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Potential impact of Scottish independence on flights from Scotland

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Potential impact of Scottish independence on flights from Scotland

Old 2nd Mar 2014, 20:01
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Fairdealfrank: The Spanish foreign minister has said that Spain would not veto Scottish membership of the EU because the referendum has been approved by the UK government. Catalonia is a different situation because the referendum is being carried out without the approval of the Spanish government and it is in breach of the Spanish constitution. No other EU country has suggested that it would veto Scottish membership. The scare stories to that effect lack any substance or credibility.

I'm not sure what the situations are in relation to Italy, France and Belgium but the key issue with Scotland is that the referendum is being held with the agreement of the UK government who have agreed to abide by the democratic outcome. Why would any EU country want to veto Scottish membership in such circumstances? To do so would be illogical and anti-democratic, vindictive and vexatious.
Where exactly in my post does the word “veto” appear, Porrohman? Have reread my post a couple of times, can’t find it.

AFAIK, there is only one applicant country to the EU that has ever been vetoed (twice). Not even Turkey, a country that does not have a cat in hell’s chance of joining the EU, has had its application vetoed.

As for Catalonia, it is not a case of "the referendum is being carried out without the approval of the Spanish government and it is in breach of the Spanish constitution". The central government have stopped it and it is not going ahead (for now at least).

Here is the text:

"From an "ever closer union" point of view, it is likely that EU establishment would want a separate Scotland to join the EU pretty quickly. Some EU countries have secessionist issues of their own, they may not be so keen."

Think it’s reasonably accurate, "not so keen" does not equal "veto".

I feel exactly the same way about the currency issue. Osborne, Balls and Alexander all prefixed their recent statements by saying that they would be "unable to recommend" a currency union. Recommend to who? The PM? Parliament? What seems clear from their carefully coordinated choice of words is that the ultimate decision is not theirs. They will make a recommendation, not the ultimate decision. The following Monday, Cameron said in an interview that the currency union was "under threat". He could have said "out of the question" or words to that effect but he didn't.
The currency union issue is an interesting one. Not having a Scottish currency means the country would not be properly independent, many countries in the Mediterreanan are good examples of this currently.
In a currency union between a separated Scotland and the rest of the UK, the UK calls the shots, no question.

The most disturbing thing about the referendum campaign is that there is not a single mainstream media outlet in Scotland that is pro-independence. The UK mainstream media is almost entirely anti-independence too. It's a very dangerous thing for democracy when the entire mainstream media takes the some political stance on an issue. Normally such a situation would only occur in a country where the media is state controlled. For it to happen in a supposedly free democracy is somewhat unusual to put it mildly.
The media cannot be forced to favour the breakup of the UK. If they are against, they will say so.

Interesting post, Porrohman, don’t agree with all of it. Do you get to vote?

This is such an important vote, yet 90% of the UK’s population cannot have a say on whether the UK gets broken up.

Am with David Bowie on this one.


For years the Scots have complained about darker mornings if the clocks were moved forward, which has stopped the rest of the UK having lighter evenings. If Scotland got its independence I can see no reason why the rest of the UK could not move their clocks to European time so leaving Scotland in a different time zone to the rest of Europe and the UK. If the Scots didn't like it then they have to choose whether they would follow the UK.
 
It’s not a case of Scotland versus the rest. The effect of being on the wrong time zone becomes more stark the further north and west one goes, it's a simple fact of geography.

So Northern Ireland, Wales and much of England would be adversely affected as well. Even in southeast England, it would still mean darkness till 0900 in mid-winter.

This nonsense needs putting to bed once for all. It is Spain and France that are in the wrong time zone (thanks to Hitler), not the UK, and Spain is seriously considering reverting to GMT.

BTW, the rest of Europe is not in just one time zone.

Last edited by Fairdealfrank; 2nd Mar 2014 at 20:30.
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Old 2nd Mar 2014, 21:17
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Fairdealfrank: Yes, I do get the chance to vote at present.

