Jet2 4
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Slightly off topic was curios if anyone knows how much longer jet 2 might keep G-CELH it appears to be almost 29 years old but has only recently been fitted with winglets.
Can't imagine it's very cheap to maintain.
Thanks
Can't imagine it's very cheap to maintain.
Thanks
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The oldest in the fleet is G-CELP followed by G-CELR and G-CELX. Of the same age as G-CELH, there are also the following: G-CELI, G-CELJ, G-CELS, G-CELW and G-CELZ. Very close behind by a month or so are: G-CELA, G-CELB, G-CELK, G-CELV and G-CELY. This makes a total of 14 aircraft of similar ages.
Earlier posts mention the possibility that the company may be in the process of ordering a number of new aircraft, which perhaps might replace some of the older in the fleet but it will not be immediate. It is rumoured that the announcement of any purchase plans will be made by the company at the Paris Air Show in the month of June.
These older aircraft are probably not that cheap to maintain but on the other hand they were bought outright by JET2 years ago and probably at a good price.
Earlier posts mention the possibility that the company may be in the process of ordering a number of new aircraft, which perhaps might replace some of the older in the fleet but it will not be immediate. It is rumoured that the announcement of any purchase plans will be made by the company at the Paris Air Show in the month of June.
These older aircraft are probably not that cheap to maintain but on the other hand they were bought outright by JET2 years ago and probably at a good price.
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Older 733s
I doubt many of these early 733s will be going too soon. If they are spending money fitting winglets on them, and oil prices don't climb too quickly then they are cheap to operate. No lease costs make a difference. You can't be parking leased jets up in winter like Jet2 do if you have lease costs to pay on top of the parking fees.
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Union Court Case
It's interesting that the company should spend so much time (and no doubt money)on court wrangles, rather than simply sitting down and talking to the Union about the pilots rostering concerns. Balpa is not perfect, but as Unions go it is fairly moderate.
From friends at J2 I hear of many pilots leaving, many due to roster disruption. Staff turnover is expensive, and fuels more disruption for those who are left, then large numbers being hired to replace them, many which need full type ratings which places further strain on training costs and more rostering headaches. Ignoring the original problem and paying expensive legal bills is therefore more expensive in the long run?
From friends at J2 I hear of many pilots leaving, many due to roster disruption. Staff turnover is expensive, and fuels more disruption for those who are left, then large numbers being hired to replace them, many which need full type ratings which places further strain on training costs and more rostering headaches. Ignoring the original problem and paying expensive legal bills is therefore more expensive in the long run?
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G-JZHD (B737-800, ex. EI-RUP) is down in Bournemouth receiving its new Paint work, and is due to be painted into the full Jet2holidays livery - That makes two of each livery in the G-JZH_ fleet. I understand winglets are likely to be fitted, the work to be carried out by LS mechanics in LBA. 
G-JZHD Entering Airbourne Colours' hangar in BOH:
(Image Courtesy of Airbourne Colours on Facebook)
G-JZHD Entering Airbourne Colours' hangar in BOH:
(Image Courtesy of Airbourne Colours on Facebook)
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Spot on Taxi_Driver! If only the clowns running this company would actually show that level of 'experienced' type thinking!
The removal of TWE is great! Still such a long way to go...
The removal of TWE is great! Still such a long way to go...
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Thanks for the fleet insight. It will be interesting to see just how long they will keep those older aircraft around. It's nice to see them still flying.
Do they use the aircraft with the forward large cargo door for freight operations very often ?
Thanks
Do they use the aircraft with the forward large cargo door for freight operations very often ?
Thanks
Join Date: Feb 2002
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What is it with you Sean Dillon? determined to bite the hand that feeds you? I have many friends who work at Jet2 and all are pretty happy with their lot! Your career with Loganair , Thomsonfly, contracting for EZ then getting a perm job at Jet2 an awful lot of people would kill for! If your that unhappy with your lot then leave if its not for you, there are many who would jump at the chance to take your place tomorrow. 
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Well "Buzz Boy"...if people "need" the permanent opportunity at Jet2, they are very desperate! I appreciate why people leaving Eastern Airways may consider this a 'step up'...but time within this company will reveal all! It simply isn't...but only experience will reveal that!
Something Jet2 doesn't have...not in the right places anyway!
Tick...tock...tick...tock...
Something Jet2 doesn't have...not in the right places anyway!
Tick...tock...tick...tock...
