SOUTHEND 5
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Sea-Air "confirmed"
I received a text message from London-Southend airport this morning which said "Sea Air on Tuesday confirmed to us that a limited schedule will operate with a smaller aircraft this week commencing with the service from Munich on Wednesday evening. We are further advised that the B737 will begin operating in early June".
Despite that there is nothing on the board for this evening.
Despite that there is nothing on the board for this evening.
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Tomorrows Seair Munich flight
I received a text message from London-Southend airport this morning which said "Sea Air on Tuesday confirmed to us that a limited schedule will operate with a smaller aircraft this week commencing with the service from Munich on Wednesday evening. We are further advised that the B737 will begin operating in early June".
Despite that there is nothing on the board for this evening.
Despite that there is nothing on the board for this evening.
Join Date: Apr 2016
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Sea Air (the excitement builds)
Apparently there are quite a few DC3's still out there. Seriously though, I have heard that a few lines of credit are now available to Sea Air: 6 refuelling stops should get them to Munich 
So has anything actually arrived or departed for Sea Air at Southend today or is there just another unfortunate cancellation ? I can't find any evidence of an arrival or departure having taken place on the Interweb
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Pax, pax, pax - no, no, no!
asdf, I disagree. It might be true somewhere isolated or with a captive market, but not SEN.
The sort of airlines that might use SEN will not be interested in paying very much, and why should they with LGW/STN/LTN also keen for their business and no doubt offering their own sweeteners. Profit needs to come from passengers - look at STN and their drop-off charge. Volume fills up the car park, keeps the bar busy, occupies hotel rooms.
The sort of airlines that might use SEN will not be interested in paying very much, and why should they with LGW/STN/LTN also keen for their business and no doubt offering their own sweeteners. Profit needs to come from passengers - look at STN and their drop-off charge. Volume fills up the car park, keeps the bar busy, occupies hotel rooms.
Stobarts reportedly invested in excess of £100m in the airport infrastructure (how and where only they know) and their only future payback comes from commercial pax carriers?
A runway can be used by a myriad of users, from airlines to bizjets, flying schools to maintenance facilities, manufacturers to R&D. Yet SEN management only ever talk about pax numbers.
Go work out how much effort you need to put in to get a few quid in the bank for an EasyJet rotation and compare that to the effort and time invested in one bizjet or MRO movement.
Pax numbers is not a measure of profitability but that's all we hear from SEN management. I was right 4 years ago and very, very sadly I'm still right today. The mounting losses show that.
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It doesn't appear on the Munich departure board so is it coming in empty? It might come in empty anyway even if it was on the departure board seeing that the service has had next to no publicity and several false starts.
Join Date: Apr 2016
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Way to Go?
Thanks for the illuminating comment A.P. You and SEN management are wrong to only consider an increase in PAX numbers as the only sign of success and future profitability.
Stobarts reportedly invested in excess of £100m in the airport infrastructure (how and where only they know) and their only future payback comes from commercial pax carriers?
A runway can be used by a myriad of users, from airlines to bizjets, flying schools to maintenance facilities, manufacturers to R&D. Yet SEN management only ever talk about pax numbers.
Go work out how much effort you need to put in to get a few quid in the bank for an EasyJet rotation and compare that to the effort and time invested in one bizjet or MRO movement.
Pax numbers is not a measure of profitability but that's all we hear from SEN management. I was right 4 years ago and very, very sadly I'm still right today. The mounting losses show that.
Stobarts reportedly invested in excess of £100m in the airport infrastructure (how and where only they know) and their only future payback comes from commercial pax carriers?
A runway can be used by a myriad of users, from airlines to bizjets, flying schools to maintenance facilities, manufacturers to R&D. Yet SEN management only ever talk about pax numbers.
Go work out how much effort you need to put in to get a few quid in the bank for an EasyJet rotation and compare that to the effort and time invested in one bizjet or MRO movement.
Pax numbers is not a measure of profitability but that's all we hear from SEN management. I was right 4 years ago and very, very sadly I'm still right today. The mounting losses show that.
History may well prove you right. Time will tell. But given where we are today how is your vision of a successful airport going to be realised? Stobart's are not about to stick a huge boot under EZY and send them scuttling back to that big orange hangar at LTN. What will happen to that shiny terminal and station with its excellent connections to Crossrail and all parts of the capital? We are where we are. You may be brave enough for a 180 degree turn, but I don't see many others out there who would do what you advise. PAX numbers is NOW the only way forward, surely?