Trossie: the white paper has some information about commercial aviation and other transport matters which may be of interest to you and others. I've put the aviation related items in bold font and the general and non-aviation items in italics so you can skip past the preambles and non aviation items and find the aviation specific content more easily;

Transport

Why we need a new approach

Scotland’s geographical position makes strong international and cross-border transport links vital for our economic success and our social wellbeing. Connecting Scotland with the world will never be a top priority for a Westminster Government, with its focus on the transport needs of London and the South East. It is only with independence that we can make choices based upon what is right for Scotland and our economy and what is right for communities and the quality of life of our people.

The future of high-speed rail is just one example. Current confirmed plans exclude Scotland and Northern England, with the next phases of high-speed rail only due to connect London with Birmingham in 2026 and then Leeds and Manchester by 2033. While this investment will provide capacity and bring some journey time savings between the Central Belt and London, the economic benefits to Scotland, as well as the North East and far North West of England are marginal compared to those which will accrue to other areas of the UK. Indeed, the Westminster Government’s own analysis shows that Aberdeen and Dundee’s economies may suffer from such a partial approach.

A similar failure is clear in relation to Air Passenger Duty. Westminster’s refusal to devolve Air Passenger Duty to Scotland has hampered our ability to attract new direct flights to Scotland that would improve our international connectivity and could reduce the costs to people and families in Scotland of both holidays and business travel.

The Westminster Government continues to have responsibility for key aspects of transport policy and, just as importantly, takes the final decision on the size of Scotland’s budget. This has included a massive reduction in the capital spending available for crucial infrastructure projects in our country. Scotland’s ability to support much needed infrastructure development has been hampered by decisions taken elsewhere, both in terms of overall spending limits and in the ways in which we are allowed to spend our money as a result of Treasury rules. This has meant slower progress on vital infrastructure and transport investment than would have been the case as an independent nation.

The opportunities available to Scotland

Independence will provide Scotland with full flexibility and more choices for our transport system. We will be able to assess our capital investment needs and our forward investment based on Scotland’s budgetary position, rather than within boundaries set by Westminster. We will be able to consider options such as different ownership models for the rail network, and address issues with Scotland’s international connections to the global marketplace, developing our air and sea access to the most important markets.

Since 1999, successive Scottish governments have improved transport within current devolved responsibilities, illustrating the value of decision-making on Scottish priorities for transport within Scotland, and connecting investment in transport with wider policy objectives.

For example, this Government is committed to connecting communities and developing the local and national economies of Scotland through projects such as the Borders Rail link and the Air Discount Scheme.

Following the transfer of some responsibilities for our railways, two new passenger lines and six new stations have been opened and across the network we have seen a 30 per cent increase in passenger use. Road Equivalent Tariff has been introduced for more island ferry routes and we have been able to take forward major road projects to improve and complete our motorway network.

These actions demonstrate what can be achieved with a limited range of responsibilities and show that Scotland is well placed to respond more effectively to our nation’s strategic transport needs with the full powers of independence.


The Scotland we can create

Independence will provide future Scottish governments with the ability to make decisions that suit Scotland’s particular transport needs, creating projects and policies that are based on strong evidence of economic benefit and social cohesion.

These new powers can be used to continue the improvements to our transport networks both within Scotland and linking to Scotland. They will support economic and social opportunity by strengthening the connections between urban and rural, island and mainland, national and international, and the people of Scotland and their public services.

Independence will enable us to develop a fully integrated transport system with decision-making on the key issues being taken in Scotland and for Scotland. This means we can move forward with a clear ambition to deliver:
■■ integration between different modes of travel and different functions
■■ integration between all the powers of government to support transport and wider objectives
■■ full integration with the global community of nations


The choices open to us

Future Scottish governments will be able to align transport policy with other policy choices to create a more comprehensive transport strategy covering both national and international connections.

