Monarch - 3
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: UK
Age: 55
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mmmmm.....I still have concerns that Monarch will not make it.
The extra funding will only delay the inevitable IMHO and I would imagine Easyjet would be the company most likely to pick up the pieces.
The CEO did not sound very convincing on Radio 4 just a few hours ago.
We are just entering a downturn in the industry and the likes of Monarch, Air Berlin, Norwegian and a fair few others are going to struggle and will most likely not make it out of the other side I am afraid to say.
The extra funding will only delay the inevitable IMHO and I would imagine Easyjet would be the company most likely to pick up the pieces.
The CEO did not sound very convincing on Radio 4 just a few hours ago.
We are just entering a downturn in the industry and the likes of Monarch, Air Berlin, Norwegian and a fair few others are going to struggle and will most likely not make it out of the other side I am afraid to say.
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 639
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We all know that Greybull are not long term investors, and therefore the airline is effectively up for sale.
This latest round of emergency funding has been beyond belief, and I can't see many customers wanting to lend Monarch money until they fly. Even with ATOL.
This latest round of emergency funding has been beyond belief, and I can't see many customers wanting to lend Monarch money until they fly. Even with ATOL.
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: UK
Age: 43
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This is really good news for all my friends and colleagues at MON.
For the record the previous Swiss Italian owners were far from a sugar daddy. They never ran the company properly because that was never their plan and in the end shafted the employees. To suggest they were anything other than this is disingenuous and shows ignorance of what really happened.
I also believe Jet2 couldn't afford Monarch. They have an inferior product to MON by all accounts.
However, the question remains how long can Monarch remain independent. I think ultimately a sale or merger is likely!
For the record the previous Swiss Italian owners were far from a sugar daddy. They never ran the company properly because that was never their plan and in the end shafted the employees. To suggest they were anything other than this is disingenuous and shows ignorance of what really happened.
I also believe Jet2 couldn't afford Monarch. They have an inferior product to MON by all accounts.
However, the question remains how long can Monarch remain independent. I think ultimately a sale or merger is likely!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 635
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
`They have an inferior product to MON by all accounts`....You sure about that, as you don`t seem to have tried the Jet2 product. I`ve tried both, but much prefer Jet2. But not just me it seems, in July they were voted into the top 10 of world airlines by Trip Advisor, based on the views of people who had travelled with them..
So yes they could afford Monarch but from a business perspective, why would they??....They have no need of them
So yes they could afford Monarch but from a business perspective, why would they??....They have no need of them
We all know that Greybull are not long term investors, and therefore the airline is effectively up for sale.
This latest round of emergency funding has been beyond belief, and I can't see many customers wanting to lend Monarch money until they fly. Even with ATOL.
This latest round of emergency funding has been beyond belief, and I can't see many customers wanting to lend Monarch money until they fly. Even with ATOL.
You're right however that Greybull are venture capitalists. Their modus operandii is to buy poorly businesses, return them to health, and then sell them on at a profit ( i.e. recovering their investment plus a bit). Sometimes, such as in the case of "M" shops, they made a misjudgment, but they wouldn't still be in business if they didn't, more often than not, make the right decisions.
However, the question remains how long can Monarch remain independent. I think ultimately a sale or merger is likely!
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: UK
Age: 43
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Paully
I have flown on both when positioning for duty and have friends and colleagues who have worked and still work for both airlines.
Of course you prefer Jet2, just remind me where you are from??
I have flown on both when positioning for duty and have friends and colleagues who have worked and still work for both airlines.
Of course you prefer Jet2, just remind me where you are from??
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: -
Posts: 747
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So a few months ago Greybull were trying to offload the airline to a seller (which seems no one wanted) and now they are investing £165 million into the business...(!?)
This in my opinion, is a load a spin, some imaginative accounting and were not being told half the story!
As a BBC analyst suggested this morning on the radio, this £165 million, might not even be an investment and could just purely be a cash injection (another). If the case, this could also add to the airlines debt and which has to be repaid and will mean the airline will struggle further to make a profit.
If Boeing have relaxed the repayment terms on the new aircraft, this also releases a large amount of money to show in their bank account, what in theory is already allocated to the purchase of the 737's.
I'm still not convinced the airline is out the woods, and the proof in the pudding will be if/when the 737's actually start to arrive, and the airline can pay for them.
Bring on the people calling me a troll, and a Monarch hater!
This in my opinion, is a load a spin, some imaginative accounting and were not being told half the story!