I don't always agree with asdf1234 but he is correct in saying that there are many other profit centres in operating an airport than just passenger flights. SEN has lost its MRO capability recently, to be completed when Inflite close next month, their freight activity is minimal, their corporate aircraft movements are modest and they seem to have actively discouraged general aviation movements and residents. No substantial new hangarage has been built since 2008 when Stobart bought SEN, despite them designating several location on the airfield for this. Rumour had it that they didn't offer attractive enough packages to conclude deals with prospective new tenants.
Just take a look at NWI where the hangar infrastructure has grown hugely in the past decade with new or expanding resident companies and it is now a well balanced airport not having to rely solely on passenger numbers.
Passenger numbers and shiny airliners on the terminal stands certainly polish the egos of airport owners but that is not where profitability is to be found, unless the terminal includes a large shopping mall and SEN can never provide that.
Just take a look at NWI where the hangar infrastructure has grown hugely in the past decade with new or expanding resident companies and it is now a well balanced airport not having to rely solely on passenger numbers.
Passenger numbers and shiny airliners on the terminal stands certainly polish the egos of airport owners but that is not where profitability is to be found, unless the terminal includes a large shopping mall and SEN can never provide that.
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Yes, I agree. Stobart seem to have a fixed idea of what is important for an airport. They had a "build it and they will come" mentality at the outset but are hamstrung by the short runway. They still seem to have that mentality. They also had the idea of developing their own airline and they now seem happy playing with that, but not from SEN! They have missed several possible opportunities to attract major airlines including SAS, Wizz Air and even BA. They managed to lose Aer Lingus. They fell into flyBE's trap. I think they need to send their managers - and their executives too - to a successful airport such as Luton, Stansted or Bristol and see how that success was achieved.
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Yes, I agree. Stobart seem to have a fixed idea of what is important for an airport. They had a "build it and they will come" mentality at the outset but are hamstrung by the short runway. They still seem to have that mentality. They also had the idea of developing their own airline and they now seem happy playing with that, but not from SEN! They have missed several possible opportunities to attract major airlines including SAS, Wizz Air and even BA. They managed to lose Aer Lingus. They fell into flyBE's trap. I think they need to send their managers - and their executives too - to a successful airport such as Luton, Stansted or Bristol and see how that success was achieved.
Bristol would be an excellent start. In the last few years they have seen a significant dip (2008 - 2009) followed by a period of stagnation before growth resumed. And what did people always say about BRS? "Runway's too short". Now it's seems onwards and upwards for them, including transatlantic flights from a runway just 500 feet longer than SEN
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Guys, seriously, can everyone calm down a little. IMO, there have been so many inaccurate statements on this thread in the last couple of weeks...'what has Gly Jones been doing for the past 6 months' when commenting on the lack of new airlines. Obviously this poster has had no experience of negotiating with airlines and what a long and arduous process this can be!
Where has the 100million investment gone was another highlight, try building a terminal, apron, extending the runway, resurfacing, new lighting, new radar, train station, boom 100 mill spent.
Yes Stobart have made mistakes but where exactly would Southend be without them (hello Manston, Plymouth, Blackpool...) let's give them, and the new management team a bit of time, bear in mind the revitalised commercial operation only started 5 or so years ago. Southend will find its place in the market and maybe all the armchair airport managing directors could cut them a little slack in the mean time, yes make opinions known, but also appreciate that building a sustainable business takes more than offering a blue chip airline a deal at any cost to fly from the airport. Coventry and Blackpool in recent years have shown that doesn't work!
Where has the 100million investment gone was another highlight, try building a terminal, apron, extending the runway, resurfacing, new lighting, new radar, train station, boom 100 mill spent.
Yes Stobart have made mistakes but where exactly would Southend be without them (hello Manston, Plymouth, Blackpool...) let's give them, and the new management team a bit of time, bear in mind the revitalised commercial operation only started 5 or so years ago. Southend will find its place in the market and maybe all the armchair airport managing directors could cut them a little slack in the mean time, yes make opinions known, but also appreciate that building a sustainable business takes more than offering a blue chip airline a deal at any cost to fly from the airport. Coventry and Blackpool in recent years have shown that doesn't work!
Last edited by chesna152; 26th May 2016 at 12:31.
Whilst not wishing to pour cold water on the aspirations of Southend and its supporters, it should be noted that the declared distances [particularly TODA & LDA] at Bristol are significantly greater than those at Southend. Runway dimensions alone have a limited meaning!
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to a successful airport such as Luton, Stansted or Bristol and see how that success was achieved.
Southend is just 4 years into its rebuilt airport. Try waiting another 20 years like I had to. It will come when the time is ready but it is debatable how much influence Southend management will have in influencing the airlines to give Southend a try while there is capacity at other London airports that are open 24 hours, have longer runways and have established carriers with proven track records.
