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Join Date: Jul 2017
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A Severnside airport has been muted before but never got off the ground. In the end it would be unacceptable for Wales as a country to close it's busiest airport down and move it to England and Bristol would've never been closed down either. Both Cardiff and Bristol aren't in the best of places but Bristol has shown that doesn't prevent it from being successful. Provide airlines and destinations that people want to fly to at the right prices and people will use the airport. With Cardiffs increasing passenger numbers that is being proved.
Things are certainly better at Cardiff now it is back in public ownership Jerry. However its location is the big stumbling block.
I reckon it has reached its optimum. It will never attract passengers from upstream of the bridges because of Birmingham.
I am old enough to remember the Wardair 747 trans atlantic flights of the mid eighties being touted as the start of many operators on that route. It never happened.
I reckon it has reached its optimum. It will never attract passengers from upstream of the bridges because of Birmingham.
I am old enough to remember the Wardair 747 trans atlantic flights of the mid eighties being touted as the start of many operators on that route. It never happened.
Apart from the "unacceptable to Wales" bit (really? :rolleyes, Jerry is right - we are where we are and need to accept that. BRS is unrecognizable from what it was and (like LTN) shows that if you deliver what the market wants, that largely overcomes a constrained site and less than ideal location.
Wardair seems a strange example - they had an extensive network from many UK regional airports which doesn't exist now, so not just CWL.
Wardair seems a strange example - they had an extensive network from many UK regional airports which doesn't exist now, so not just CWL.
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It doesn't matter which side of the Severn Crossing it is on, now that they are supposedly doing away with the tolls, but an airport pretty close to either side would do pretty well what with M4, M5 and rail connections.
Alas the subject matter around these parts always seems to turn to a Wales vs England thing, think about Basle and Mulhouse as an example, if the Swiss and the French can share that airport isn't there hope for a Wales/England shared airport yet?
Alas the subject matter around these parts always seems to turn to a Wales vs England thing, think about Basle and Mulhouse as an example, if the Swiss and the French can share that airport isn't there hope for a Wales/England shared airport yet?
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Wales is a country the last time I checked so it would be unacceptable for it too lose it's busiest airport. The reason the Welsh government bought it was too secure it's future.
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But Basel isn't Switzerland's or France's only proper airport. For Wales Cardiff is.
Any shared airport would have to be in Wales which I don't think would be acceptable then to the West country. In the end both sides just have to get the best out of the airports they have.
Any shared airport would have to be in Wales which I don't think would be acceptable then to the West country. In the end both sides just have to get the best out of the airports they have.
Join Date: Nov 2005
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With the right carrier, offering the right schedule and prices, people from the Southwest will find CWL an attractive option. Maybe not the preferred option every time, but if the price is right at the time.
There's talk again of improved road links from the M4. 5 mile lane is apparently getting upgraded, although I've not seen the plans for that.
Let not forget the large amount of leakage to other Airports from the Welsh catchment. For South Wales originating passengers CWL is only 20 mins off the M4 and most people wouldn't chose not to book from CWL just because of the links.
No-one knows what the likes of QR will do to inbound tourism but transport links will need to be looked at soon. The rail link could do with being improved, maybe Arriva could look at extending the Merthyr-Bridgend service to Swansea at least. A bus service to the West is also required.
CWL's growth is nowhere near the likes of BRS and other Airports, but it has a lot to prove and a long way to go to rebuild confidence of travellers and Airlines.
There's talk again of improved road links from the M4. 5 mile lane is apparently getting upgraded, although I've not seen the plans for that.
Let not forget the large amount of leakage to other Airports from the Welsh catchment. For South Wales originating passengers CWL is only 20 mins off the M4 and most people wouldn't chose not to book from CWL just because of the links.
No-one knows what the likes of QR will do to inbound tourism but transport links will need to be looked at soon. The rail link could do with being improved, maybe Arriva could look at extending the Merthyr-Bridgend service to Swansea at least. A bus service to the West is also required.
CWL's growth is nowhere near the likes of BRS and other Airports, but it has a lot to prove and a long way to go to rebuild confidence of travellers and Airlines.
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With the right carrier, offering the right schedule and prices, people from the Southwest will find CWL an attractive option. Maybe not the preferred option every time, but if the price is right at the time.
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But you can't change geography ... As an example expecting somebody who lives in Taunton to take a flight from CWL might be comparable to expecting somebody who lives in Ayr to take a flight from CAL.
And the right carries with the right routes and the right schedule is already in the market. At Bristol.
QR is prime example of a market filler that isn't in Bristol.
There are other carriers around that would attract people from using other Airports (Not just BRS)
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Do you not heve Google in Wales? Presuming not, CAL is Campbeltown. It's a similar distance from Ayr (which is on PIKs doorstep) to both GLA and CAL. Despite this I doubt many, if anyone at all from Ayr uses CAL. Hence geography not being the only factor.
Foget distance in miles. It's somewhat irrelevant. Distance in terms of journey time is far more important.
