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Old 3rd Jun 2016, 15:49
  #5101 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Kerry Eire
Age: 73
Posts: 609
Re the security guy, went through T3 in March with coat, camera bag, wallet, tablet, phone, belt and shoes and passport. I travel regularly around the world and normally these items go through in two trays maximum. The over officious numpty had me place the camera bag in one tray, wallet and passport in another, belt and shoes and coat in another, tablet and phone in a fourth. When I queried this he not only got very officious but threatened to send me to the back of a line that was over 150 people long with other lines backed up just as badly. Not a good advert for efficient screening and expeditious clearance. Perhaps Manchester's T3 machines and or operators just can't cope with the average traveller's normal carry ons. Having said that, transferring airside from T5 to T2 at LHR means joining massive lines at T2 security. Safety and security is one thing, being seen "to be doing everything we can", i.e. window dressing is another.
philbky is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2016, 15:56
  #5102 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Manchester, England
Posts: 559
Originally Posted by Jetaway View Post
I'm not sure, I'm booked with AA to fly to ORD in October and it's saying its being operated by a 763, not best pleased at the moment as I was hoping it would be on a 788 by then.
AA MAN-ORD reverts to B763 from early October. For winter, who knows, but 787 not planned.

UA not intending to switch to wide bodies for the foreseeable, 757s feature for some time yet and are 'right-sized' for the routes.
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Old 3rd Jun 2016, 16:11
  #5103 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Leeds
Posts: 496
Originally Posted by roverman View Post
AA MAN-ORD reverts to B763 from early October. For winter, who knows, but 787 not planned.

UA not intending to switch to wide bodies for the foreseeable, 757s feature for some time yet and are 'right-sized' for the routes.
It's a shame with UA, of the U.S. carriers they have (in my opinion) by far the smallest presence at MAN. EWR has struggled as JFK has boomed and that may be part of the problem.

Whilst it would be great to see such routes as DFW (AA) IAH (UA) or LAX (DL/VS) MAN is in the midst of a significant expansion of US services that seems destined to continue with DTW (DL), Norwegians forthcoming arrival (supposedly with at least two based 787s) and TCX continuing their expansion plans (which previously hinted at SFO and increased frequency at LAX).

Hopefully pre clearance and the TP can start to develop the US market further as DUB is plainly a major competetor in this arena.
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Old 3rd Jun 2016, 22:19
  #5104 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 39
Posts: 6,168
In what was has the United MAN-EWR struggled? Held it's own rather well surely, capacity dumping in this market isn't sensible IMHO. NYC has a huge P2P market but EWR is also a fortess hub for United. As F is removed from more B763s we might see a change though, they don't have a lot of B788s though.
Skipness One Echo is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2016, 22:38
  #5105 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Leeds
Posts: 496
Originally Posted by Skipness One Echo View Post
In what was has the United MAN-EWR struggled? Held it's own rather well surely, capacity dumping in this market isn't sensible IMHO. NYC has a huge P2P market but EWR is also a fortess hub for United. As F is removed from more B763s we might see a change though, they don't have a lot of B788s though.
From recollection, when comparing 2016 with 2015, the EWR market has declined something like 11% year to year. As UA are the sole operator they must be the ones taking the hit.

I don't know how strong the 2015 performance was against which this asessment is based, but it has certainly declined over the past 12 months.
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Old 3rd Jun 2016, 23:02
  #5106 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: stockport
Posts: 204
What we need to see is the yield

Ian
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Old 4th Jun 2016, 09:16
  #5107 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Leeds
Posts: 496
Originally Posted by chaps1954 View Post
What we need to see is the yield

Ian
Quite, although we will almost certainly never get to see that! Going on numbers is the best hash I can make of it!!
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Old 4th Jun 2016, 16:31
  #5108 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,106
Scope for Expansion of E.Passport Gate Capability?

Having arrived back at MAN through T1 again earlier this week afew observations re the UK Border e.gates spring to mind.

Firstly, it is notable that the bulk of passengers now appear at ease with using the technology. Afew had problems, but not many. And the vast majority of passengers now possess passports which are compliant with the technology. But this has conspired to make the e.gates a victim of their own success. In T1 and T3 they're overwhelmed by the sheer weight of demand. Probably in T2 as well, though its a while since I've had a chance to check progress there. The problem now is that the 'quick' e.passport route is now by far the slowest option with most arriving pax eligible to use the machines and each individual transaction taking approximately 45 seconds. A bank of five e.gates is woefully insufficient to cope with demand from the entirety of T1 traffic.