For example, independence creates the opportunity to integrate the transport network fully with the other infrastructure networks that are crucial to growing the economy. We will be able to align transport policy with energy policy to achieve Scotland’s ambitious decarbonisation targets. That means the electrification of rail and the development of electric vehicles can work in tandem with the expansion of renewable energy generation and the roll-out of smart grid technologies to drive down transport emissions, enabling Scotland to meet the commitment to achieve the almost complete decarbonisation of road transport by 2050.

There will be an opportunity to decide the best way to structure and support our railways, including the best ownership model for rail and track for the benefit of the people of Scotland.

The Scottish Government is currently procuring a ten-year Scotrail franchise with a five-year review and a separate Sleeper franchise. Both procurement exercises are being expertly run under existing devolved powers by Transport Scotland and have attracted healthy interest. We are confident that they will bring better services to passengers. However, the current franchise model is unnecessarily constrained by the limits imposed by UK legislation. In the future, an independent Scotland will be free to pursue legislation that enabled alternative approaches, including public-supported and not-for-profit models. Enhanced borrowing powers will also provide more options for the delivery of rail infrastructure or rolling stock supporting better value for money.

In addition, independence will give Scottish governments a role when franchises are awarded for cross-border services – currently the Scottish Government has very limited input to these decisions which are made by Westminster alone. This will ensure Scotland’s interests are fully represented. We can use the borrowing potential of an independent country to invest in the condition, reach and connectivity of our roads – achieving the long-term objective of dualling the road network between all our cities by 2030.

And, we can ensure that Scotland’s Maritime institutions – such as the coastguard – are structured efficiently and meet the needs of users of Scotland’s unique seas and complex coastline.

Our priorities for action

High-speed rail is a key priority. Despite a much stronger business case from a network that includes Scotland and previous calls, not just from the Scottish Government but councils in the North of England and civic and business Scotland too, it is only now that the Westminster Government has agreed to plan for high speed to go beyond Manchester and Leeds. Meanwhile we continue to plan for a high-speed compatible link between Edinburgh and Glasgow that will act as a ‘launch pad’ for high-speed rail services to the South as well as releasing capacity on existing lines in the Central Belt.

Through substantial investment in the Highland Mainline and the line between Aberdeen and Inverness, along with enhanced inter-city-services delivered through the next franchise, we will ensure that high-speed rail brings benefits to all of Scotland. High-speed rail will also deliver substantially improved connectivity between Scotland and the North of England. Consistent with the Borderlands initiative, an independent Scotland could work together with northern English councils to argue the case more strongly for High-speed to go further North faster. High-speed rail will also attract air travellers from Glasgow and Edinburgh to London, freeing air slots to maintain air access to Aberdeen and Inverness, which with rail improvements will maintain and enhance the connectivity of these economically vibrant cities.

A reduction in Air Passenger Duty (APD) will allow Scotland’s airports to be more competitive in attracting new direct air routes and will improve our international connectivity. More direct routes will also enable Scottish travellers to avoid connections via airports such as Heathrow, reducing average household costs for summer holiday flights from Scottish airports. For these reasons, it is essential that the Scottish Government has the power to make decisions on APD in the interests of Scotland.

Ferries are an essential part of Scotland’s transport network. The quality of our ferry services impacts on us all, affecting both island and mainland communities. The Scottish Government is fully committed to delivering first class sustainable ferry services to our communities, stimulating social and economic growth across Scotland. The planned improvements to Scotland’s ferry services, as set out in our recently published Ferries Plan will enable our rural and remote communities to thrive, and continue to make a significant contribution to Scotland’s economy. With the fully integrated transport system that independence will deliver, we can ensure the best alignment between ferries and other modes of transport.

One key cost to business and consumers is the cost of fuel. Currently around 58 per cent of the cost of petrol and diesel is made up of taxes: as a percentage of pump price, the UK had the highest tax component of diesel prices and the secondhighest of unleaded petrol prices of the 28 EU member states in August 2013. With independence, this Scottish Government will examine the benefits of a introducing a Fuel Duty Regulator mechanism to stabilise prices for business and consumers and how this could be made to work alongside our Scottish Energy Fund.

