MANCHESTER 1
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BBC One - Inside Out North West, 14/09/2015
For those interested, Inside Out on BBC North West Monday evening includes a piece with Dianne Oxberry inside the Airport ATC Tower.
For those interested, Inside Out on BBC North West Monday evening includes a piece with Dianne Oxberry inside the Airport ATC Tower.
Join Date: Dec 2000
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Fifth freedom expansion for EK from Europe to the US is very much on agenda but it comes with its problems. The US majors have and continue to lobby hard to constrain the growth of the ME3. In Europe, the biggest opposition to the ME3 seems to be focused in Germany and to a lesser extent in France with the Dutch recently expressing their reservations as well. Such opposition is largely driven by the national carriers within those individual countries.
The situation within the UK is somewhat different as Willie Walsh has publicly supported continued growth of the ME3. This is not surprising, with Qatar's stake in IAG along with BA being a stanch supporter behind Qatar joining Oneworld. There would be far less resistance within the UK to EK commencing fifth freedom routes than across on the continent.
Tensions in the US will need to calm down for any more EK fifth freedom routes to be announced and this could take time. In an ideal world I suspect that Canada and specifically Toronto would be well placed for a fifth freedom link from a UK regional airport as outside of London, there are no year round links. However, diplomatic relations between the UAE and Canada are not set to improve soon, so this is a non starter.
Also bear in mind that EK have an existing codeshare and interline ticketing agreement with JetBlue, thereby enabling a high degree of connectivity. This adds to the level of threat that the US majors feel EK poses, as EK would not be offering a point to point product.
It won't come soon but EK fifth freedom routes from a UK airport and perhaps even from Manchester, is far more likely to happen than at a number of other European airports.
The situation within the UK is somewhat different as Willie Walsh has publicly supported continued growth of the ME3. This is not surprising, with Qatar's stake in IAG along with BA being a stanch supporter behind Qatar joining Oneworld. There would be far less resistance within the UK to EK commencing fifth freedom routes than across on the continent.
Tensions in the US will need to calm down for any more EK fifth freedom routes to be announced and this could take time. In an ideal world I suspect that Canada and specifically Toronto would be well placed for a fifth freedom link from a UK regional airport as outside of London, there are no year round links. However, diplomatic relations between the UAE and Canada are not set to improve soon, so this is a non starter.
Also bear in mind that EK have an existing codeshare and interline ticketing agreement with JetBlue, thereby enabling a high degree of connectivity. This adds to the level of threat that the US majors feel EK poses, as EK would not be offering a point to point product.
It won't come soon but EK fifth freedom routes from a UK airport and perhaps even from Manchester, is far more likely to happen than at a number of other European airports.
Didn't the Canadians refuse EK daily slots in YYZ? Restrict them to 5 weekly or something?
Look at the stink kicked up by the whole Norwegian thing. There's nothing stopping the UK awarding fifth freedom to EK, but the economic costs might outweigh the benefits. Plus as was mentioned earlier, it only benefits those flying P2P to the big cities (NYC, LAX, MIA etc) that EK would likely launch.
EK A380s would blow the US3, TC and VS out of the water too in these markets. I honestly think in the long run it would be more harmful than positive.
Look at the stink kicked up by the whole Norwegian thing. There's nothing stopping the UK awarding fifth freedom to EK, but the economic costs might outweigh the benefits. Plus as was mentioned earlier, it only benefits those flying P2P to the big cities (NYC, LAX, MIA etc) that EK would likely launch.
EK A380s would blow the US3, TC and VS out of the water too in these markets. I honestly think in the long run it would be more harmful than positive.
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It could indeed be harmful but when the CEO of IAG welcomes increased competition from the ME3, along with a government and unions that appear to be less robust in defending their interests within the UK, it shows a marked difference from elsewhere in Europe.
We saw GSS close down at Stansted with Qatar Cargo now providing dedicated cargo capacity for IAG. An example of a successful British operator being squeezed out of the market and eventually out of business by a Gulf carrier.
On the topic of the UAE-Canada bilateral agreement, there are 6 weekly rotations available with EY taking three and EK taking three. Qatar seem to have a more generous offering.
We saw GSS close down at Stansted with Qatar Cargo now providing dedicated cargo capacity for IAG. An example of a successful British operator being squeezed out of the market and eventually out of business by a Gulf carrier.
On the topic of the UAE-Canada bilateral agreement, there are 6 weekly rotations available with EY taking three and EK taking three. Qatar seem to have a more generous offering.
Join Date: Apr 2010
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I just don't buy the argument that because IAG and Qatar are good buddies that it translates into a love of the other ME carriers. They are three different competing airlines.
Imagine EK getting traffic rights between LHR and JFK - see how BA would squeal - just like AF or LH would in their respective fortresses.
EK out of the UK regions would be a disaster for those regions.
It would certainly kill off the US carriers meaning the connectivity that they offer to all points Stateside would be gone overnight. You might be able to go to NYC on a nice shiny emirates bird but that's not much use if you want to go to Albuquerque.
Imagine EK getting traffic rights between LHR and JFK - see how BA would squeal - just like AF or LH would in their respective fortresses.
EK out of the UK regions would be a disaster for those regions.
It would certainly kill off the US carriers meaning the connectivity that they offer to all points Stateside would be gone overnight. You might be able to go to NYC on a nice shiny emirates bird but that's not much use if you want to go to Albuquerque.
