MANCHESTER - 9
I can't see the taxpayers of Greater Manchester being very happy at their local authority spending £1,500,000,000 on an airport 200 miles away that's in serious decline. They have spent what GIP paid for Gatwick - a growing airport with a decent catchment area, a wide range of airline customers and over 33m passengers. And they have bought an under-invested, poorly-located airport in serious decline, dominated by the most aggressively competitive airline in Europe that won't hesitate to defend their position of dominance.
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: North, UK
Age: 67
Posts: 936
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
LGS the deal is not funded solely by the tax payers of Greater Manchester there is a 1 billion deal with Australia's IFM.
Under the deal, which was conditional on the Stansted takeover going ahead, largest shareholder Manchester council would reduce its share in MAG from 55 per cent to 35 per cent. The remaining nine councils would jointly have a 30 per cent stake, down from 45 per cent.
Under the deal, which was conditional on the Stansted takeover going ahead, largest shareholder Manchester council would reduce its share in MAG from 55 per cent to 35 per cent. The remaining nine councils would jointly have a 30 per cent stake, down from 45 per cent.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MAG works best when they focus laser like on Manchester Airport. Stansted will be a major challenge and managing that will, once again, mean some focus is lost on MAN.
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 18th Jan 2013 at 21:20.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lancs, UK
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Used to like using the Escape lounges before my holiday, was worth the outlay for a bit of peace and quiet. Unfortunately will no longer be able to as my 5 yr old no longer welcome. Why discriminate against all families when a few are unruly. Ask the misbehaving ones to leave. Easy!
Rant over
Rant over
I just don't understand this purchase. Like Skippy says, it will be a distraction & the MAN focus will be lost.
Why anyone would buy an ailing airport dominated by one carrier I don't know.
The City council will also have lost their majority stake in MAN & the other councils will no doubt have their airport income reduced.
Surely this is the thin end of the wedge where MAN itself is eventually put up for sale & the MAG only connection with MAN will be the name.
If only the time, effort & resource had been ploughed into MAN instead of this folly.
Why anyone would buy an ailing airport dominated by one carrier I don't know.
The City council will also have lost their majority stake in MAN & the other councils will no doubt have their airport income reduced.
Surely this is the thin end of the wedge where MAN itself is eventually put up for sale & the MAG only connection with MAN will be the name.
If only the time, effort & resource had been ploughed into MAN instead of this folly.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: STANSTED & MANCHESTER
Posts: 1,892
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's a star buy ! A London airport with loads
Of space in a crowded market ...
Even if the go ahead was given today to build
A brand new hub airport in the London area
It is just to late like it or not stansted will have
To be used before to much longer and MAG
Has got a good deal in Stansted.
Of space in a crowded market ...
Even if the go ahead was given today to build
A brand new hub airport in the London area
It is just to late like it or not stansted will have
To be used before to much longer and MAG
Has got a good deal in Stansted.
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: North, UK
Age: 67
Posts: 936
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree why not encourage the £650 million Airport City project on the airports doorstep instead, oh sorry they are.
Both airports make a profit, which belies the ailing Stansted quote.
Both airports make a profit, which belies the ailing Stansted quote.
Last edited by pwalhx; 19th Jan 2013 at 09:40.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Essex
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Remember that Stansted is only the way it is now because the way that BAA have managed it. A lot of people say that Stansted is in decline because it is no longer subsidised by Heathrow's profits to keep it going and is ultimately a failing airport on it's own two feet. Absolutely not the case! BAA have clearly been using Stansted as an extra source of cash to develop Heathrow, hence the reason they battled to keep a declining airport and that several potential buyers came forward when put up for sale, because Stansted has a bright future under the right ownership.
At first, there may be a bit of Manchester's profits helping to put Stansted on the right track but I don't think you are going to lose passengers and airlines as a result. I really don't think Manchester is going to suffer as a result of this purchase. It's just yet another case of MAG succeeding in what it does. Well done MAG!
At first, there may be a bit of Manchester's profits helping to put Stansted on the right track but I don't think you are going to lose passengers and airlines as a result. I really don't think Manchester is going to suffer as a result of this purchase. It's just yet another case of MAG succeeding in what it does. Well done MAG!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: solihull West Midlands
Posts: 967
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Daz211
Reality check,
LCC dominate Stansted because BAA was able to heavily subsidise STN with profits from LHR keeping prices cheap.
Will MAG be able to do the same ?
Full fare airlines have tried time and again to make STN work, American Airlines SAS and more.There was so little business fare pick up they were forced to pull out quickly.
Its only full fare traffic that brings in big money so I am bemused as to why MAG have bought it.
The business community want to fly out of LHR not somewhere in the sticks that does not have airline alliance connections.
Perhaps freight is a way forward but surely any big increase at STN means less for Manchester Airport ?
Nigel
Reality check,
LCC dominate Stansted because BAA was able to heavily subsidise STN with profits from LHR keeping prices cheap.
Will MAG be able to do the same ?
Full fare airlines have tried time and again to make STN work, American Airlines SAS and more.There was so little business fare pick up they were forced to pull out quickly.
Its only full fare traffic that brings in big money so I am bemused as to why MAG have bought it.
The business community want to fly out of LHR not somewhere in the sticks that does not have airline alliance connections.
Perhaps freight is a way forward but surely any big increase at STN means less for Manchester Airport ?
Nigel
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: STANSTED & MANCHESTER
Posts: 1,892
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No No No !
I am not going into all this again ...
BAA never wanted Flag carriers at STN
STN was used to keep the for want of a better word
Flag carriers at LHR.