The Scottish Government is currently responsible for our rail and trunk road networks, major public transport projects and for the national concessionary travel schemes.

In addition, current devolved responsibilities include:
■■ travel information service
■■ sustainable transport, road safety and accessibility
■■ local roads policy
■■ bus, freight and taxi policy
■■ ferries, ports, harbours and canals
■■ the Blue Badge Scheme (for disabled drivers)
After independence, these services and responsibilities will continue as now.


Other transport functions are currently reserved to the Westminster Government, and delivered by 13 UK - or GB wide specialist transport organisations. For a period after independence, the Scottish Government proposes that these organisations continue to provide their services in Scotland under arrangements with the Scottish Government. These arrangements, some of which will be transitional, will form part of agreements reached with Westminster.

The people of Scotland have contributed to the funding and development of these institutions over many years, and continued use of these institutions, for varying periods of time, following independence – with appropriate financial contributions to their administration, along with an equally appropriate say in their governance – is the sensible approach to ensuring continuity of service immediately following independence.

These include the Motoring Services agencies: the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency, Driving Standards Agency, Vehicle and Operator Standards Agency, and the Vehicle Certification Agency. These will initially continue to provide vehicle and driver licensing and testing services to the people of Scotland. However, independence will allow a Scottish parliament to determine the best way to deliver these services in the future. The Scottish Government plans to create a new, streamlined

Scottish Motor Services Agency, which will bring together the functions of DVLA, DSA, VOSA, and VCA. By the end of the first term of an independent parliament, we will have completed the design and development work, with a view to the Agency going live early in the second Parliament.

The Maritime and Coastguard Agency and the Northern Lighthouse Board will continue to provide their services for the safety of mariners.

NATS is the air navigation service provider for the UK. It is a public-private partnership, and is 49 per cent owned by the Westminster Government, 42 per cent by the Airline Group (a consortium of seven airlines), five per cent by its employees and four per cent by Heathrow Airport Holdings. NATS owns and operates a large facility at Prestwick. On independence, NATS will continue its services for Scotland. The Scottish Government will negotiate an appropriate share for Scotland of the Westminster Government’s stake in NATS.

The present regulatory authorities for transport are the Office of Rail Regulation (ORR) and the Civil Aviation Authority (CAA). On independence, these bodies will continue to operate in Scotland while the options for regulation are examined further, although the combined economic regulator will cover aspects of ORR’s functions. The same approach will be adopted in relation to the rail passenger group, Passenger Focus. This will ensure there is no disruption to the operations and safety of either rail or air services. Similarly the accident investigation branches, covering rail, aviation and maritime, will continue their operations on independence.

This approach means that drivers, hauliers, airlines and their passengers, rail operators and their passengers, and mariners experience a smooth transition as powers begin to be executed by an independent Scotland or jointly with the rest of the UK, through existing institutions.

As a full member state of the EU, we will be increasingly active in international co-operation in transport policy and regulation, as well as in international transport bodies such as the International Civil Aviation Organisation and the International Maritime Organisation.


Development of public services after independence

The structure of public services under independence will be forfuture Scottish governments and parliaments to decide.

We plan to maintain shared services in areas where it makes sense to do so, and where it is in the interests of both Scotland and the rest of the UK, such as:
■■ NHS Blood and Transplant
■■ the Royal Mint
■■ the Research Councils

■■ Air and Maritime Accidents Investigation
■■ some expert and technical advisory groups, for example the Committee on Radioactive Waste Management
■■ the Green Investment Bank
■■ the Hydrographic Office
The question and answers section of the document provides the following additional information;

Aviation Regulation

103. Will an independent Scotland still be covered by the Civil Aviation Authority?

Powers over civil aviation will transfer to the Scottish Government and Parliament as a result of independence. After that, decisions on this will be made by the Parliament and Government of an independent Scotland.