So ... some questions (because I don't know the answers!).

How much does it cost to install and maintain an e.passport booth? Is this cost borne by HMG or MAG?
Is the equipment readily available on the open market?
Can the UK Border layout at the terminals be optimised to allow a bank of say 25 units per terminal?
Are there any union or working practices limitations capping the use of this new technology to protect Border Force jobs?

If the above issues can be resolved at reasonable cost, it would make sense to significantly enhance e.passport reader capability at MAN's three terminals. The technology has generally proven itself now, but the small number of cubicles has itself become the biggest impediment to timely arrival at MAN.

One little aside from the above ... a ten minute delay attaching the airbridge combined with the bottleneck at the e.gates meant that my flight-number had already been time-outed from the baggage reclaim displays by the time we made it through. Fortunately, we eventually found our bags mingling with those from a later-arriving Lufthansa MUC flight!

Any UK Border experts in a position to respond? Thanks.
Shed-on-a-Pole is offline  
Old 4th Jun 2016, 17:52
  #5109 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 492
Shed on...
Man T1 two weeks ago, very busy, I beat Mrs NRU by 14 minutes by not going thru' the e-gates. No advantage of course because I had to wait for her !
NRU74 is online now  
Old 4th Jun 2016, 21:37
  #5110 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 39
Posts: 6,168
Pub question for the locals, crew were confused about what stand they were on as the sign has been reveresed and flipped 90 degrees. If you squint, you can still see it clearly ought to say 235, which is quite correct. It's been like this for years, does anyone know WHY?
Airfield ops must see it every day.....
Skipness One Echo is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2016, 08:04
  #5111 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: North West UK
Posts: 531
Originally Posted by philbky View Post
Re the security guy, went through T3 in March with coat, camera bag, wallet, tablet, phone, belt and shoes and passport. I travel regularly around the world and normally these items go through in two trays maximum. The over officious numpty had me place the camera bag in one tray, wallet and passport in another, belt and shoes and coat in another, tablet and phone in a fourth. When I queried this he not only got very officious but threatened to send me to the back of a line that was over 150 people long with other lines backed up just as badly. Not a good advert for efficient screening and expeditious clearance. Perhaps Manchester's T3 machines and or operators just can't cope with the average traveller's normal carry ons. Having said that, transferring airside from T5 to T2 at LHR means joining massive lines at T2 security. Safety and security is one thing, being seen "to be doing everything we can", i.e. window dressing is another.
T3 security is a joke. Compared to T1, it is third world.
Espada III is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2016, 08:48
  #5112 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Usually in a bar!
Posts: 112
So which Third World airports would you say T3 security is like?
Homo Simpson is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2016, 08:56
  #5113 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Manchester, UK
Age: 47
Posts: 695
Been through T3 security 3 times in last 3 months, through in minutes each time with zero hassle.

Did have a dodgy experience last year, but that was at 4am to catch one of the first wave of RYR departures. Get there at 7/8am or beyond, and that rush has gone, and its generall OK.
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Old 5th Jun 2016, 10:14
  #5114 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: England
Posts: 212
The other half went through T3 security recently, unfortunately she put her
clear plastic bag on the bottom of the tray with her coat over the top.

Result tray pulled out for further security checks along with everybody who
made a minor transgression, it then took 25 minutes to complete the second check due to the number of trays being retained to be checked again.

The security guy when she first put her tray on the belt did not say anything
and he was then put on checking the trays again after they had been pulled out for a second check.

A lot of unhappy fliers that afternoon due to the long wait for many who had to have the trays re-examined.

J
jubilee is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2016, 10:41
  #5115 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Europe
Posts: 372
T3 security is a joke
Based on a recent experience I'd rephrase that to "T3 is a joke" or was I just unlucky?

It had been many years since I went through T3. The security was appalling. The lane I was sent through came to a full stop. Nothing for 15 minutes. There is no excuse for a security queue stopping for that length of time but the absence of an announcement, explanation or apology shows scant respect for passengers. You just have to stand there and try to keep calm. This was followed by a slow tortuous experience before finally getting out of there. I wasn't personally affected but the over-officiousness described by philbky above was evident.

