Airlines, Airports & Routes Topics about airports, routes and airline business.

BOURNEMOUTH - 3

Old 12th Nov 2015, 15:25
  #981 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: somerset
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
"What BOH needs now is some robust and significant additional Ryanair services "

That would be nice but if you can look at the financial bottom line in the companies reports you will see that what bournemouth needs now is a miracle or it won't be there as a business much past next spring.
Forget carrying on with a few thomson / Ryanair flights etc - it's not financially viable .
Staff have already been made redundant to try and plug the hole left by the post office pulling out- I'd be surprised if there is any more leeway.
Fingers crossed for some good news and quickly!

Drop off charge- no one likes it but it's a major income stream- no business would introduce it unless they absolutely had to.
Someone on the echo website said they resented paying £2.50 drop off when their ticket to fly was only £80.
That says it all- you are paying to drop off BECAUSE your flights are so cheap- how else do you think the airport can make some money?
possibleconsequences is offline  
Old 12th Nov 2015, 16:05
  #982 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: jersey
Age: 74
Posts: 1,475
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
What you say about the drop off charge may be correct, but I don't like it & sympathise with those others who don't like it, either. It may very well be a consequence of getting a low fare; if it is, that is highly regrettable.
I don't agree with you on BOH being likely to disappear as a business, though. It was there , without pax services, for many years; why should the loss of some of its business now threaten its very survival ? It's not good, but may not be fatal. There are a lot of other, non-airline businesses based there.
kcockayne is offline  
Old 12th Nov 2015, 16:14
  #983 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: somerset
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I certainly agree nobody likes the drop off - I don't but have paid it a few times.
The airport did run with minimal services and survived whilst doing so. The difference now is that MAG take the profits from the industrial estate directly into their coffers, thus preventing that contributing to bournemouth's profits and they also expect pay back of the money invested in the terminal etcetera
So- do they cut their losses or continue to subsidise the aviation side?
My understanding is ( and admittedly it's at least second hand) that the airport has been told to sink or swim on it's own and it now has a very large financial black hole to fill.
possibleconsequences is offline  
Old 12th Nov 2015, 21:58
  #984 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: jersey
Age: 74
Posts: 1,475
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
O.K. Thanks for that information. We will have to wait & see what happens. If only Bournemouth had the surface transport links that Southampton has. Because, airfield facility wise (runway, space to expand, ILS Radar etc., it is well placed.
kcockayne is offline  
Old 12th Nov 2015, 22:14
  #985 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: cornwall, uk
Posts: 1,573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
its very well placed facility wise, and NQY (sorry to mention it) is proof that an airport can be turned around.


I admit its nowhere near what it could or should be or what its been in the not too distant past, but compared to a few years ago when air southwest closed up shop and left us with BE 3 daily to LGW I think its turning around!


The difference here is that NQY is partly subsidised by the council, so each and every resident contribute no matter what! on top of that until March 16 every departing passenger chucks an extra fiver into the pot to fly out of NQY.


Its annoying, but its worked!


ADF scrapped, 1 hour free parking and no drop off fee now ( was charged with no grace at all)


The other main difference is that NQY is a local enterprise zone and offers benefits for businesses to move into the airport property, based on this they have just built a huge business park which was finished days ago.


Flights will never keep the airfield going, its the other activities that will, aircraft storage, mx, dismantling etc, helimed, SAR etc etc etc


The mx company based at NQY are storing 1 and breaking up 3 EK airbus aircraft, plus have just had a 772 in for MX, all this sort of activity adds to the bottom line and employment at the airport and as such to the local area.


