt it.

The max aircraft wont be in passenger revenue till at least the second quarter or third quarter due to flight testing and pilot training.

[PDXCWL45]

"English airports to benefit from new £100m covid support package"

https://t.co/qxz4WGcD9f
It'll be interesting to see what the Welsh government does as this politically could untie their hands a bit in providing financial support for CWL.

[PDXCWL45]

Vueling Alicante route is suspended from 7th January until 2nd March.

[fanrailuk]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

"English airports to benefit from new £100m covid support package"

https://t.co/qxz4WGcD9f
It'll be interesting to see what the Welsh government does as this politically could untie their hands a bit in providing financial support for CWL.

The Senedd has always provided financial support to airlines in the form of "marketing" - or that's how they claim to have given the support in the past

Plus CWL has always been in a positive position overall as they are publicly owned and therefore has the public purse on hand, unlike many other airports. Just a shame at this stage they have absolutely nothing to show for having this "upper hand".

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/w...-loan-17843878

However, I would find it very difficult for Westminster to justify giving support to English airports that have multi-million/billion dollar offshore private owners...

[PDXCWL45]

Originally Posted by fanrailuk

The Senedd has always provided financial support to airlines in the form of "marketing" - or that's how they claim to have given the support in the past

Plus CWL has always been in a positive position overall as they are publicly owned and therefore has the public purse on hand, unlike many other airports. Just a shame at this stage they have absolutely nothing to show for having this "upper hand".

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/w...-loan-17843878

However, I would find it very difficult for Westminster to justify giving support to English airports that have multi-million/billion dollar offshore private owners...

The Senedd hasn't ever given a penny to Cardiff Airport or airlines. The Welsh government has made a loan facility available to the airport as it's owner and has extended that most recently pre pandemic to which was going to used for things like runway resurfacing and replacement of ILS part of that money was diverted to be used by the airport for the pandemic. This loan is overseen by the Development bank of Wales and scrutinised by Senedd committees.
The WG only has a marketing agreement with Qatar Airways. Any other agreements are between airport and airline.
If Teesside is anything to go by maybe the WG will give the airport some sort of grant to pay their business rates for the year.

[caaardiff]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

The Senedd hasn't ever given a penny to Cardiff Airport or airlines. The Welsh government has made a loan facility available to the airport as it's owner and has extended that most recently pre pandemic to which was going to used for things like runway resurfacing and replacement of ILS part of that money was diverted to be used by the airport for the pandemic. This loan is overseen by the Development bank of Wales and scrutinised by Senedd committees.
The WG only has a marketing agreement with Qatar Airways. Any other agreements are between airport and airline.
If Teesside is anything to go by maybe the WG will give the airport some sort of grant to pay their business rates for the year.

Didn't the WG effectively charter Flybe under the Blackbird agreement?

[fanrailuk]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

The Senedd hasn't ever given a penny to Cardiff Airport or airlines. The Welsh government has made a loan facility available to the airport as it's owner and has extended that most recently pre pandemic to which was going to used for things like runway resurfacing and replacement of ILS part of that money was diverted to be used by the airport for the pandemic. This loan is overseen by the Development bank of Wales and scrutinised by Senedd committees.
The WG only has a marketing agreement with Qatar Airways. Any other agreements are between airport and airline.
If Teesside is anything to go by maybe the WG will give the airport some sort of grant to pay their business rates for the year.

"provided financial support" - suggests any form of money given to airlines, whether that be a loan to the airport or any other [marketing] agreement, it's taxpayers money...

[supermarine]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

The Senedd hasn't ever given a penny to Cardiff Airport or airlines. The Welsh government has made a loan facility available to the airport as it's owner and has extended that most recently pre pandemic to which was going to used for things like runway resurfacing and replacement of ILS part of that money was diverted to be used by the airport for the pandemic. This loan is overseen by the Development bank of Wales and scrutinised by Senedd committees.
The WG only has a marketing agreement with Qatar Airways. Any other agreements are between airport and airline.
If Teesside is anything to go by maybe the WG will give the airport some sort of grant to pay their business rates for the year.

hahaha dream on.

[PDXCWL45]

Originally Posted by caaardiff

Didn't the WG effectively charter Flybe under the Blackbird agreement?

No the deal was between the airport and the airline.

[PDXCWL45]

Originally Posted by supermarine

hahaha dream on.

Dream what? Do you want to dispute anything i said because it's all factually correct.

[caaardiff]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

No the deal was between the airport and the airline.

Where do you think the money came from to pay for it? And why do you think the routes created were to specific city routes that were marginal or pretty much loss making?
Regardless of who's name was on the contract, its about who was pulling the strings.

[SWBKCB]

Originally Posted by PDXCWL45

Dream what? Do you want to dispute anything i said because it's all factually correct.

The Senedd hasn't ever given a penny to Cardiff Airport or airlines.

The WG only has a marketing agreement with Qatar Airways.

Isn't there an inconsistency here or have I missed the point?