That was bad enough but, having walked through a long narrow corridor, arrival in the over-populated "Waiting Lounge" was breathtakingly awful. Finding a place to sit or eat was impossible, trying to negotiate my way through tiny spaces, around people and stepping over their bags proved difficult and my main priority was to look for a place to breathe. I cannot understand why a "Waiting Lounge" can't be fitted out with enough seats. Stansted is the same.

The flight was called far too early. The aircraft wasn't even on stand. People had to stand in the queue for nearly 45 minutes before it moved. I just sat on a window ledge and watched from a safe distance until it did. Well, it did move but after getting about three-quarters of the pax past the desks it stopped again for another 20 minutes. Again, no announcement, no explanation and no apology.

Altogether an experience I would not like to repeat any time soon.
ayroplain is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2016, 11:06
  #5116 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 39
Posts: 6,168
T2 security man was appaling on Saturday am. Forgot my bottled water attached to my bag which I smiled and apologised for. The reason my bag was pullesd he says, was my clear liquids bag was "concealed" under my jumper. Apparently Manchester does it properly unlike all those other DFT cleared UK airports who seem able to use some form of Xray to see through wool. He reiterated, MAN "did it properly". Asked him three times if I could quickly drink my water, he avoided by saying I couldn't take it through. When pressed he said people were drinking liquid explosives to take on aircraft. I didn't have the words....

Am I wrong, has ISIS tried getting liquid explosives on board by drinking 'em???!
Skipness One Echo is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2016, 11:21
  #5117 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: England
Posts: 999
Seems to be plenty of complaints towards individual security officers on here, surely it'd be easy enough just to get their name and put in a formal complaint

Failing that, head to one of the managers (usually stood in a podium behind security) and complain to them directly?
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Old 5th Jun 2016, 11:36
  #5118 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Valencia
Posts: 218
Went through T2 security recently at lunchtime Sunday and was a very pleasant experience, staff very helpful, polite, and friendly. No queue, and space available to gather your possessions once you had cleared security. Return through T2 immigration on a Tuesday afternoon was fast with no queues - although, for some reason, we were made to walk the full length of the zig-zags to get the the Passport gates. From gate to bags arriving on the belt was less than 10 minutes.

Compare this to T5 at LHR, an experience never to be repeated if at all possible, staff surly and constantly shouting at people, long slow-moving queues, and it seems that they put every fifth bag to one side for further inspection. Always told we are slow because we do it more thoroughly than anybody else - sounds a bit like Manchester have been given the same customer service training! Try making a complaint about their attitude and you get the response "I am not required to give you my name" - would guess you will get the same response at MAN.
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Old 5th Jun 2016, 11:42
  #5119 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,106
T3's problem is easily diagnosed. As home to Ryanair, FlyBe, Air France-KLM, American Airlines and Vueling it is massively over-subscribed. MAG has tried to persuade carriers to relocate but they won't ... they love it there. Proximity to the runways and all that. So the issues will remain for as long as passenger throughput continues to overwhelm design-capacity. Hence the problems with space in the airside departure lounge etc.

I have to say that whilst T3 security gets very busy I've had no problems with it. Allow time at predictably busy periods and you'll be fine. The queue-combing there is actually very well-organised in my experience. Passengers booked on more imminent flights are called forward and expedited through. Once airside (if early for your flight) I suggest looking for seating adjacent to the SE-facing window near the 50's gates. Always lots of space there. And a great view too.

If you fancy refreshments, I've found the 'Lion and Antelope' facility the most competitively priced eatery at any UK airside location I've come across.

T3 has its issues (where doesn't?). Mainly due to crowding. But it has its good points too. As a regular user of both Ryanair and FlyBe I'm in there frequently. It's not that bad! I do hope MAG find a way to expand its capacity though, particularly if all incumbent carriers continue to resist switching to another terminal.
Shed-on-a-Pole is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2016, 11:49
  #5120 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: U.K
Posts: 591
MAG has tried to persuade carriers to relocate but they won't
BA, along with American have requested a move to T2, but the airport were unwilling to provide domestic arrival facilities for BA.
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