I don't agree with councils owning airports,however, if it was a commercial company it would of been closed down the day the RAF transferred the airfield because its a local airport with a huge runway which is never going to make money in a month of sundays!


however as its council owned the bigger picture is that its generating local spending and local employment with well paid and skilled jobs, its worth sucking up a loss to sustain it!


that's BOHs issue, its owned by a larger group that want the airfield alone to make a profit which I cant see in all honesty!




cs
cornishsimon is offline  
Old 13th Nov 2015, 04:55
  #986 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: In the sticks
Posts: 9,802
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The very stupid scheme of coning the approach road off into the even more stupid £2.50 drop off fee has cost BOH a very significant amount of traffic!
Can't agree with that statement. Both Luton and Stansted charge £2.50 drop off charges which probably upsets passengers more than anything else if comments to the airports facebook page are to be believed but there has been massive growth at both airports. Luton has grown by a fifth in just the last 12 months. While passengers might moan and promise never to return they do return.

For me the biggest issue is lack of public transport. Anyone who is not local faces next to no onward travel options apart from a shoppers bus that runs hourly for just part of the day. The airport might as well be on the moon when it comes to connectivity.
LTNman is online now  
Old 16th Nov 2015, 16:32
  #987 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Brighton uk
Posts: 1,090
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
After all the gloom and depressing news about Flybe last week Thomson have added a few extra flight for next summer and winter, small i know and nothing that exciting but at least they continue to remain stable at Bournemouth

Next summer an additional Las Palmas flight will operate on a Thursday requiring an extra aircraft to position in for the flight

Next winter 16 / 17 will see an extra Lanzarote flight operate on a Thursday in addition to the Sunday flight , previously there were no flights on a Thu
Sat is the only non flying day next winter again and the aircraft positions out to LGW for ski flights

Hays travel are reporting really good sales on the BA charters next year and possibly looking to operate more flight at the end of the summer
MARKEYD is online now  
Old 16th Nov 2015, 18:15
  #988 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Christchurch
Age: 79
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
easyjet

I thought the extra profits racked up by Easyjet might possibly encourage them
to taste the water at BOH next year.The fares they charge are far more
competitive than Flybe so surely there must be some destinations avaliable so as not to tread on Ryanairs toes, so come on BOH marketing get your act together
and go and seek some work. You have to look for work as it wont come to you
without trying.
bob1810 is offline  
Old 16th Nov 2015, 18:31
  #989 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: uk
Posts: 158
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I assume that the business model for many airports was attract the airlines with reduced fees and earn revenue from what the passengers spend in the various shops cafes etc. However I do not think the amount spent by each passenger has met expectations. I myself as a frequent traveller treat the terminal as I would a bus station. I just pass through and do not use any of the facilities so do not contribute to the airport income.

Options for the airport, try and get more money from airlines. ( Ha Ha ) or find others means. Net result drop off fees. Either way I as a passenger would pick up the cost.

Difference between BOH and the likes of LTN, STN etc is they have viable public transport options so there is a choice. Also it would be nice if the first sign you saw approaching BOH would be Welcome to Bournemouth Airport, not PAY £2.50 or else.
turbroprop is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2015, 08:23
  #990 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: London, UK
Posts: 1,990
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
I thought the extra profits racked up by Easyjet might possibly encourage them
to taste the water at BOH next year.
I believe Easy have been "tasting the water" for years with flights to Geneva!
Groundloop is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2015, 11:57
  #991 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: South
Age: 43
Posts: 752
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hurn

So is this the final nail in the coffin? Surely this airport will be operated at a loss after Royal Mail and BE pull out? Big need for new housing as well.
Rivet Joint is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 07:56
  #992 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
As far as Pax are concerned I think - YES - BOH have completely missed the boat with a total lack of new airlines jumping on-board and staying with it for more than 5 minutes! I don't think the airport will ever crack a million passengers again let alone the three million that they had hoped to attract having spent around 45 million pounds on improvements over the past few years. With pax number expected to be around 700,000 this year, the loss of Flybe after just "dipping" their toes in for such a short space of time, will no doubt focus minds of airport bosses. Would anyone dare to predict what might happen next? with quotes like this at the end of July:-

Passenger numbers to rise 50% at Bournemouth airport, say Manchester Airports Group as annual results released!