We propose to retain the current regulatory framework governing aviation on independence through a memorandum of understanding with the Civil Aviation Authority (CAA). The CAA will report to the Scottish Government on regulatory matters affecting aviation in Scotland.

Building on this initial arrangement an independent Scotland can develop its own regulatory body in due course.

104. How will a Scottish aviation regulator be funded?

The current Scottish Government has no plans to change the current model for the funding of aviation regulation, where the industry covers the cost of regulation.

Aviation

125. What will happen to Air Passenger Duty in an independent Scotland?

Air Passenger Duty is currently set by the Westminster Government. With independence, the Scottish Parliament will be able to set Air Passenger Duty at a level that suits Scotland – or abolish it entirely. It is estimated that Air Passenger Duty will cost Scotland more than £200 million a year in lost tourism spend alone by 2016. In addition to the direct losses to the Scottish economy, another report earlier this year found that reducing Air Passenger Duty would increase receipts from other taxes, such as VAT.

As an early priority for action following independence the current Scottish Government proposes a 50 per cent reduction in APD, with a view to eventual abolition of the tax when public finances allow.

126. Will an independent Scotland protect links to London airports?

The number of flights to London from Scotland has been reducing. With independence, the Scottish Government will be able to protect routes. The present Government would propose to promote Public Service Obligations on routes that benefit the economy most. The current Scottish Government will prioritise a 50 per cent reduction in APD, with a view to eventual abolition of the tax when public finances allow.

127. Will there be more direct flights into an independent Scotland?

More long haul flights operate into independent countries, for example into Denmark and Ireland which are similar in size to Scotland.

The government of an independent Scotland will be able to develop an aviation policy that suits the people of Scotland. This could include the develop of new routes to strategically important markets, such as Asia, boosting tourism by encouraging the use of direct flights to Scottish airports, and working at the top table in the European Union – as an independent member state – to develop more efficient and co-operative international regulation.

128. How will air traffic services be managed in an independent Scotland?

Airspace will be managed in the same way as it is currently managed with the emphasis on allowing the free and safe movement of aircraft.

The Westminster Government has a 49 per cent shareholding in National Air Traffic Services (NATS) and one of its two operational centres is based at Prestwick.

On independence, it is the intention of the current Scottish Government that NATS will continue its services for Scotland. The Scottish Government will negotiate an appropriate share for Scotland of Westminster’s stake in NATS.
I hope this answers your questions Trossie.
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Old 2nd Mar 2014, 22:22
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If the Scots vote for independence, they will loose the Pound. But how can we get them to stop using our language ?
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Old 2nd Mar 2014, 22:33
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It's interesting that the Scottish Government assumes that it will be able to negotiate to use the services it wants in the event of independence. As an Englishman, I would hope that rUK institutions make an economic charge to Scotland for these services.
Also, it offers to "protect" London services by PSO - however it's slots at London Airports that's the problem, and the SG will have no control or input over those.
As a friend of Scotland I'm watching the debate with interest. It looks as though Mr Salmond has done too little detailed preparation, and is being blown about by the massed forces of the Establishment. On the other hand, there are some transparently bullying tactics coming from the Unionists.
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Old 2nd Mar 2014, 23:16
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LGS6753;
It's interesting that the Scottish Government assumes that it will be able to negotiate to use the services it wants in the event of independence. As an Englishman, I would hope that rUK institutions make an economic charge to Scotland for these services.
The white paper states;
The people of Scotland have contributed to the funding and development of these institutions over many years, and continued use of these institutions, for varying periods of time, following independence – with appropriate financial contributions to their administration, along with an equally appropriate say in their governance – is the sensible approach to ensuring continuity of service immediately following independence.
Scotland will therefore pay an appropriate charge for these services.

