BIRMINGHAM - 6

[GayFriendly]

BHX-TXL

Gutted but not surprised, as soon as it went from LH to 4U that was the death knell as they kept chopping and changing times, ending up with a schedule very unattractive to the BHX outbound traveller. I never once saw any 4U advertising anywhere for either their TXL or HAM services from BHX.


Come on BE, please give Berlin a try!! Looks like I am back to BA from LHR again or BE to HAJ, what a pain.


Very strong rumours on the MAN thread about an announcement of Air China MAN-PEK, some saying it's almost imminent. I wonder where BHX are up to with their lobbying for a scheduled China flight given the China Southern charters next month

[chinapattern]

Dissapointing news about TXL; the new BER airport fiasco can't have helped matters either. Lets indeed hope Flybe are looking at this one now.

[OltonPete]

May International route figures

Monthly passenger figures from the CAA and the average pax and load factors estimated with aid of a local SBS log and seat maps.

Some gaps due to IT figures mixed in with schedule figures I believe on Malta, Alicante, Arrecife, Fuerteventura, Tenerife and Hanover is just missing.

I have left out some of the weekly flybe French routes out as they operated twice at the end of May.

Air India as expected dropped like a stone with the low season but at least they were smart enough to start when 9 consecutive months of decent figures (as expected).

Turkish was down but fewer if any 321's used compared to previous years and a reasonable load factor considering it was May.

Considering May was a record there are some routes that could improve if given the time (Berlin seems not to be one of these) although some of the FR ones can't really do much more (well above their network figure).

Brussels........10072 (9727)..... 44 per flight..55% load factor
Dubrovnik.......4162 (2573)......149 pax.......66%
Split..............1575 (922).......,98 pax........57%
Larnaca..........6551 (7388).....164 pax.......78%
Paphos.......... 3042 (3869).....179 pax.......84%
Copenhagen...9299 (6936).......88 pax........75%
Bordeaux........1346 (550)........56 pax.........67%
Lyons............3611 (nil)..........69 pax.........79%
Montepellier.......nil (1936)......................
Nice...............4992 4985)......131 pax........64%
Paris CDG......31697 (30145)...101 pax.........74%
Toulouse.........1553 (541)......52 pax..........65%
Berlin TXL.......3056 (4524)......90 pax.........65%
Cologne..........2313 (nil).........37 pax.........46%
Dusseldorf.....16049 (15511)....52 pax.........60%
Frankfurt.......23696 (21663)..106 pax.........70%
Hamburg.........2921 (2907).....56 pax..........59%
Hanover........figures not provided
Munich..........14013 (13696)...89 pax.........73%
Stuttgart........5844 (3557).....55 pax..........63%
Gibraltar..........3667 (2781)....141pax.........81%
Cork...............5898 (6198).....49 pax.........68%
Knock.............2765 (2479).....46 pax.........59%
Dublin............57911 (44336)..118 pax.........76%
Shannon..........3784 (2814).....31 pax.........58%
Waterford........1951 (1522).....57 pax.........74%
Bergamo............nil (3416)
Florence..........3419 (nil)........63 pax.........72%
Milan MXP........7156 (4632).....61 pax.........69%
Rome FCO........9549 (9214)...165 pax.........81%
Trieste...............nil (2011)
Venice.............5334 (5235)...148 pax.......77%
Malta..............3344 (2939..)..??? pax........??% (some IT pax included?)
Amsterdam.....42690 (41161)..91 pax.........77%
Faro.............19815 (16113)..191 pax.........92%
Oporto...........2082 (nil).........55 pax.........66%
Funchel..........2384 (1993)...132 pax.........69%
Alicante........30214 (26210).,.??? pax.........??%
Almeria...........3158 (3105)...175 pax.........82%
Barcelona......16030 (13588)..151 pax.........77%
Girona...............nil (1968)
Ibiza..............6039 (6600)...134 pax........70%
Malaga.........23708 (25635)..180 pax........85%
Murcia...........5913 (5045)...164 pax.........87%
Palma...........21114 (20015)..158 pax........86%
Reus.............2384 (3470)....132 pax....... 71%
Arrecife........13784 (10591) incorrect split shown between schedule & IT
Fuerteventura 7494 incorrect split shown between schedule & IT
Las Palmas.....6821 (4576)...159 pax.........78%
Tenerife.......17504 (14184) incorrect split shown between schedule & IT
Gothenburg....1211 (752)......24 pax.........49%
Arlanda.........2147 (2733).....72 pax.........62%
Zurich..........8421 (8278)......68 pax.........69%
Bodrum.........3958 (3467)...180 pax.........84%
Dalaman........8690 (9652)..143 pax.........69%
Istanbul......10887 (11081)..124 pax.........82%
Kaunas.........2707 (2815)...169 pax.........90%
Bydgoscz......5006 (4340)...179 pax.........95%
Gdansk.......3196 (2556).....178 pax.........94%
Katowice.....3269 (4524)....182 pax.........96%
Krakow........2892 (2856)...181 pax..........96%
Bratislava....4891 (4356).....175 pax.........92%
Hurghada.....1447 (0).........161 pax.........75%
Sharm........5109 (4790).....189 pax.........88%
Ashkhabad....4036 (3745)...126 pax..........68%
Dubai.........37063 (34925)..299 pax.........72%
Delhi...........2134 (nil)
Amritsar.......3680 (nil).......162 pax..........63%
Islamabad....8066 (7970).....224 pax.........66%
Newark........8860 (8921).....148 pax.........87%

