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Old 24th Oct 2018, 08:50
  #2141 (permalink)  
 
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The Stobart Group half-year results published today state that the Flybe franchise is being ended with the jet ops ceasing before the end of March 2019 and the ATR ops ceasing before the end of February 2020. I cannot see any mention of CAX let alone the proposed SEN route to be operated by Loganair.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 09:16
  #2142 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Expressflight View Post
The Stobart Group half-year results published today state that the Flybe franchise is being ended with the jet ops ceasing before the end of March 2019 and the ATR ops ceasing before the end of February 2020. I cannot see any mention of CAX let alone the proposed SEN route to be operated by Loganair.
Just us well the franchise is ending - the cost of operation of the franchise has been huge and has run at a substantial financial loss. I have applauded Stobart for their commitment to the franchise as it has brought in FR and their 3 aircraft however I am surprised at the level of losses involved in running the BE routes. Let's hope having FR at the airport is a profitable proposition.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 10:11
  #2143 (permalink)  
 
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Stobart Group loses £17.5m in the first half of the year.

Stobart Air itself loses £2.7m in the first half of the year.

Blames Flybe franchise.

Re general comments concerning RYR ops above & previously,it defies any commercial logic that RYR require a market to be worked up for them they would be in a sorry state indeed if Stobart were employed or used as a trailblazer.

Other factors in play with RYR/SEN & Stobart appear the more likely.

More heavy overall expenditure yet for Stobart as the SEN R/W upgrade to enable the RYR ops has yet to commence.

RYR will insist on priority with EVERYTHING when ops commence so perhaps if less a/c working out of SEN will be a bonus & less of a headache for Stobart ops.

Legal aftermath of boardroom tussles with certain personalities within Stobart Group continues.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 10:48
  #2144 (permalink)  
 
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Once Stobart Air cease ops from SEN, I wonder if any of the dumped routes like Rennes, Antwerp, and Groningen would be of interest to others?
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 11:30
  #2145 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tophat27dt View Post
Once Stobart Air cease ops from SEN, I wonder if any of the dumped routes like Rennes, Antwerp, and Groningen would be of interest to others?
I do not expect the ATR routes to be dumped. They are to be continued for another year (until Feb 2020) under the flybe franchise and then it is unclear. The commercial and operational performance does not seem to be so bad to dump them. Possibly Stobart is looking for a commercial agreement with another airline from spring 2020. But I am sure they will also continue to talk to flybe.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 12:10
  #2146 (permalink)  
 
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Flybe franchise at SEN

Essentially the Flybe routes from SEN are of course actually Stobart Air routes using the Flybe brand name / booking engine as part of the franchise. So with that in mind, surely the quoted losses are not down to the flybe franchise but with the Stobart Air routes and operation ex-SEN. I know that's basically what it says, but has been worded well enough to make the blame look like Flybe... Or perhaps they are blaming the IOM operation for the majority of the losses instead?

That aside, this very operation clearly seems to have done its job in attracting new routes and carriers into SEN. Something they probably wouldn't have been able to have done so well on under their own name and i can't realistically think of any other airline than Flybe which would have been a better fit for it.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 16:13
  #2147 (permalink)  
 
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All I can say Cazza it is a very expensive and damaging way of trying to attract new airlines to Southend. I cannot imagine Stobart making much profit from Ryanair in its first year of operation. They drive a very hard bargain as we all know. Not a good day for all concerned.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 17:53
  #2148 (permalink)  
 
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It is unrealistic to suggest the Stobart Air operation "has done it`s job" & attracted new routes & carriers into SEN.

As usual the statement is "smoke & mirrors" which no one comprehends but at least the shareholders are happy with as previously an increased dividend keeping them sweet.

Outsiders require to read between the lines if they can be bother.

Ryanair will be the cuckoo in the little SEN nest & will insist on priority with every aspect of airfield ops too.

When is the R/W upgrade due to commence?.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 18:08
  #2149 (permalink)  
 
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It is unrealistic to suggest the Stobart Air operation "has done it`s job" & attracted new routes & carriers into SEN.
Why? this was Stobarts stated aim when they started up the routes. If you know otherwise, why not just say so?
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 18:23
  #2150 (permalink)  
 
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It definitely was Stobart's intention to demonstrate to larger carriers that SEN could support untried routes with a view to passing these on to such carriers. You have only to look at the routes which EZY and RYR have taken on in this way. Is it suggested that they would have done so without the Stobart initiative? Rather a coincidence n'est-ce pas? Whether the investment that was needed to achieve their aims was justified only time will tell but it certainly cannot be dismissed at this stage.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 18:43
  #2151 (permalink)  
 
