Southend-2
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Leeds, UK & Cork, Ireland
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It's an interesting discussion, but I think we can rest assured that FR have carried out all the necessary evaluations, have a plan in place and are not just going to suck it and see.
Brian..e tickets
From what I understood when I tried to buy one is that I still had to get one printed from the station ticket machine..or maybe I was trying the wrong app as it didn't give me the choice of using my phone for travel.
as for complaining to a bulldog behind the desk ..did that in the 70s and got off loaded from the aircraft in Jersey and told to get the boat back. The second was to the station chief in Vilnius after I caught her stealing from the aircraft.. nearly lost my command on that one and whilst the airline lasted forever had problems buying tickets and regularly down graded from business class..
as for complaining to a bulldog behind the desk ..did that in the 70s and got off loaded from the aircraft in Jersey and told to get the boat back. The second was to the station chief in Vilnius after I caught her stealing from the aircraft.. nearly lost my command on that one and whilst the airline lasted forever had problems buying tickets and regularly down graded from business class..
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Leeds, UK & Cork, Ireland
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It may depend on the app. The Trainline app gives a little pop-up to say mobile tickets are available, so acceptance may have changed. Not all tickets are available digitally. Anything with a TFL travelcard or cross London journey has to be printed on ticket stock, so if you were going beyond "London Terminals" you would have required a ticket in any case.
It may depend on the app. The Trainline app gives a little pop-up to say mobile tickets are available, so acceptance may have changed. Not all tickets are available digitally. Anything with a TFL travelcard or cross London journey has to be printed on ticket stock, so if you were going beyond "London Terminals" you would have required a ticket in any case.
I calculated that the standard 738 could just carry 190 pax into SEN with a dry runway but that commercial operations were not viable due to the fact that it would be excessively payload restricted in WET conditions. Perhaps there is someone here with access to the OM and they could quantify that restriction accurately. The standard 738 does seem to have a higher Vapp than, say, the A320 so perhaps that is one of the reasons for its greater LDR.
Both SEN and SOU ops using the 737-800 or the new MAX are not going to be economically viable for any LCC operator with the runways as they are.
The performance penalties and payload restrictions are too great - hence why no one has used this type to date at either airport in any numbers - same applies to GIB ops too.
Not gonna happen with a 738 or a MAX, they are slippery fast beasts on approach.
The 737-300 to the 700 series are very different beasts and all those types can op OK to/from the above airports.
My pal flies both 737 & Max at Norwegian (he is a skipper) - he has crunched numbers for ops in and out of SOU (and GIB) and the £££figures do not add up with the severe payload penalties
Assume SEN is very similar due to runway length - Is this why FR are switching to using Lauda's A320's??? - these aircraft are much more suitable for ops out of SEN and SOU
Time will see if Ryanair will be successful or not using its 738 out of SEN
The performance penalties and payload restrictions are too great - hence why no one has used this type to date at either airport in any numbers - same applies to GIB ops too.
Not gonna happen with a 738 or a MAX, they are slippery fast beasts on approach.
The 737-300 to the 700 series are very different beasts and all those types can op OK to/from the above airports.
My pal flies both 737 & Max at Norwegian (he is a skipper) - he has crunched numbers for ops in and out of SOU (and GIB) and the £££figures do not add up with the severe payload penalties
Assume SEN is very similar due to runway length - Is this why FR are switching to using Lauda's A320's??? - these aircraft are much more suitable for ops out of SEN and SOU
Time will see if Ryanair will be successful or not using its 738 out of SEN
Last edited by rog747; 31st Dec 2018 at 15:38.
rog747
You musn't confuse the standard 738 with the 738SFP as the latter has been produced specifically to allow operations into airports which previously could not support viable 738 operations. Those aircraft with the SFP package can operate viably from SEN and, probably, from SOU as well.
You musn't confuse the standard 738 with the 738SFP as the latter has been produced specifically to allow operations into airports which previously could not support viable 738 operations. Those aircraft with the SFP package can operate viably from SEN and, probably, from SOU as well.
I'm not,
My pal at DI/D8 mentions the 737NG/SFP Short Field package option versions also suffer payload limitations when operating in 189 pax high density configurations
Time will tell if Ryanair make a go of it out of SEN with their 738 or MAX - The MAX is even more restricted
They quit Belfast Harbour BHD due to such limits
My pal at DI/D8 mentions the 737NG/SFP Short Field package option versions also suffer payload limitations when operating in 189 pax high density configurations
Time will tell if Ryanair make a go of it out of SEN with their 738 or MAX - The MAX is even more restricted
They quit Belfast Harbour BHD due to such limits
Join Date: Aug 2012
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Is SEN just getting standard grooving or will the runway be certified 'WSR'. Only a damp standard grooved runway can be considered dry for purposes of calculations. But WSR is a different beast and is prob required to keep the show on the road when the rain comes.
RYR quite happily operate in and out of Dortmund which has a LDA of 1700m, prob the shortest LDA in the existing network. But it has certification for WSR which makes a big difference.
The shortest I've operated quite a bit in to is in the region of 1800m and yes when wet and full pax its quite limiting in how much extra fuel one can have so 1600 is gonna be fun, especially combined with narrow runway ops!
RYR quite happily operate in and out of Dortmund which has a LDA of 1700m, prob the shortest LDA in the existing network. But it has certification for WSR which makes a big difference.
The shortest I've operated quite a bit in to is in the region of 1800m and yes when wet and full pax its quite limiting in how much extra fuel one can have so 1600 is gonna be fun, especially combined with narrow runway ops!
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I'm not,
My pal at DI/D8 mentions the 737NG/SFP Short Field package option versions also suffer payload limitations when operating in 189 pax high density configurations
Time will tell if Ryanair make a go of it out of SEN with their 738 or MAX - The MAX is even more restricted
They quit Belfast Harbour BHD due to such limits
My pal at DI/D8 mentions the 737NG/SFP Short Field package option versions also suffer payload limitations when operating in 189 pax high density configurations
Time will tell if Ryanair make a go of it out of SEN with their 738 or MAX - The MAX is even more restricted
They quit Belfast Harbour BHD due to such limits
Well, that's a correct statement but the runway at BHD was going to be extended and the endless delays made FR walk (or fly if you prefer).
They know exactly what they're getting at SEN. A 1799m declared runway (which I believe is actually 1856m), and a LDA of 1604m. Plus additional paved extension which gives you close to 2000m. And I do understand that the declared distances are the only ones that can be used, but when distances stated are the absolute minimum requirement, surely additional paved distance would be taken into consideration by the decision makers.
They know exactly what they're getting at SEN. A 1799m declared runway (which I believe is actually 1856m), and a LDA of 1604m. Plus additional paved extension which gives you close to 2000m. And I do understand that the declared distances are the only ones that can be used, but when distances stated are the absolute minimum requirement, surely additional paved distance would be taken into consideration by the decision makers.
WSR certification? I'm afraid I'm not familiar with that term.
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No W(h)izz unfortunately...
But certainly whizz added to SEN...
Stobart state they have bought two robots which "whizz" around the airport to answer customer queries.
But certainly whizz added to SEN...
Stobart state they have bought two robots which "whizz" around the airport to answer customer queries.