Many long haul flights worked at STN
Inc AA and CO, Maxjet and eos were doing fine
Until bad times hit all aviation and until BA and AA
got worried about the decline of their
Business class passengers...
Anyway time will tell but in my eyes this is the
Best news for STN and MAG ....
I am not going into all this again ...
BAA never wanted Flag carriers at STN
STN was used to keep the for want of a better word
Flag carriers at LHR.
Many long haul flights worked at STN
Inc AA and CO, Maxjet and eos were doing fine
Until bad times hit all aviation and until BA and AA
got worried about the decline of their
Business class passengers...
Anyway time will tell but in my eyes this is the
Best news for STN and MAG ....
Last edited by daz211; 19th Jan 2013 at 10:48.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
daz211 are you aware that BAA took Air Canada and others to court in order to force them from LHR to STN? The new white elephant Terminal was built on thr back of LHR dominated group profits. It was built as a full service hub for Air UK, it was built for a market that never was.
Can MAG do for STN what GIP have done for LGW? Overcharge a loyal customer (BE) and lose three long haul carriers in a year to focus on LHR? LGW looks good but it's the same old market, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Do you see SAS, LH, AA coming back? If not, who? AA went in soley to kill off Eos and Maxjet. Sorry, just realised, this is better off on the Stansted thread.
Can MAG do for STN what GIP have done for LGW? Overcharge a loyal customer (BE) and lose three long haul carriers in a year to focus on LHR? LGW looks good but it's the same old market, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Do you see SAS, LH, AA coming back? If not, who? AA went in soley to kill off Eos and Maxjet. Sorry, just realised, this is better off on the Stansted thread.
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 19th Jan 2013 at 11:58.
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Middlesex (under the flightpath)
Posts: 1,946
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
cross subsidy by BAA
Which was it:
Was LHR subsidisng STN out of its profits, or was STN subsidising LHR for its infrastructure improvements?
At the risk of sounding tedious, there will be no dramatic increase in legacy longhaul at STN, for two reasons:
(1) premium business is at LHR and that's where carriers make their money;
(2) there is, and always will be, insufficient connectivity at STN.
It's the same at LGW, which legacy longhaul at LGW use as a "waiting room" until LHR slots become available, and at BHX, MAN, GLA, etc..
If and when carriers can make money, services from these airports will be available.
Was LHR subsidisng STN out of its profits, or was STN subsidising LHR for its infrastructure improvements?
At the risk of sounding tedious, there will be no dramatic increase in legacy longhaul at STN, for two reasons:
(1) premium business is at LHR and that's where carriers make their money;
(2) there is, and always will be, insufficient connectivity at STN.
It's the same at LGW, which legacy longhaul at LGW use as a "waiting room" until LHR slots become available, and at BHX, MAN, GLA, etc..
If and when carriers can make money, services from these airports will be available.
Last edited by Fairdealfrank; 19th Jan 2013 at 13:26.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Essex
Posts: 1,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
At the risk of sounding tedious, there will be no dramatic increase in legacy longhaul at STN, for two reasons:
(1) premium business is at LHR and that's where carriers make their money;
(2) there is, and always will be, insufficient connectivity at STN.
(1) premium business is at LHR and that's where carriers make their money;
(2) there is, and always will be, insufficient connectivity at STN.
Was LHR subsidisng STN out of its profits, or was STN subsidising LHR for its infrastructure improvements?
The fact that BAA spent 3 years fighting for an airport that continued to decline clearly shows that STN was subsidising LHR. There is no other reason as to why they would want to keep it if it was genuinely a failing airport with little growth in the future. The truth is, BAA (or Heathrow Ltd. as it is now) only have eyes for Heathrow. They didn't want to lose Stansted because it would effect how much they could spend on Heathrow. It's as simple as that. They can't have subsidised Stansted because they haven't invested nearly the amound that they have at Heathrow.
Anyway, point over. Need to remember that this is the Manchester thread.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What exactly did they need to invest in? It's in pretty good nick an not stacked out. It's a good operation. Like LGW, BAA fought to hang onto it to maintain a monopoly. LHR had been let go with no major work since T4 in 1985. BAA then built LGW North in 1988 and STN got the new terminal in ~1991. (Is that right?)
Investment spread across the group, exactly what will happen now. MAG have a London airport and some will now imagine they can take on LHR. Which is mad.
The challenge will be for MAN to hang onto focus and group investment for the core business. What's the betting they offer Emirates an unbeatable group deal to open STN-DXB?
Investment spread across the group, exactly what will happen now. MAG have a London airport and some will now imagine they can take on LHR. Which is mad.
The challenge will be for MAN to hang onto focus and group investment for the core business. What's the betting they offer Emirates an unbeatable group deal to open STN-DXB?
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 19th Jan 2013 at 15:01.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: London
Posts: 523
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Aegean to Athens
Aegean are expected to join the merry band of *A scheduled carriers this summer (Previous operations were summer charters and these continue)
Scheduled
Aegean are showing Athens-Manchester- Athens
Flight No A3638/A3639 operated by A320
Mon and Sat Arrive Man 2020 Dep 21.05
Commences 25/5 through to 26/9 in current timetable
Yet another addition to the *A focus!
Yes its copy and paste from another place however contains salient points and of direct relevance to Manchester Airport Operations (As opposed to MAG Group - that deserves a unique thread now )
Scheduled
Aegean are showing Athens-Manchester- Athens
Flight No A3638/A3639 operated by A320
Mon and Sat Arrive Man 2020 Dep 21.05
Commences 25/5 through to 26/9 in current timetable
Yet another addition to the *A focus!
Yes its copy and paste from another place however contains salient points and of direct relevance to Manchester Airport Operations (As opposed to MAG Group - that deserves a unique thread now )
