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Monarch - 3

Old 2nd Oct 2016, 22:30
  #3721 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: BHX
Posts: 305
More fool them then ...However I find that very hard to believe.
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Old 2nd Oct 2016, 22:32
  #3722 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: London, UK
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Well next time it might be an idea to get the negotiating team to put penalty clauses in the contract if your jets are gonna be two years late.
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Old 2nd Oct 2016, 22:57
  #3723 (permalink)  
 
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Given that some seem to consider monarch a basket case , Whats the view on the fact (if its true ) that a hugely successful group such as HNA are willing to invest in them ?

Whats in it for them ? Im no expert on the aviation business so forgive me if im missing the obvious.
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 06:23
  #3724 (permalink)  
 
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I don't think it's fundamentally a basket case - it's a 40m ebitda business, with wrong capital structure and woefully managed as the last few weeks have shown.
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 12:03
  #3725 (permalink)  
 
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Seems small fry for a huge outfit like HNA to get involved in really could they use monarch as part of some grander plan?
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 12:55
  #3726 (permalink)  
 
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they're still waiting for the money to turn up ..........
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 14:52
  #3727 (permalink)  
 
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FANS has got it right....
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 15:00
  #3728 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: solihull West Midlands
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Bringantee

The investor is supposedly the Chinese said the previous Monarch CEO on TV the other day so probably is the HNA group.

Like you I am at a loss to think why HNA would want to invest in an airline abroad with just 30 short haul planes which has had 3 bail outs in less than 3 years.

If the announcement is that they are buying the planes and carrying on the Monarch model, then how does this turn out well.

They are just throwing money at exactly the same business model that has required 3 bailouts in less than 3 years.

We also have toalso factor in Jet 2. From next spring they bring 4 based planes to BHX and 6 to Stansted. That will eat further into the Monarch flights to many Med destinations in these areas for the first time.

So even more challenging.

I am hoping we can move out of this Stepford Wives weirdness and see some realism from the airline and investors.

Surely there will have to be a big change..a merger/ buy out otherwise what has changed its the same business model, and in 12 months time they will probably have the begging bowl out for yet another bail out.

Is this scenario not similar to Ehihad investing heavily in Air Berlin.That has failed so badly LH have had to step in and drastic cuts are planned for Air Berlin.

If anyone on here can explain how the likely current plan to buy more planes and carry on with the same business model if that is the plan,is going to work.

With the added issues of rising fuel and Jet 2 stepping into there markets far more in Birmingham and SE is going to transform Monarch fortunes please explain ?
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 15:33
  #3729 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: UK
Age: 40
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If it is the HNA Group, expect changes to the Monarch business model. I'm not sure why some here keep banging on about what the investors see in Monarch. They obviously see some potential and perhaps expansion opportunity that most here have no clue about. Sadly it doesn't stop some folk mouthing off like they know stuff when in reality they don't!

I have good connections at Monarch but don't work there. The previous Swiss Italian owners were very shrewd business people. They were not billionaires for nothing and played the system to their advantage. I don't think they really cared about Monarch, it served a purpose which run its course by 2014. Greybull were never long term investors and will almost certainly make a profit on their "125 million" cash injection. There have been problems with certain Monarch management decisions but that applies to many companies in the UK. Not excusing it but it happens. I really do think there'll be changes to the modus operandi of the company. Time will reveal all.
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 16:11
  #3730 (permalink)  
 
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I think monarchs a great airline and i wish them the very best , However my question was really what plans HNA may have for them , Maybe as they already own most of SR technics and other maintenance outfits the engineering side must be attractive as its very highly regarded and profitable i believe, so you can see oppotunities there to expand the business, but what about the flying side of things ?
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 16:29
  #3731 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Uk
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One thing invaluable to MON will be the goodwill value of the brand. Ok its had some negative press the last few weeks but its recognised all over England and has a presence north to south. With the right management and strategy it will flourish. Its just a shame greybull haven't got a clue. MON has a huge amount of loyal customers that will stick with them as long as they exist, hence why the goodwill value of the brand will be so high
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 16:46
  #3732 (permalink)  
 
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Very true they do have very loyal customer base who are no doubt very concerned they to start flying with the riff raff on jet 2 !
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 17:23
  #3733 (permalink)  
 
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Brighter are you talking about J2 from personal experience
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 17:45
  #3734 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
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Sadly yes flown with them twice and both times had the misfotune to be seated in close proximity to large drunken groups of pikeys ...Im sure monarch also has problems with louts but ive never personally encountered that sort of behavour with them
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 18:03
  #3735 (permalink)  
 
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brigante
you do seem to have a downer on jet2 and its passenger, but there was i thinking jet2s
policy re rowdy and drunken pax was very good
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 18:54
  #3736 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: BHX
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Sorry, There is nothing wrong with jet 2 or its staff, They dont want these scumbags flying with them anymore than anyone else does

Back to monarch...
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 19:47
  #3737 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: UK
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Very true they do have very loyal customer base who are no doubt very concerned they to start flying with the riff raff on jet 2
You started it, Brigantee.

I suggest you start doing some research on the competition - Monarch management could learn some lessons from Jet2.

In respect of problem passengers I can assure you that all UK airlines suffer from certain individuals - awareness is high of Jet2 on this subject because they are actually trying to do something about it.

As for KyleRBs comment about the Mantegazzo's being 'very shrewd business people' - all I can say is

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 20:02
  #3738 (permalink)  
 
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Cuillin Hills

Not sure what your point is re Monarch's previous owners. I've never been a pax with Jet2 but I've heard their management team is very good.

Brigantee

I would expect Monarch to expand and diversify their flying schedule.
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 20:18
  #3739 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
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Cuillin Hills

Not sure what your point is re Monarch's previous owners.
Sorry, Kyle RB. - I'll make things a bit clearer.

As owners they were diabolical - particularly in respect of the quality of various managing directors they bestowed on the company. This was either deliberate or incompetence.

They walked away from their responsibilities in respect of their pension obligations. Many loyal employees totally stuffed and out of pocket big time.

I don't think you will find many employees of Monarch, past or present, who will disagree with me.

A bit clearer now?

Last edited by Cuillin Hills; 4th Oct 2016 at 08:14.
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Old 3rd Oct 2016, 20:26
  #3740 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
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Cuillin Hills

We are on the same page! I totally agree with you and my suspicion is it was deliberate as opposed to incompetent. Losses and taxes come to mind and one or two other things! The family ran it for their own needs and never cared about Monarch or it's employees.
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