Pete

[Hotel Tango]

All down to yield I guess, but interesting to note that TXL gets the chop with 65% average whilst DUS survives at 60%. I'm a little concerned about what will happen with DUS once it becomes fully integrated into GWI in September.

[ATNotts]

Hotel Tango

I don't think the two routes are really comparable, as TXL doesn't even manage daily service, so won't be attracting higher yield business traffic in any numbers, whereas DUS is a multi daily operation, and apart from the much greater industry / commerce base in the Ruhr, the airport has good connections to other German and European business centres.

How much of a mess the move from LH to 4U actually makes of the route remains to be seen, but I'm sure Flybe will soon clean up on any point to point business that 4U manage to mislay.

[Phileas Fogg]

Please don't chop DUS ... DUS is a LH hub, via DUS was a fantastic way, with PDQ connections, to travel BHX/KBP/BHX on pocket rockets all the way and it's all in one terminal at DUS.

A lovely, not so, little airport, leave DUS alone please

[ATNotts]

Phileas

Please don't chop DUS ... DUS is a LH hub

Agree wholeheartedly! I really don't understand why LH want to put business orientated services on DUS routes into the hands of what is perceived to be a leisure airline. Even though connections will still be available through 4U at DUS the fact the UK-DUS leg is being operated by a leisure orientated airline may put off some business passengers.

[Phileas Fogg]

ATNotts,

Traveling from BHX I quite literally "fell in love" with the "Swiss" product, BTW I worked in aviation for 30+ years, Swiss's cabin's are so clean, their crews so ultra friendly, their fares between BHX and Italy were often cheaper than the so-called loco's and one got a complimentary coffee, beer and a snack on each sector ... I also utilised Swiss BHX/HKG/BHX and the crews are as professional and friendly intercontinental as they are inter Europe.

Then they went and spoiled it all by putting Helvetic on the BHX sectors

[Suzeman]

and one got a complimentary coffee, beer and a snack on each sector ... I

Don't forget the complimentary chocolate too!

[insuindi]

"the fact the UK-DUS leg is being operated by a leisure orientated airline may put off some business passengers."

Germanwings is not at all leisure orientated. With the exception of onward flights from DUS to Chicago and New York (& FRA and MUC if anyone did that rather than the direct one) everything will be Germanwings to/from DUS by autumn.

https://www.germanwings.com/de/Flugi...erflugplan.htm

As of autumn, the LH product (with the exception of those two longhaul routes ex DUS) will only be available to/from FRA/MUC (for any market, not only the Uk market).

