Southampton-2

[JSCL]

Originally Posted by bad bear

Basically any airline operating a "W" pattern through Southampton would need to ensure that the plane and the crew are certified as above. This means either all of the planes and crew need training/ certifying or only the few that operate to Southampton and risk disruption if there is a crew or plane change due to operational reasons.

Also, Boeing article showing decreased cross wind limits and need to increase VMCG leading to higher V1 and therefor more risk of a high speed abandon and more time for engine to fail on take off.
http://www.smartcockpit.com/docs/Nar...Operations.pdf

not being negative , just bringing facts from many years flying both airbus and Boeing

You mean to debunk the wikipedia specification readers? How dare you.

[Gurnard]

Originally Posted by Flitefone

Meanwhile, life goes on.

The aviation industry is in the midst of its biggest ever existential crisis. As things stand today, IATA are expecting recovery to 2019 levels around 2025, others have different views. Paris Airports for instance expect recovery by 2027. The generally accepted rate of recovery around the industry is building this year from -50 to 60% below 2019 traffic, rising to -30% in 2021, -10-15% in 2022 and so on. Of course no one knows for sure.

Many airlines and airports have had little or no income for six months, they are bleeding cash at unsustainable levels, there is a very real prospect that more will go bust and disappear this winter, meanwhile, those with a good balance sheet will expand into the gaps arising. Just as at SOU routes vacated by Flybe are being picked up by others - but for the foreseeable future at a much reduced capacity. LGW for instance is likely to see more Ryanair and Wizz, taking advantage of the doubts about return of Virgin, Norwegian and others.

The financial press is reporting that distressed airlines and airports are selling assets to raise cash, such as sale and lease back of aircraft, buildings, aircraft engines and land. Terminals are being closed and mothballed around the world.

For most regional airports in the UK and elsewhere, survival is the objective for at least the next two years, then recovery. Investment on the other hand is a long way off. The only thing that airports can currently control is cost, they have no significant ability to drive revenue for which many are certainly desperate.

In the meantime, airports are running on skeleton staffing levels, thousands of airport staff have already been made redundant in the UK alone. Not to mention the airline redundancies and those in air traffic control. Domestic and leisure travel is expected to lead the recovery when it comes.... so, if you want to support your local airport, there is only one strategy that might work; USE IT... or perhaps more than ever before, you will lose it!

FF

Well said FF; a sensible and reasoned post. This forum is for rumours and news, rather than for opinions - some of which are grossly deluded or plain childish fantasy. Angry ranting gets nowhere and should be taken elsewhere. Constructive analysis, as in the above post, gets to the core of the matter and assists in intelligent debate.

[TCAS FAN]

With all this discussion on SOU runway width, apologies for going back to the comparison with SEN but they have a 36 metre width rather than SOU's 37 metres, and also a LDA 1604 metres, less than SOU's. Doesn't appear to bother RYR & EZY.

[SKOJB]

Originally Posted by TCAS FAN

With all this discussion on SOU runway width, apologies for going back to the comparison with SEN but they have a 36 metre width rather than SOU's 37 metres, and also a LDA 1604 metres, less than SOU's. Doesn't appear to bother RYR & EZY.

Agreed but for the majority of posters, they dare suggest anything positive and are only looking for every scenario why x, y and z won’t happen. It’s true the airport has it’s limitations which have been relentlessly pointed out recently but my word does it have some very positive benefits also. Bottom line is that if the extension is completed, there is nothing to suggest that the likes of EZY or any other airline won’t take a look at offering a limited selection of services, based aircraft or not, to the Med region as before and they will not be distracted by a north south runway nor it being only 37m in width as long as the finances make sense. Let’s wait and see!

[Dropoffcharge]

Originally Posted by TCAS FAN

also a LDA 1604 metres, less than SOU's. Doesn't appear to bother RYR & EZY.

Is that all down to the grooved runway surface at SEN? I dont know the exact stats on gains etc, or if its only applicable in wet conditions? That's maybe something SOU could also look at if the advantages are proven.