PASSENGER numbers at Bournemouth Airport could significantly rise this winter thanks to a number of new flights.

Paul Knight, managing director, Bournemouth Airport, said: “These additional routes are great news for the airport and I am delighted that we are able to offer our passengers a growing choice of flight and holiday options this winter.”

Airport bosses are predicting the number of passengers will increase by 50 per cent, as more than 55 flights a week to 14 destinations are scheduled.
Reaffirming their commitment to Bournemouth, the MAG report said: "Bournemouth Airport continues to be an important contributor to the group and following the news earlier this year that Flybe is relocating its southern base to the airport and adding 10 new routes, passenger numbers will significantly increase in 2015-16."


With this news released just four months ago, you really do have to wonder what planet BOH management and MAG are on!? However it's all about the huge industrial Estate on the North side isn't it!? Now that's another story! Huge lorries in and out all day long etc - but still no link to the A338 Spur Road. Don't worry though Hurn Village and Parley Cross can cope!!! RIGHT???

Does anybody care to guess which Airline might attempt to run new routes out of BOH next and how about a sweep-stake as to the next time the airport might hit one million PAX!

Did MAG really not see this Flybe bombshell coming??? Perhaps they should open their eyes next time? It all smacks of desperation after all the money that's been spent!

Finally - going all the way back to 2007 when the huge expansion was announced - this is what was said:-

In 2007, the airport's owners, Manchester Airports Group, announced a £32 million investment (Increased to £45 million) in the redevelopment of the airport which mainly focused on creating new car parking spaces in two separate car parks and building a new International Arrivals terminal. Part of these plans included screening off the current arrivals terminal with a three-metre screen, with plans to ultimately phase out use of the building. On 21 June 2007, planning permission was granted to the scheme by Christchurch Council Planning Committee, despite public objections and protests. This was conditional, however, on a maximum of three million air passengers per annum, and required contributions to road systems, bus routes, and to use quieter aircraft

Last edited by mrshubigbus; 18th Nov 2015 at 08:33.
mrshubigbus is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 08:08
  #993 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: South
Age: 43
Posts: 752
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Mrshubigbus

Have to agree with you, it smacked of false hope from day one. They should just close the damn thing and be done with it.
Rivet Joint is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 08:39
  #994 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Why would you want to close it? With over two hundred based aircraft contributing to the MAG "coffers" along with the rapidly expanding industrial estate?
Many GA aircraft, major pilot training schools, several aircraft maintenance facitilities, three paint shops, numerous executive jet operators as well as Cobham etc sounds like a viable business case to me. The point is about BOH as a viable base for passenger operations not all the other airport operations. From that point of view it is one of the busiest airports in the country, and especially so for commercial training. Not to mention a very rich Qatari who keeps his two 747s at the airport - from a place where money grows on palm trees and oil wells!
mrshubigbus is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 12:26
  #995 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: South
Age: 43
Posts: 752
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I think all of what you highlight are peanuts. They are likely to only operate at BOH because they charge a lot less than other airports. For example, there use to be a flight school at SOU but they were turfed out and ended up at BOH. Collectively they may add up to some form of reasonable revenue stream but surely MAG will not continue making up the shortfall. If FR can't make somewhere like BOH than no one can. They couldn't have a lower cost base, no meaningful competition to speak of yet in all these years they do not at least experiment with a meaningful base? What people need to realise is the word "yield" is key. I can't see BOH every generating it not can I see what it's USP is? SOU has "cruise capital of Northern Europe" to fall back on amongst other things. Surely MAG could extend the industrial estate and provide much needed housing. Just a thought. This strive to market BOH as a successful airport has the feel of flogging a dead horse about it. Just my opinion, for what it's worth.
Rivet Joint is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 12:28
  #996 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: New Forest
Posts: 138
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
They should just close the damn thing and be done with it.

