BIRMINGHAM - 6
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BHX-Bod.
Yes it departed just after midnight I think so problem couldn't have been that bad. Certainly no sign of it when I went past today.
Still chaotic on the roads. The new carriageways are open both ways but down to 1 lane both ways, so unless you have to give the area a miss.
Can't wait for the Monarch hangar to open, will certainly give us a great facility and sure some great 3rd party airlines ,on top of MON and BE.
Nigel
Yes it departed just after midnight I think so problem couldn't have been that bad. Certainly no sign of it when I went past today.
Still chaotic on the roads. The new carriageways are open both ways but down to 1 lane both ways, so unless you have to give the area a miss.
Can't wait for the Monarch hangar to open, will certainly give us a great facility and sure some great 3rd party airlines ,on top of MON and BE.
Nigel
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Hainan Airlines - I am sure BHX must be in talks with Chinese operators as they have so publicly stated that they want a Chinese route. Hainan now have the 787, a possibility for BHX in the future? They fly to TXL, BUD, ZRH and BRU in Europe right now.
Given the presence of Star Alliance at BHX perhaps Air China could be a logical choice? I've no idea how there LGW flights are doing but as they are branching out from LHR perhaps there is potential here? Either way, the 787 is the plane for the job.
To be honest though I think getting Finnair with their connections to China would be great for BHX; along with TAP they are BHX's best chances of securing anymore Euro legacy carriers for the time being. And I know I've said it before but I still think Icelandair would be good for BHX as another option for the States.
And given Air Transat and all their upgrades/downgrades over the past few years perhaps Air Canada Rouge (Star Alliance again) is another one that should be on BHX's radar?
Last edited by chinapattern; 14th Aug 2013 at 17:54.
Emirates will struggle to expand from BHX. Much of their clientele is travelling to the Indian sub-continent and the competition to those markets has dramatically increased this year with TK 10x per week, AI and now Air Blue.
Don't hold your breath for a regular 380!
Don't hold your breath for a regular 380!
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I think Manchester would be the most likely starting point for them in the UK, less (i.e. no) competition than LON and MAG have spent some time looking to secure a route to China.
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China Pattern,
Rouge Only UK destination is EDI at present and thats only because they have 2 way traffic,ie Canadians wanting to visit tourist areas of Scotland as well as Scottish passengers heading to Canada.. so very doubtful they will come here.They were expected to announce LGW but it never happened.
Emirates A380s at BHX..crikey we still have 2 class 77Ws as EK obviously not confident BHX can fill 8 1st class seats on a 3 class.. So to fill even more 1st class and more business class seats on an A380 !!
Air China yes can see that in the future, although MAN are boasting they will announce a Chinese service very soon and it could be Air China.
Nigel
Rouge Only UK destination is EDI at present and thats only because they have 2 way traffic,ie Canadians wanting to visit tourist areas of Scotland as well as Scottish passengers heading to Canada.. so very doubtful they will come here.They were expected to announce LGW but it never happened.
Emirates A380s at BHX..crikey we still have 2 class 77Ws as EK obviously not confident BHX can fill 8 1st class seats on a 3 class.. So to fill even more 1st class and more business class seats on an A380 !!
Air China yes can see that in the future, although MAN are boasting they will announce a Chinese service very soon and it could be Air China.
Nigel
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Aren't all of those Hainan destinations capitals?
Nigel: I agree, I can't see an EK A380 (or QR) anytime soon at BHX, it is worrying that EK continue with only a 2 class service, this does not show any confidence in the premium market at BHX on a route that is now very well established. This must be something that other long haul airlines potentially looking at BHX have clocked.
china pattern - yes they would be a great add at BHX (it was recently rumoured but nothing so far has happened) What worries me is if the demand for flights to China from BHX is as strong as the airport claims would Finnair not already be capitalising on this from BHX given their excellent Far Eastern connections? I wonder how many people actually go to China from the BHX catchment either from LHR/LGW or from BHX via a European hub?
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Gayfriendly,
I think EK might have moved to a 3 class 77W if there hadn't been the complete saturation from MAN, with EK Qatar and Etihad "keeping up with the Jones" expansion.That hit our EK hard
TK expansion then slowed their progress. Recent months have seen steady increases once more so may get a 3 class next year if that continues.
Qatar for BHX who knows.. Helsinki are still waiting and that was after a joint press announcement from both that airport and Qatar 2 yrs ago.. Does them joining One World end our ambitions now, as they don't really do BHX ?
JLR are building a massive new plant in Shanghai China at present and with the Midlands close links with the motor industry ,wouldn't rule out a BHX-Shanghai in the future.
Nigel
I think EK might have moved to a 3 class 77W if there hadn't been the complete saturation from MAN, with EK Qatar and Etihad "keeping up with the Jones" expansion.That hit our EK hard
TK expansion then slowed their progress. Recent months have seen steady increases once more so may get a 3 class next year if that continues.
Qatar for BHX who knows.. Helsinki are still waiting and that was after a joint press announcement from both that airport and Qatar 2 yrs ago.. Does them joining One World end our ambitions now, as they don't really do BHX ?
JLR are building a massive new plant in Shanghai China at present and with the Midlands close links with the motor industry ,wouldn't rule out a BHX-Shanghai in the future.
Nigel
Emirates - 3 Class Config at BHX
Whilst it would be good to have the choice of a 3 class service on BHX-DXB, in these times when money is tight you have to ask who, apart from celebs and frivalous company directors can really justify the expense of first class?
Midlands SMEs will be struggling at the moment, especially in manufacturing, and there'll surely be a ban on using anything more expensive than business class. Large business with Midland based operations will often have their UK execs. based in and around London, where there is a totally different economy, and different attitude to spending (wasting) shareholders money.