Some services will migrate to Scotland at an appropriate time after independence. It is proposed that other highly specialised services such as the AAIB and MAIB would continue to be provided from the rUK with Scotland contributing an appropriate amount towards the costs of such organisations. This seems to be a pragmatic approach and should maintain the funding for the AAIB at appropriate levels, thus allowing a suitable level of expertise to be retained.
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 07:27
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That white paper isn't worth the paper its written on.

You would be better calling it Fat ec's Santa list.
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:22
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The CAA will report to the Scottish Government on regulatory matters affecting aviation in Scotland.
Says who?

The UK CAA reports to the UK Government. (It might even be argued that they are doing so less and less and now rather 'reporting' to the European Commission through EASA. And of course, Scotland simply won't be a member of the EU. Simply one veto, and Spain, Italy and Belgium are the initial but not only contenders here, will scupper that daft idea. Why don't the nats listen to the head of the European Commission on this one?)

Why on earth should they 'report' to a foreign government?!! If the UK government (who 'owns' the UK CAA) says "No, they won't", then they won't. (The same as the UK government saying "No, they won't" about the Bank of England in any way 'reporting' to any foreign government.)

Of course, as I have suggested, the CAA could continue to regulate things in Scotland, but on UK government terms (similar to the way that the CAA regulates UK air operations in Antarctica). Airline AOCs (back onto 'topic' and away from that nationalist's narrow rants!) would probably have to relocate so that they are held within the geographical area under the UK CAA's jurisdiction, i.e. 'south of the border'.

Of course, by far the best would be for common sense to prevail and Scots to vote resoundingly 'NO' and for them all to live happily ever after. The airlines and routes (back to topic again!) in Scotland would all be able to continue unhindered by stupid nationalism (and look at how nationalism has hindered airlines in the past in Europe!).
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 10:25
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ScotsSLF said; This thread has drifted somewhat and needs to get back on track. One thing is certain and that is that the status quo in Scotland cannot and will not remain and whether it's a Yes or a No vote change will happen. What we really don't need on this thread is it being hijacked by totally blinkered political views (both Yes & No) so can we get back to aviation please?
With that in mind;

Trossie: The intention is for the Scottish Government to set policy for Scotland. The relevant rUK (as it will be then) organisation will implement that policy and report to the Scottish governments in relation to such matters. The rUK organisation would be suitably recompensed for this.

For the vast majority of issues such as airworthiness, maintenance, airfield regulations, accident investigations etc I can't see there being any difference between rUK and Scottish policies so there would effectively be no significant difference from the current set up except that some of the money would come from the rUK government and the rest would come from the Scottish Government. The Scottish Government might want some specific reports or analysis done; if that were the case then they would need to pay additional charges.

Can you think of specific areas where this arrangement would not work?
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 10:46
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I can't see much effect on aviation - waivers ad grants will be issued to cover any gaps and things will run on as they are. APD is a minor thing to sort out with little operational consequence.

Sadly , the whole thing strikes me as petty, egotistical nationalism. Scotland has more national identity than any other member of the UK and plenty of political independence. They want to be in the EU, but that makes for more regulation and impact on Scottish domestic issues than the UK that they are so keen to escape. And while so keen to leave the UK, they want to retain the UK currency. The only reason for that is that the Scottish economy cannot sustain itself, and by retaining Stirling, they know the UK will bail them out to keep Stirling going, just like the EU bailouts of the crashing Euro users. The nationalists overlook how much money is pumped into Scotland by the rest of the UK through public spending on infrastructure, public sector jobs, benefits (including NHS spending, which is higher per capita than the rest of the UK) and scams like the Barnet Formula.

Scotland have the right to self determination, and I support that, but only a fool would go independent. If they do, then they should not be able to retain UK currency - why should the rest of the UK have to underwrite an independent nation, and if the Scots are so sure about their financial viability, why would they want it?