I'd prefer it if they didn't, I'm booked to fly out of there next summer!
I notice Thomson operated a 787 flight to and from BGI last week, which I think is a first as they only fly 737s normally. Are they looking to expand operations and use Bournemouth for some long haul routes? It would make sense, no one living in the south west wants to travel all the way to Gatwick
AeroSpark is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 14:12
  #997 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Sydney
Posts: 718
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The reason that FR is not expanding at the rate they pledged previously is because of the greedy people at MAG who started to demand FR pay a matter of 'pounds' instead of 'pence' on the airport deal. FR will make a significant go of BOH if MAG can revert to 'pence' and be creative enough in generating income from other streams based upon FR's potential volumes. The beauty of BOH is that the operation is pretty much subsidised by the other businesses on the airport. So pax operations are pure cream - hence why the airport doesn't disappear even when airlines come and go. However this is also BOH's downfall as MAG will want more 'cream' and they think this is from aviation income and not volume based income. I agree with others - the only airlines that can make BOH work (high outbound pax demand, little inbound) would be brands like FR or U2 or limited holiday flights.

Agree also with Rivet Joint that yield to the airline is critical. This is why domestic or European business routes will never work. FR used to operate double daily services to EDI and double daily services to GLA but quickly dropped them when they realised people were only willing to pay 10 quid.

The choice of routes then become the determining factor in making BOH a '1 million' passenger airport. In my opinion those routes are the likes of Barcelona, Bergerac, Funchal, Tel Aviv, Athens, Rome, Venice, Jerez, Seville, Gibralter, Lisbon, Oporto, Bilbao, Nice, Toulon, Biarritz and ski flights. These are still yet to be exploited and FR and U2 i'm sure will only do it when the deal is presented to them. But my fear is that as long as MAG are in control, this won't be allowed. Idiots.
shamrock7seal is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 15:06
  #998 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: 50+ north
Posts: 1,244
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
AeroSpark

Nothing to get excited about, just a P & O Cruises charter flight which BOH gets from time to time.
TCAS FAN is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 15:46
  #999 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: In the sticks
Posts: 9,802
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The reason that FR is not expanding at the rate they pledged previously is because of the greedy people at MAG who started to demand FR pay a matter of 'pounds' instead of 'pence' on the airport deal.
Doesn't strike me as being greedy. People here want penny airline fees and free passenger drop offs and for the airport to live off the profits from a cup of tea or magazine that might be bought by the odd passenger.

The reality is that Bournemouth would probably have a more profitable future by closing the terminal and becoming a general aviation airport with the lower costs that would bring. The MAG group did make an investment in a new terminal but as can be seen the money spent hasn't brought the passengers MAG had hoped for.

Public transport sucks from BOH so is it for the airport to also run bus and coach services to and from the airport?
LTNman is online now  
Old 18th Nov 2015, 16:30
  #1000 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
greedy people at MAG who started to demand FR pay a matter of 'pounds' instead of 'pence'
FR and U2 i'm sure will only do it when the deal is presented to them. But my fear is that as long as MAG are in control, this won't be allowed. Idiots.
So who would you like to see running BOH? The Mother Theresa Foundation? Because only a charity could afford to run an operation in the manner you suggest. Actually, on second thoughts, they couldn't. Or maybe you should consider the company which manages the most successful no-frills airport in Europe at STN ... oh, hold on a minute ... that's ...

Take a close look at what happened to Blackpool Airport. Some years ago, the then airport operator agreed a long-term deal of the sort you propose with Jet2. The airport had to bear the cost of providing heating, lighting, fire service and ATC, airfield maintenance, security facilities and all the rest. In return, the idea was to earn revenue from passenger spend in and around the terminal. The type of Nirvana you envisage never arrived. What did arrive was acute financial difficulties and the resulting total closure of that terminal. Blackpool is now a GA airport with a small gas-rig support helicopter operation and an occasional LET410 to the IOM.

You need to be careful what you wish for. Presenting bills calculated in pence for the processing of 189-seater B737-800's simply isn't practical. Those who negotiate a commercial rate of return for their business are not "idiots".
Shed-on-a-Pole is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.