[SWBKCB]

EZY/RYR flights out of SEN is (was) mainly operated by based crews. bad bear was pointing out the difficulties in having an operation at SOU based mainly on 'W' flights flown by non-based crews.

Basically any airline operating a "W" pattern through Southampton would need to ensure that the plane and the crew are certified as above. This means either all of the planes and crew need training/ certifying or only the few that operate to Southampton and risk disruption if there is a crew or plane change due to operational reasons.

[TCAS FAN]

Originally Posted by Dropoffcharge

Is that all down to the grooved runway surface at SEN? I dont know the exact stats on gains etc, or if its only applicable in wet conditions? That's maybe something SOU could also look at if the advantages are proven.

The issue of a grooved runway is mentioned many posts ago. SOU has a grooved asphalt runway, but it does not apparently work as it should do due to the runway having a crossfall for drainage rather than being cambered.

Most of the problem was/is due to those doing the runway inspections not adhering to the standard whereby a matt appearance of the runway surface = Damp, and a shiny appearance = Wet. Been many years since I last came up against this frustration, maybe the many changes in Ops management have now resullted in this issue being finally resolved.

[RW20]

Originally Posted by TCAS FAN

The issue of a grooved runway is mentioned many posts ago. SOU has a grooved asphalt runway, but it does not apparently work as it should do due to the runway having a crossfall for drainage rather than being cambered.

Most of the problem was/is due to those doing the runway inspections not adhering to the standard whereby a matt appearance of the runway surface = Damp, and a shiny appearance = Wet. Been many years since I last came up against this frustration, maybe the many changes in Ops management have now resullted in this issue being finally resolved.

TCAS CAN
It appears that the heavy recent rain has highlighted the old chestnut of wet runway at SOU. ATIS recently reporting wet/wet/wet on many days,perhaps you could clarify
" has anything changed" in runway drainage,if not I presume E145 operations must be compromised in Winter operations at SOU.
On a separate note a light aircraft requested diversion for Lee recently ,but with a £250 landing fee plus extortionate parking fees it inevitably landed at Hurn,where such charges are more acceptable.How can SOU expect to survive if it doesn't open up to GA with reasonable pricing?

[HershamBoys]

Because 'reasonable pricing' probably doesn't cover the cost of ensuring that on arrival and subsequent departure the GA aircraft and its occupants are segregated from the critical part of the security restricted area. At airports with restricted space which handle commercial traffic required to be protected in accordance with a National Aviation Security Programme, it takes either considerable staffing dedicated to managing GA crew and passengers, or a significant investment in security technology, with appropriate personnel ready to respond in the event of the GA occupants straying, to ensure that the Critical Part is not infringed. Infringements of the CP by unscreened people are significant security events, and can seriously disrupt airport operations. It is much simpler for airports to devolve GA handling to agents who can provide demarcated areas (1). That transfers the onus onto the agent to satisfy the airport's security requirements, and permits the airport to say to its own security inspectors, in the event of a breach, "it was the agent that let us down, and we're taking appropriate steps to resolve the issue with them", and frees the airport of the cost of providing an area segregated for GA and staffing its security.

Eventually, it all becomes too much, and only top end GA can absorb the cost of segregation. Its all about the economics of operating an airport, really

HB

(1) 'demarcated area' means an area that is separated by means of access control either from security restricted areas, or, if the demarcated area itself is a security restricted area, from other security restricted areas of an airport;

[stewyb]

Latest changes to EZY schedule, reduced to one weekly in Jan (Sat) and two weekly in Mar (Sat & Sun). BOH also one weekly during Jan!

[rog747]

Originally Posted by stewyb

Latest changes to EZY schedule, reduced to one weekly in Jan (Sat) and two weekly in Mar (Sat & Sun). BOH also one weekly during Jan!

Shame, not a surprise though as sadly not many folk will book an advance Ski Hol right now with both France and Switzerland on the no go travel list + quarantine...

