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BER not before 2014 !

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BER not before 2014 !

Old 6th Jan 2013, 19:08
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BER not before 2014 !

Just breaking on German news: Berlin Brandenburg not to open before 2014 !

Absolutely amazing IMHO.
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Old 6th Jan 2013, 19:21
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Just breaking on German news: Berlin Brandenburg not to open before 2014 !
Federal transport minister was discussing this quite openly on 26 Dec last year - would be rare for someone like him to talk publicly about a project as being "in danger" without good reason for saying so....

Minister: Berlin airport date is in danger - The Local
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Old 6th Jan 2013, 19:47
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Not like the old days

Prefer they be late than having someone make the trains run on time, that was tried last time and didn't work out.
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Old 6th Jan 2013, 19:49
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racedo - you've got the wrong dictator - it was the one in Rome who loved trains
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Old 6th Jan 2013, 22:29
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Well it's now official. Regardless of the reasons I still find this quite amazing.
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Old 7th Jan 2013, 14:05
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Typical German inefficiency, I'm afraid.
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Old 7th Jan 2013, 15:47
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Doesn't really surprise me, Berlin never really has lived up to the whole German efficiency model!
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Old 7th Jan 2013, 17:48
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A great deal of hand wringing from opposition politicians on Morgen Magazine (ZDF TV) this morning about the whole debacle. More heads seem likely to roll.

having someone make the trains run on time
Travelling on the DB these days, things even ain't what they used to be on the railway either. Delays, almost unheard of 30 years ago, seem to be the norm these days, rather than the exception.

At least they haven't been stupid enough to privatise them!!
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Old 7th Jan 2013, 22:41
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Yes they have. Lots of other rail companies are now running franchises in Germany with more to follow..
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Old 8th Jan 2013, 09:12
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jdcg

Agreed, but the main rump of the operation is still DB, and you can still through tickets, and buy the best fares without going through booking agencies.

Also, with a login from DB, you can buy and print out paper tickets on line, without having to turn up at the station, credit card in hand, and extract them from infernal machines!!
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Old 8th Jan 2013, 11:37
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What I want to know about is how does it affect the airlines that plan use BER:

Firstly Air Berlin is in a poor financial state (mainly due the poor economy and the delays to BER) and is basically living on support from Eithad, if the delays keep coming, do you think this will tip them over the edge? (or push Eithad towards giving up altogether their involvement with AB)

Secondly, will the proposed Lufthansa/Germanwings hub (sort of...) at BER will still go ahead, or will they give up altogether?

Or maybe even Germanwings could fill the gap left by AB (if it goes out of business) in BER, this making the airport one of "LH" major hubs (along with FRA/MUC/DUS/ZRH)?
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Old 8th Jan 2013, 13:15
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Quote: "Typical German inefficiency, I'm afraid."

Wasn't the original typical stereotype about blindly following the "rule book" or the "manual"/"instructions"?


Quote: "Travelling on the DB these days, things even ain't what they used to be on the railway either. Delays, almost unheard of 30 years ago, seem to be the norm these days, rather than the exception.

At least they haven't been stupid enough to privatise them!!
"

Quote: "Yes they have. Lots of other rail companies are now running franchises in Germany with more to follow.."

Any connections?
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Old 8th Jan 2013, 17:42
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Fairdealfrank

Any connections
I'm not entirely sure this is a DB thread (perhaps there should be a new section "Railways, Stations and Routes"!).

However the answer is yes! The Rurtalbahn, running between Heimbach / Eifel and Düren seamlessly tickets with the DB; and the Vogtlandbahn (owned by Arriva Trains actually) also connect seamlessly with the DB network at many stations, including Regensburg.

Of course the DB already operates trains in the UK (Chiltern Railways and at least one other who's name I can't remember) but for whatever reason, what is possible in Germany seams impossible here!

Last edited by ATNotts; 8th Jan 2013 at 17:43. Reason: Rubbish English
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Old 8th Jan 2013, 17:47
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DB own Arriva, so they run all Welsh Trains, Crosscountry as well as the London Overground and the Tyne & Wear Metro...
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Old 8th Jan 2013, 19:45
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Deecie
Also a large chunk of UK freight services through DB Shenka I am told. Anyway as this is an airlines and routes thread back to BER. I have contacts who are involved in this build (having done other airport contracts in the past world wide) and there does seem to have been what could politley be called a disconnect in some aspects of the design. The design from what I am to undrstand has been a little too "fluid" with many late changes some of considerable size and complexity. These will no doubt ome out in the future court case !.
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Old 9th Jan 2013, 11:09
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BER is not the only farce... whilst DXB extension opened on time, Maskat in Oman was supposed to be open 2012 with a new date of 2014 ($7bil project),

New Doha International Airport in Qatar is now 5 years behind, at the beginning of 2012 the 12th Dec 2012 was the supposed opening date, now it looks like summer 2013 with no firm date.
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Old 9th Jan 2013, 12:13
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This will suit some airlines that fly from SXF. Depending on your deal the charges for BER compared with SXF were extortionate!
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Old 9th Jan 2013, 13:13
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well given the level of service at SXF and would certainly expect a significant increase if / when BER opens. Is there any plan to continue to operate the current terminal for low cost carrier or is everyone expected to move ?
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Old 9th Jan 2013, 14:41
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@atakacs

the plan was/is for all airlines to use the new BER terminal, with the old SXF terminal to be used by the government until their new-build is finished.

given the capacity constraints and the unknown opening date of BER who knows whether they will look at the old SXF terminal again for LCCs.
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Old 9th Jan 2013, 15:45
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In support of atakacs...

Looking at official stats from Jan-Nov 2012, we see that passenger numbers grew by 7.8% at Tegel and by 0.3% at Schoenefeld, or 5.6% across the 2 airports (remember that Tegel is much larger than Schoenefeld)
Assuming Dec 2012 shows a similiar growth rate compared to Dec 2011, this would indicate Berlin saw about 25.4m passengers in 2012

Looking at growth rates over the last 5 years, one might hypothesise that passenger traffic would be between 26.5 and 27m passengers for 2013

Figures I've seen suggest that the new airport terminal has a design capacity for about 27m passengers, so the airport is likely to be kept busy from the day it opens.
They have enough runnway capacity, the question is over terminal capacity, remember it can be expanded to deal with more passengers (sadly they did not do it in the first place, they might as well...)
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