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JET OPERATIONS

Was it not said a while ago (was it in the Irish Times?) that Stobart planned to withdraw two E195 aircraft from SEN? That leaves one so what will be happening with that one, I wonder?
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 21:20
  #2152 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by limited_sight View Post
I do not expect the ATR routes to be dumped. They are to be continued for another year (until Feb 2020) under the flybe franchise and then it is unclear. The commercial and operational performance does not seem to be so bad to dump them. Possibly Stobart is looking for a commercial agreement with another airline from spring 2020. But I am sure they will also continue to talk to flybe.
I would also be surprised if these routes were ďdumpedĒ. If they are loss making, surely they would be wound down this winter along with the rest of the operation. As it stands, these routes offer a niche within the wider London market for which there is no obvious alternative. There might even be an opportunity and a case to scale it up a bit further with another ATR or two, for example the Derry PSO will come up for grabs, there may be others like that or routes that get vacated.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 00:15
  #2153 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SEN Observer View Post
Was it not said a while ago (was it in the Irish Times?) that Stobart planned to withdraw two E195 aircraft from SEN? That leaves one so what will be happening with that one, I wonder?
Keeping the route to Dublin nicely ticking over until FR take over at the start of April. After that????
​​​​​​
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 09:29
  #2154 (permalink)  
 
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Risky to announce to the world that Stobart Air will cease all routes from SEN [by 2020]. That is basically exactly what Ryanair is trying to achieve with their SEN ‘base’. Why should Ryanair even follow through with the opening of the actual base (!) or if they do it will last a matter of months before consolidating at STN... with a better deal.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 10:03
  #2155 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by shamrock7seal View Post
Risky to announce to the world that Stobart Air will cease all routes from SEN [by 2020]. That is basically exactly what Ryanair is trying to achieve with their SEN ‘base’. Why should Ryanair even follow through with the opening of the actual base (!) or if they do it will last a matter of months before consolidating at STN... with a better deal.
I don't get that at all. I'm sure MAG noted FR's plan, but would hardly be quaking in their boots given the relative size of operations at the Essex airports. They would also be aware that the number of aircraft FR could base at SEN is limited by current physical constraints, so there simply is no threat that a sizeable chunk of the STN operation will move to the south of the county. Ryanair cannot take their base out of STN and put it elsewhere, it's way too big.

I agree that FR would not hesitate to walk away from SEN if they saw a better opportunity, but that's something everyone involved surely understands.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 11:11
  #2156 (permalink)  
 
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A rather soft & skewed post regarding MAG commercial observation & attitude I would venture.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 11:19
  #2157 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by southside bobby View Post
A rather soft & skewed post regarding MAG commercial observation & attitude I would venture.
You're the expert. What is their view of FR's new base, and do you believe they will react?
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 16:29
  #2158 (permalink)  
 
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Interesting too is it not that even six months from the commencement of RYR ops a defensive aura is already appearing.

The post yesterday regarding perhaps a RYR motive toward Stobart Air/STK may or not be with foundation but to many for sure it would have been considered as viable reasoning when the RYR announcement was first made.

Disclaimer....Other options are available.

Ask again...When is the R/W upgrade due to commence to enable RYR ops & estimated cost to the Stobart Group?.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 17:17
  #2159 (permalink)  
 
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It was none too clear...posted yesterday,

"a case to scale up a bit further with another ATR or two,for example the Derry PSO will come up for grabs".

Surely not suggesting the Derry PSO could be flown into SEN?.

That would contradict the reasoning for the Derry service & STN it will be...

STN...With the most Continental connections in Europe bar one.

STN...With the busiest coach station in UK bar Victoria.

STN...Fastest access to Cambridge.

Just speculation of course but it would be the height of comedic quirkiness if a Flybe branded ATR but operated by Stobart Air would be processed at STN by Stobart Handling.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 19:26
  #2160 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by southside bobby View Post
Surely not suggesting the Derry PSO could be flown into SEN?.
Well Stobart bid last time around so yes I am. But fundamentally my point was to highlight the types of opportunities out there rather than anything concrete and my language didnít suggest otherwise.

Originally Posted by southside bobby View Post
That would contradict the reasoning for the Derry service & STN it will be...
Really? I understood the PSO to be to London with no specific entry point specified.

Originally Posted by southside bobby View Post
STN...With the most Continental connections in Europe bar one.

STN...With the busiest coach station in UK bar Victoria.

STN...Fastest access to Cambridge.
Straight out of the STN marketing brochure. All fantastic, but I wasnít aware either of those were stipulations of the PSO, and as far as Iím aware connections arenít offered on the existing service anyway. For access to London, STN has no particular benefit over SEN but that arguments been flogged to death.
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