The no campaign is absolutely right - we're all better off together. No system is perfect, and Westminster does have corruption issues, but less than Edinburgh. And may I remind you that Blair and Brown, the most inept and corrupt PMs we ever had, were both Scots?
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 12:14
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"The rUK organisation would be suitably recompensed for this. "

indeed - and anyone who thinks they'll get it at a bargain price as they do now is smoking something odd

It'll be "Full Commercial Cost" my friends - same with passports, pensions, driving licenses..............

Or you can set up your own bureaucracy
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 12:45
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Under definition it’s not actually independence the separatists seek, more dependency.
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 12:49
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Jet Blast

Mods...

Please have a look, this thread is ready made for Jet Blast..
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 12:52
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But how can we get them to stop using our language ?


Our language ????
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 14:05
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Why on earth would jetblast want this tripe, it has one of its own with its own dedicated SNP stooge arguing the toss at every comment.

I think they get allocated a forum each when something is found and then when it gets to much they get someone else to take extra threads off them.
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 14:42
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The intention is for the Scottish Government to set policy for Scotland. The relevant rUK (as it will be then) organisation will implement that policy and report to the Scottish governments in relation to such matters. The rUK organisation would be suitably recompensed for this.
Matey, you have completely misjudged sentiment 'south of the border'! Why on earth would any "rUK" (as you so quaintly call it!) organisation be in the slightest interested in policy set by the 'Scottish Government'??

You want independence a n d - t h a t - i s - w h a t - y o u' l l - g e t !!

You'll be on your own. No UK CAA, no Bank of England Pound.

Best for Airlines, Airports & Routes in Scotland would be to ditch this Nationalist folly. Nationalists don't have a good track record anywhere, especially those with a 'socialist' bent!

But I agree with all the recent posts. stick to aviation and stop this being used as a mouthpiece for Nat propaganda.
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 16:48
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I agree with Trossie on this. Let me first say that I am a Scot living in England so don't have a vote but I am very much against independence. As Trossie says, the sentiment down here is that anyone who actually thinks it through does not want Scotland to leave the UK - it would diminish the UK as a whole. However if Scotland does leave IT IS ON ITS OWN. The idea that it can have some sort of "pick and mix" independence will not be tolerated down South; if you don't want to stay with us, so be it, but don't think you can just pick and choose what to keep and what to reject. There will also be a re-alignment of the off-shore border so Scotland may find it hasn't got as much oil as it thinks.
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 20:26
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The dissatisfaction with Westminster does not stop at the Scottish Border. I've been a lot in the North West, and a recurring comment when talking about the government: "It's all about the South East". How much united is this kingdom?
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 21:36
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Trossie; if there is a vote for independence, both the Scottish and UK governments acknowledge that there will need to be a period of transition. It won't be a case of flicking a switch in March 2016. That would be as damaging for the rUK as it would for Scotland and I haven't heard anyone from Better Together or the UK Government suggesting that the separation of aviation matters would be as sudden and complete as you are suggesting. If you have evidence to the contrary then please share it as it would be very relevant to this discussion.

There are disagreements about some issues such as the pound but that is for another forum not this one. I agreed yesterday evening to stick to aviation matters in this thread and I subsequently repeated that statement. Let's stick to aviation from here on please.

Getting back to the last question I posed, can you think of specific areas where the transition arrangements would not work? The UK Government have not, as far as I'm aware, disagreed with the proposed transition arrangements in relation to Aviation matters as set out in the white paper.
Porrohman is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 21:43
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Grrr

Maybe Mr Salmond can get another job after he is defeated? How about as a tour guide for ' Nessie Spotting' tours? Yet another hopeless cause!

If the Scottish folk vote 'NO', the bloke has to go! Loch Ness seems a natural progression for his career therefore?

Scotland is part of GB. More devolution is the way forward, but not separation!
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 22:30
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Getting back to the last question I posed, can you think of specific areas where the transition arrangements would not work?
Well they would only have loganair and a few A to A AoC's to pay for it all. Pilots wise you would have to be mad to transfer your license to a Scotland CAA even if it was "EASA"

Quite what industry they have to pay for it all is a bit of a mystery.
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