As a BBC analyst suggested this morning on the radio, this £165 million, might not even be an investment and could just purely be a cash injection (another). If the case, this could also add to the airlines debt and which has to be repaid and will mean the airline will struggle further to make a profit.
If Boeing have relaxed the repayment terms on the new aircraft, this also releases a large amount of money to show in their bank account, what in theory is already allocated to the purchase of the 737's.
I'm still not convinced the airline is out the woods, and the proof in the pudding will be if/when the 737's actually start to arrive, and the airline can pay for them.
Bring on the people calling me a troll, and a Monarch hater!
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 639
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Giles, I hear what you're saying although the CAA must be sufficiently satisfied.
Greybull putting £160 million is possibly just a headline, i.e. has that money moved today?
It being a private company, we won't find out until later, but I wouldn't lend them money until it came to flying time.
Greybull putting £160 million is possibly just a headline, i.e. has that money moved today?
It being a private company, we won't find out until later, but I wouldn't lend them money until it came to flying time.
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Sunrise Senior Living
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This has to be good news for MON and all who work for 'her'. I wish them well of course.
However, £165M is not a huge sum given the rise in fuel price (hedging - dunno) and, possibly of more relevance given that most of the revenue is surely paid in £, the fall in the £ v the USD (fuel, lease costs, spares etc) and the € (charges in Europe). Winter losses are coming to us all and I also fear for forward bookings.
My fingers are firmly crossed for this 'proper' airline.
However, £165M is not a huge sum given the rise in fuel price (hedging - dunno) and, possibly of more relevance given that most of the revenue is surely paid in £, the fall in the £ v the USD (fuel, lease costs, spares etc) and the € (charges in Europe). Winter losses are coming to us all and I also fear for forward bookings.
My fingers are firmly crossed for this 'proper' airline.
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Down Sarf
Age: 48
Posts: 140
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I suspect ATNotts there was more than one on here relishing the thought of the airline going under and the consequent hardship for many people .
Great to see their hopes confounded , Good luck to monarch.
Great to see their hopes confounded , Good luck to monarch.
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: UK
Age: 43
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am certain this £165 million in addition to the deal with Boeing will create more than enough "cash reserves" to ride out the winter and next season and beyond until a sale is agreed (if it hasn't been agreed already!).
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Their modus operandii is to buy poorly businesses, return them to health, and then sell them on at a profit (
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Soon to be out of the EU.
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How is Monarch a superior product to anything else that's offered in the UK leisure market?
In fact come 11/01/17 you'll not know the fitter ends between BA/Ryanair/Jet2/easyJet/Monarch. The only difference being the paint jobs and the uniform.
I don't think any airline is at all remarkable in the UK leisure market.
In fact come 11/01/17 you'll not know the fitter ends between BA/Ryanair/Jet2/easyJet/Monarch. The only difference being the paint jobs and the uniform.
I don't think any airline is at all remarkable in the UK leisure market.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Skipness
Don't conflate your opinion with fact! Everyone can have an opinion but an informed opinion based on knowledge is what really counts!
Don't conflate your opinion with fact! Everyone can have an opinion but an informed opinion based on knowledge is what really counts!
What reason is there to buy MON balanced against watching it fail and picking up the pieces? The latter is a heart breaker but that's BMI Baby all over again. The brand is aligned with the others having gone "downmarket", there is no USP and the loyalty base isn't that loyal nowadays,
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 639
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was expecting today's announcement to include the Chinese or even Boeing standing behind/alongside Monarch.
Airlines are like a bank, as the customer is lending (depositing) money to the airline in return for a flight in the future.
We know what happens to banks when confidence has gone.
Airlines are like a bank, as the customer is lending (depositing) money to the airline in return for a flight in the future.
We know what happens to banks when confidence has gone.
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London
Posts: 7,072
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Great news ,HH and one or two others must be devastated ......"
Not so - read my posts for heavens sake.
My take is that this gives them a bit longer than the 6 months other's are guessing at - their previous burn rate on cash would suggest they should be OK for at least a year - maybe longer especially if they make some changes - especially on the lease/purchase front
And a year in the current BREXIT world is a lifetime TBH
Not so - read my posts for heavens sake.
My take is that this gives them a bit longer than the 6 months other's are guessing at - their previous burn rate on cash would suggest they should be OK for at least a year - maybe longer especially if they make some changes - especially on the lease/purchase front
And a year in the current BREXIT world is a lifetime TBH