"F" class has died out completely on European routes, in fact business class is virtually dead on it's feet too. I can see within a few years that most long haul ops will find themselves down to 2-class, Business and Cattle!
Those who insist on the comfort, or more likely qudos of First will wind up migrating to the likes of Netjets.
Midlands SMEs will be struggling at the moment, especially in manufacturing, and there'll surely be a ban on using anything more expensive than business class. Large business with Midland based operations will often have their UK execs. based in and around London, where there is a totally different economy, and different attitude to spending (wasting) shareholders money.
"F" class has died out completely on European routes, in fact business class is virtually dead on it's feet too. I can see within a few years that most long haul ops will find themselves down to 2-class, Business and Cattle!
Those who insist on the comfort, or more likely qudos of First will wind up migrating to the likes of Netjets.
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ATNOTTS
Andrew I would have agreed with you few weeks back, but surprised to read a recent article saying more and more airlines are cutting economy pitch and putting an extra seat in across lot of wide bodies in economy.
This as they try to find ways to squeeze more lie flat beds,in the front end, as demand is booming.
Birmingham and Newcastle are now the only 2 airports in the UK that get 2 class machines, so there is certainly demand for top end seats in other places than London.
The Business Class product in many airlines has improved so much that there is now little difference between 1st and Business class .The latter used to just have bigger seats but most now have beds.
Certainly BHX would find it difficult to fill an A380 up front for a while, but can see a 3 class 77W possibly in the next 12-18 months.
Nigel
Andrew I would have agreed with you few weeks back, but surprised to read a recent article saying more and more airlines are cutting economy pitch and putting an extra seat in across lot of wide bodies in economy.
This as they try to find ways to squeeze more lie flat beds,in the front end, as demand is booming.
Birmingham and Newcastle are now the only 2 airports in the UK that get 2 class machines, so there is certainly demand for top end seats in other places than London.
The Business Class product in many airlines has improved so much that there is now little difference between 1st and Business class .The latter used to just have bigger seats but most now have beds.
Certainly BHX would find it difficult to fill an A380 up front for a while, but can see a 3 class 77W possibly in the next 12-18 months.
Nigel
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All BHX Emirates flights are full in respect of cargo this being local and also roaded to BHX from London and Manchester
The A380 holds less cargo than the B773 so with Manchester going to 2 x A380 the pressure for freight space on going to increase further
Freight from BHX recently has been roaded to NCL as all BHX capacity is full
The A380 holds less cargo than the B773 so with Manchester going to 2 x A380 the pressure for freight space on going to increase further
Freight from BHX recently has been roaded to NCL as all BHX capacity is full
Freight from BHX recently has been roaded to NCL as all BHX capacity is full
Whilst passenger numbers always grab the headlines, cargo must be a very important revenue stream for Emirates from BHX and probably props up the route during the lean passenger times, such as Ramadan and high summer.
How much more uplift will be possible when the extra runway length is available I wonder.
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Chaps2011,
Re EK and MAN 77F freight flights, this rumour has been doing the rounds for nearly 2 years.
Problem is EK have all their freight planes committed. For a large airlines they don't have many freighters ,so unless they drop a current one its going to be hard to find a spare plane ?
Nigel
Re EK and MAN 77F freight flights, this rumour has been doing the rounds for nearly 2 years.
Problem is EK have all their freight planes committed. For a large airlines they don't have many freighters ,so unless they drop a current one its going to be hard to find a spare plane ?
Nigel
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EK
AT Notts, the answer is none. EK are only restricted by MZFW at BHX, the runway is perfectly long enough for a full flight, pax and cargo, with enough fuel to hold at DXB for several hours if need be. Ramp fuel of 70+ tonnes happens quite often during the DXB fog season, normal is in the 50's.
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Emirates Sky Cargo have on order 5 X Boeing 777 - 200 Freighters. If Emirates Sky Cargo introduce a dedicated freighter into MAN then this could increase Cargo loads at BHX. Then maybe the introduction of a Boeing 777 - 300 ER at BHX to accommodate the extra space required in the lower hold for cargo.
Last edited by Airfrance7; 15th Aug 2013 at 19:36.
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nigel, the SkyCargo ops at MAN have always been rumoured to be in conjuncton with the 2nd A380 service. Consequently with the seemingly soon permanent introduction of a 2nd daily A380 then the jungle drums will be beating louder for the dedicated freighter.
I do wonder if EK will go to 3 daily operation at BHX with the A350 as a way of increasing capacity and feeding into the earlier wave of departures at DXB, rather than going to 3 daily 77W which may be a slight overkill
I do wonder if EK will go to 3 daily operation at BHX with the A350 as a way of increasing capacity and feeding into the earlier wave of departures at DXB, rather than going to 3 daily 77W which may be a slight overkill
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I may be wrong but I thought "Rouge" benefitted from a hefty subsidy from some form of Scottish Development Fund, not too dissimilar to the same "pot" that paid for those "Visit Scotland" adverts which ran on TV for years.........
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Just reading this thread...... surely all of this cannot be right?
What posters are saying with EK is that MAN freight is being trucked to BHX and BHX freight is being trucked to NCL......
If the circumstances were in place that would lead to road freighting, would it not be more logical to truck MAN freight to NCL and leave BHX to deal with its own freight capacity issues?
I would suspect posters are taking examples of one off situations and assuming it is the norm.
What posters are saying with EK is that MAN freight is being trucked to BHX and BHX freight is being trucked to NCL......
If the circumstances were in place that would lead to road freighting, would it not be more logical to truck MAN freight to NCL and leave BHX to deal with its own freight capacity issues?
I would suspect posters are taking examples of one off situations and assuming it is the norm.