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Just earlier on this year, BA and Iberia left the AEA (Association of European Airlines) in protest at the anti Gulf airline stance that was being promoted within the association. Willie Walsh said on record that 'global liberalisation of our industry is fundamental to our future growth and we are not willing to compromise on it'. Those are very different words to a few years back when Willie Walsh was highlighting the threat that Gulf airlines posed.
He knows that the threat of fifth freedom routes to/from London operated by any of the ME3 is almost non existent. Heathrow and Gatwick are slot constrained and any slots that were available, would be best spent on increasing the frequency from London to their respective home hubs.
The gap in the jigsaw puzzle here is within the regions. It's true that the US carriers would suffer should any of the ME3 start transatlantic services from the UK regions but it has the potential to be good for the consumer. Lower fares and still a wide degree of connectivity being available. If you were to fly on Delta (for example) then you would probably be connecting on a Delta flight when you arrive in the US. The ME3 have the benefit of providing interline options that could involve a number of US operators. This might change depending on what Congress has to say with the discussions that take place in the near future. Whilst EK has a codeshare agreement with JetBlue, they also have interline ticketing agreements with a number of US operators and even with their arch rival Delta.
It may seem that I am a stanch supporter of the ME3 but I am not. I felt it was perhaps useful to highlight just how little resistance you are likely to find within the UK to fifth freedom routes across the Atlantic that would be operated by any of the ME3 airlines. Also it is nothing more than a myth that the ME3 would provide little or no connectivity as well within the US.
He knows that the threat of fifth freedom routes to/from London operated by any of the ME3 is almost non existent. Heathrow and Gatwick are slot constrained and any slots that were available, would be best spent on increasing the frequency from London to their respective home hubs.
The gap in the jigsaw puzzle here is within the regions. It's true that the US carriers would suffer should any of the ME3 start transatlantic services from the UK regions but it has the potential to be good for the consumer. Lower fares and still a wide degree of connectivity being available. If you were to fly on Delta (for example) then you would probably be connecting on a Delta flight when you arrive in the US. The ME3 have the benefit of providing interline options that could involve a number of US operators. This might change depending on what Congress has to say with the discussions that take place in the near future. Whilst EK has a codeshare agreement with JetBlue, they also have interline ticketing agreements with a number of US operators and even with their arch rival Delta.
It may seem that I am a stanch supporter of the ME3 but I am not. I felt it was perhaps useful to highlight just how little resistance you are likely to find within the UK to fifth freedom routes across the Atlantic that would be operated by any of the ME3 airlines. Also it is nothing more than a myth that the ME3 would provide little or no connectivity as well within the US.
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Join Date: Apr 2010
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A Question
When EK start flying the 2-class A380 on the evening flight will this be the largest passenger carrying plane ever to have operated into the UK? If so it's worth some publicity I would think.
Even so T1 passport control will be a place to avoid around 19.00-19.30 every evening.
When EK start flying the 2-class A380 on the evening flight will this be the largest passenger carrying plane ever to have operated into the UK? If so it's worth some publicity I would think.
Even so T1 passport control will be a place to avoid around 19.00-19.30 every evening.
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Two Class A380
A quick tinternet search reveals EK will operate the 2 class with 615 seats
Surely must be the highest passenger capacity plane ever operated into the UK.
A UK first for MAN when it lands then.
(one to avoid for me though, I prefer the more civilized upstairs environs of the 'baby' version at 'only' 517 seats on the lunchtime flight)
A quick tinternet search reveals EK will operate the 2 class with 615 seats
Surely must be the highest passenger capacity plane ever operated into the UK. A UK first for MAN when it lands then.
(one to avoid for me though, I prefer the more civilized upstairs environs of the 'baby' version at 'only' 517 seats on the lunchtime flight)
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All Names Taken
Will let you know in early Jan, as I am out bound on the evening service and will possibly return on the evening service inbound. But I agree about your comments about immigration queues and those of MAN777. The comment from Longhu about the "Golf Set" I found to be more common on the lunchtime service, in my some what limited knowledge of that service outbound to DXB.
On a different point I have just used air miles to pay for a couple of Business Class tickets with EK out to Oman in Nov and found APD to be £1600 which is quite a sting on the top. Does make you wonder how long they can do that with the various options of changing planes in Dublin OR Europe coming to the fore.
With regards to EK service to North America / Canada via Man please bring it on ASAP, or any other of the ME3. All are light years ahead of the current incumbents.
Regards
Mr Mac
Will let you know in early Jan, as I am out bound on the evening service and will possibly return on the evening service inbound. But I agree about your comments about immigration queues and those of MAN777. The comment from Longhu about the "Golf Set" I found to be more common on the lunchtime service, in my some what limited knowledge of that service outbound to DXB.
On a different point I have just used air miles to pay for a couple of Business Class tickets with EK out to Oman in Nov and found APD to be £1600 which is quite a sting on the top. Does make you wonder how long they can do that with the various options of changing planes in Dublin OR Europe coming to the fore.
With regards to EK service to North America / Canada via Man please bring it on ASAP, or any other of the ME3. All are light years ahead of the current incumbents.
Regards
Mr Mac
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The possible problem with EK goong stateside via MAN is that US carriers may threaten to pull out which generally comes to nothing however as MAN has no based US long haul carriers it coild make it more likely they would pull out as replacments would unlikely happen.
I am not including TCX as its likely heavily package hols.
Anyway EK seemed to hace plans set on BCN when it was last raised.
I am not including TCX as its likely heavily package hols.
Anyway EK seemed to hace plans set on BCN when it was last raised.