[SeanM1997]

Loganair S21 frequencies from Southampton:

Edinburgh - Southampton - 25x weekly flights (4x M-Fr, 2x Sa, 3x Su)
Glasgow - Southampton - 25x weekly flights (4x M-Fr, 2x Sa, 3x Su)
Newcastle - Southampton - 18x weekly flights (3x M-Fr, 1x Sa, 2x Su) - 1x M-Th extends to/from Aberdeen

[adfly]

The following is currently on sale for next summer:

Blue Islands (1x AT7 based)

Dublin - 7x weekly
Guernsey - 29 weekly (same as originally planned for S20)
Jersey - 23 weekly (as above)
Manchester - 19 weekly

Eastern Airways (4x AT7 based)

Aberdeen - 5 weekly J41 (via Teesside)
Belfast City - 11 weekly AT7 (1 weekly J41 on a Sunday showing in booking engine at the moment, will take the assumption that the winter schedule will carry over as with the other routes and it is a glitch...)
Dublin - 12 weekly AT7 (only route with a Sat flight)
Leeds Bradford - 10 weekly J41
Manchester - 16 weekly AT7
Newcastle - 11 weekly AT7
Teesside - 6 weekly J41

Loganair

Aberdeen - 4 weekly ER3 (via Newcastle)
Edinburgh - 25 weekly ER4
Glasgow - 25 weekly ER4
Newcastle - 18 weekly ER3

TUI

Palma - 2 weekly (Volotea)

Not a bad start with Aurigny and KLM still to release flights (it is rather early of course...). Be nice to see some of the French routes picked up again - would think they'd be a no brainer over the peak summer especially with a very lightly utilised aircraft (Eastern...).

SeanM1997 we seem to have posted almost in sync again!

[The96er]

Originally Posted by adfly

The following is currently on sale for next summer:

Blue Islands (1x AT7 based)

Dublin - 7x weekly
Guernsey - 29 weekly (same as originally planned for S20)
Jersey - 23 weekly (as above)
Manchester - 19 weekly

Eastern Airways (4x AT7 based)

Aberdeen - 5 weekly J41 (via Teesside)
Belfast City - 11 weekly AT7 (1 weekly J41 on a Sunday showing in booking engine at the moment, will take the assumption that the winter schedule will carry over as with the other routes and it is a glitch...)
Dublin - 12 weekly AT7 (only route with a Sat flight)
Leeds Bradford - 10 weekly J41
Manchester - 16 weekly AT7
Newcastle - 11 weekly AT7
Teesside - 6 weekly J41

Without sounding too pessimistic, I can't see both Eastern and Blue Islands continuing to serve MAN and DUB come summer time in compitition with each other. I suspect one will blink first long before the summer schedule.

[adfly]

Originally Posted by The96er

Without sounding too pessimistic, I can't see both Eastern and Blue Islands continuing to serve MAN and DUB come summer time in compitition with each other. I suspect one will blink first long before the summer schedule.

I'd be inclined to agree. Hopefully one airline will graciously fall on their sword if they both can't make them work. We know what damage needless fare wars with other regional airlines did for Flybe after all (far from their only financial issue, but definitely one of them)...

[Mr A Tis]

35 flights a week SOU-MAN - I don't think so somehow.

[BACsuperVC10]

Originally Posted by The96er

Without sounding too pessimistic, I can't see both Eastern and Blue Islands continuing to serve MAN and DUB come summer time in compitition with each other. I suspect one will blink first long before the summer schedule.

Tend to agree, I can't see two airlines on regional UK / Ireland routes working, especially now.

[SKOJB]

Several SOU KLM cancellations in the coming days, guess a sign of the times unfortunately!

[The Nutts Mutts]

It looks like KLM will be running 4 weekly for the rest of September, with the Tuesday, Wednesday and Saturday flights dropped most weeks. Sign of the times as you say. I don't see it changing until the Netherlands is taken off the quarantine list.

[The Nutts Mutts]

Aurigny

Guernsey is going double daily from the 21st September as planned, but the start date for flights to Alderney has been pushed back to the 5th October.