[Phileas Fogg]

Don't forget the complimentary chocolate too!

Ah yes,

I forgot about the Swiss chocolate ... And also that one could buy (non EU) duty frees on the ZRH route.

One flight I'd forgotten to bring my "Miles & More" card for my duty free purchases, with a smile the C/A presented me with her pen as a reminder not to forget my card next time ... Later during the flight I asked of her if I could swap her pen for another beer, she just smiled telling me to keep the pen as she presented me with another beer.

Another flight, obviously a new C/A came round with the duty frees, I asked for "400 Marlboro Gold please", she gave me a confused look asking "Are those cigarettes?", I smiled and replied "You don't smoke do you?" ... she just cracked up laughing

[getonittt]

I'm a little concerned about what will happen with DUS once it becomes fully integrated into GWI in September

Please don't chop DUS

DUS is one of BHX's top year round euro scheduled routes only bettered in terms of pax by the Alliance hubs of AMS /FRA & CDG . The schedule from 18/09/14 :

Germanwings 17 weekly CRJ and Flybe 22 weekly E75.

As you can see that is a serious schedule so no need to worry .

What happened to the berlin schedule was a shame but you must remember that when it was announced it was to the NEW Brandenburg airport and a NEW LH hub.

[insuindi]

"and a NEW LH hub."

splitting hairs here, but BER would have been a new LH base, not a hub in the sense of FRA, MUC or DUS.

And I agree, BHXDUS is in no danger of disappearing.

[All names taken]

Berlin
What many don't realize is that Berlin is essentially a leisure route especially from the regions. In fairness it almost seems counter-intuitive.

Just because it is Germany's capital and its biggest city doesn't mean the yield is there.

The gov2gov market makes the Berlin to [insert other capital city] market worthwhile but outside that its a low yield tourist route.

Those kinds of loads on a low yield destination are going to mean only one thing and that is what has happened here.

DUS on the other hand is a totally different proposition as it is the centre of the Rhine Ruhr metropolis and I believe to be Germany's richest city.

If BHX were to lose all its international routes, I wouldn't mind betting that DUS would be one of the last to go. So nothing to worry about in terms of low load factors.
As so many pprune posters continuously say, it's the yield - ie how much money can be made - that really counts.

[insuindi]

DUS is not quite the richest, but not doubt economically very strong, and in a massive metropole area (Hamburg is actually the richest in terms of inhabitant's average wealth, whereas FRA has the largest GDP of the big German cities - followed by DUS as the next big one - Berlin can usually be found near the end for any of these and other rankings (Top 50: Deutschlands Power-Städte - Wirtschaft - Bild.de)

[All names taken]

So are you agreeing or disagreeing with me that Berlin to UK regional is at best marginal due to the preponderance of leisure flyers?

[insuindi]

well, based on what is widely known and those stats provided: from foreign regional airports, Berlin is at best a marginal market for business travel. There is very little commerce and nil industry in Berlin (for historic reasons). And to top it off it's a very (!) price sensitive leisure market.

[LN-KGL]

I haven't seen anything about this one here:

Closure of the route between ARN and BHX from 27JUN14
The last flight from ARN will be SK2553, and from BHX SK2554 27JUN14. Passengers will be rebooked via CPH by SAS.

[BHX5DME]

LN-KGL - can we have Norwegian please ?

[OltonPete]

Stockholm

LN-KGL

The flight was always due to end 27 June and up until two days ago it was to restart Friday 29 August back at four a week.

However there were rumours abound that it was to end probably winter although again two days ago it was bookable Wednesday, Friday & Sunday for November onwards with its usual Christmas break. It is still bookable at times for winter but I assume the booking engine is to be updated.

However it was clear that some knew that it was going to end earlier than that but hardly surprising based on load factor alone, then there was the constant starting and stopping of the service and to compound it all Blue 1 announced that are getting rid of at least four 717's (if not the whole fleet).

Hopefully along with Berlin, flybe will crunch some numbers and maybe find an aircraft from an increasing busy fleet.

Pete