A question to the Cardiff fans. What is your expectation for Cardiff in terms of passenger numbers? Do you see CWL as a 500k airport? 1 million? 2 million pax? More? Genuine question. Thanks.
Foget distance in miles. It's somewhat irrelevant. Distance in terms of journey time is far more important.
A question to the Cardiff fans. What is your expectation for Cardiff in terms of passenger numbers? Do you see CWL as a 500k airport? 1 million? 2 million pax? More? Genuine question. Thanks.
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Taunton - BRS - 36 miles - 50 mins
Taunton - CWL - 91miles - 1hr40
Taunton - BHX - 135miles - 2hr10
Taunton - LHR - 136miles - 2hr30 / or 153 mile - 2hr30 using M4
Taunton - LGW - 160miles - 2hr47
Ayr - CAL - 170 miles - 3hr43
I still don't see the relevance of using Ayr and CAL as the geography and offerings from the Airport are completely different, and the journey time is double that of Taunton to CWL. My point is that if people from Southwest and South Wales are willing to drive 2 hours plus to BHX or London, why wouldn't people from the Southwest take the under 2 hour option and go to CWL..... if the price is right.
Just using QR are an example.
CWL-DOH 17 Jul returning 24 Jul - £580.07
BHX-DOH £690.99
LHR-DOH £572.31
Surely CWL being the closest and only £8 more expensive than the cheapest fare of the three would be a no brainer.
This isn't about blowing smoke up CWL's rear. It's about being realistic. CWL will likely to struggle to top 2m by 2020, but it's on the up. It will never be BRS, but it's making progress.
QR surprised everyone and no doubt there's more to it for Wales rather than just CWL behind the deal, but it could well be a catalyst for growth.
CWL is accessible if the right offering is there. It's not going to bring ground breaking figures through the doors, but people will travel to where the price is right. I've worked in the industry long enough to see that.
Taunton - CWL - 91miles - 1hr40
Taunton - BHX - 135miles - 2hr10
Taunton - LHR - 136miles - 2hr30 / or 153 mile - 2hr30 using M4
Taunton - LGW - 160miles - 2hr47
Ayr - CAL - 170 miles - 3hr43
I still don't see the relevance of using Ayr and CAL as the geography and offerings from the Airport are completely different, and the journey time is double that of Taunton to CWL. My point is that if people from Southwest and South Wales are willing to drive 2 hours plus to BHX or London, why wouldn't people from the Southwest take the under 2 hour option and go to CWL..... if the price is right.
Just using QR are an example.
CWL-DOH 17 Jul returning 24 Jul - £580.07
BHX-DOH £690.99
LHR-DOH £572.31
Surely CWL being the closest and only £8 more expensive than the cheapest fare of the three would be a no brainer.
This isn't about blowing smoke up CWL's rear. It's about being realistic. CWL will likely to struggle to top 2m by 2020, but it's on the up. It will never be BRS, but it's making progress.
QR surprised everyone and no doubt there's more to it for Wales rather than just CWL behind the deal, but it could well be a catalyst for growth.
CWL is accessible if the right offering is there. It's not going to bring ground breaking figures through the doors, but people will travel to where the price is right. I've worked in the industry long enough to see that.
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If the airport keeps growing as it is, it should be about at the 1.8 million passenger mark in 2020. I personally would consider that between the 2.5 million to 3 million passenger mark in the very long term as achievable and would count that as very successful.
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Just using QR are an example.
CWL-DOH 17 Jul returning 24 Jul - £580.07
BHX-DOH £690.99
LHR-DOH £572.31
CWL-DOH 17 Jul returning 24 Jul - £580.07
BHX-DOH £690.99
LHR-DOH £572.31
There is a mentality amongst the travelling public that between two countries, let's say UK and Thailand, their only flight options would be BA and a Thai airline, when I lived in the midlands the amount of idiots that would drive past such an airport as BHX en-route to LHR for their believed only flight options!
But ultimate destination DOH is not a good price comparison example as DOH is not that many people's ultimate destination nor is it Qatar's core business, for those dates I just checked and one can fly LON/BKK/LON via DXB for £500 ... less than it costs to fly CWL/DOH/CWL!
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There is a mentality amongst the travelling public that between two countries, let's say UK and Thailand, their only flight options would be BA and a Thai airline, when I lived in the midlands the amount of idiots that would drive past such an airport as BHX en-route to LHR for their believed only flight options!
But ultimate destination DOH is not a good price comparison example as DOH is not that many people's ultimate destination nor is it Qatar's core business, for those dates I just checked and one can fly LON/BKK/LON via DXB for £500 ... less than it costs to fly CWL/DOH/CWL!
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I saw a post elsewhere saying that the departures lounge expansion has started with the area by Gate 1 and where the games machine were, all closed up with Costa signage up as well and that FCO seems to be doing well for the dead of winter with a passenger load of 70 to 80 on yesterday.