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So what you are saying is that you are / were desperate? From what I hear some 30 ish pilots have left, out of 600 ish that's around 5%, not huge and the majority are younger lads who are going to BA. I have several friends who are from my former airline working at Jet2, they paint a very very different picture to you. In fact I would warn those going to BA as i think they may get a shock! I have seen quite a few changes here over the past few years and its not pleasant, particularly if you are short haul, but that's another story.
Personally if i hated my employer as much as you do I would simply look elsewhere and get out. From what I hear from my friends there and former Jet2 guys who work here now its not such a bad place to be.
Personally if i hated my employer as much as you do I would simply look elsewhere and get out. From what I hear from my friends there and former Jet2 guys who work here now its not such a bad place to be.
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All depends on where that "experience" is from as to how you rate where PM's Flying Circus is in the whole big scheme of things!
Double the number you think have left and that's more accurate, all leaving for UK jobs! That makes it more significant and it's not over yet! Some only lasted a few months and said the bond could be double the amount, they still would have paid to leave!
This is just a stepping stone airline...far from any career...good luck to those that think otherwise!
Double the number you think have left and that's more accurate, all leaving for UK jobs! That makes it more significant and it's not over yet! Some only lasted a few months and said the bond could be double the amount, they still would have paid to leave!
This is just a stepping stone airline...far from any career...good luck to those that think otherwise!
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Oh Sean Sean Sean, your rants are becoming more and more tiresome, the same old same old over and over again.
Let's put this into some perspective, I do not believe you are correct with the doubling of the 30 pilots leaving I believe that the number is between 30-40, and there might well be a few more still to show their hand. You are correct, the majority going to jobs in the UK, that is BA, so....no real surprise, and no different, I'm sure (in fact I know), to other UK airlines. There will always be attrition when you have 600ish pilots, so those going elsewhere are no real surprise either, after all Jet2 won't suit everybody, I'm sure there are pilots at Jet2 who needed a job when they joined rather than wanted to join Jet2, and now have their opportunity to get a job where they want to be.
On the other touchy subject of the age of the aeroplanes, it has been said over and over, they might well be old, but they are constantly maintained to a high standard. Those that say they fly around with many faults are quite quite wrong, there are occasional items that are deferred, but they are few and far between, it's actually really rather infrequent to fly with deferred defects
Let's put this into some perspective, I do not believe you are correct with the doubling of the 30 pilots leaving I believe that the number is between 30-40, and there might well be a few more still to show their hand. You are correct, the majority going to jobs in the UK, that is BA, so....no real surprise, and no different, I'm sure (in fact I know), to other UK airlines. There will always be attrition when you have 600ish pilots, so those going elsewhere are no real surprise either, after all Jet2 won't suit everybody, I'm sure there are pilots at Jet2 who needed a job when they joined rather than wanted to join Jet2, and now have their opportunity to get a job where they want to be.
On the other touchy subject of the age of the aeroplanes, it has been said over and over, they might well be old, but they are constantly maintained to a high standard. Those that say they fly around with many faults are quite quite wrong, there are occasional items that are deferred, but they are few and far between, it's actually really rather infrequent to fly with deferred defects
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Why does everyone insist on regurgitating this line that management have been pushing out recently; "only a handful of young FOs have left in the last year and all went to BA long haul". Its so patently untrue. We all know exactly who have left because we've been to the leaving dos! Not just "a handful of young FOs", but captains, line trainers, TREs, some of the most long serving and qualified pilots in the company. We know their reasons for leaving and I'm not going to repeat them here.
Whilst I explicitly express no personal opinion of my own on the subject, literally every single FO I know is actively trying to leave and most captains are either accepting of the fact that they are unlikely get a command at their local airport if they leave Jet2, or are considering their options. Hand on heart, I can't remember the last happy pilot I met in the crew room (management pilots aside).
I have been with the company since the early days and have never seen moral quite so crushingly low as it appears to be at the moment. Sean Dillon's views may seem like those of a disgruntled rogue, but I experience people with his views an awful lot once the flight deck door closes.
Whilst I explicitly express no personal opinion of my own on the subject, literally every single FO I know is actively trying to leave and most captains are either accepting of the fact that they are unlikely get a command at their local airport if they leave Jet2, or are considering their options. Hand on heart, I can't remember the last happy pilot I met in the crew room (management pilots aside).
I have been with the company since the early days and have never seen moral quite so crushingly low as it appears to be at the moment. Sean Dillon's views may seem like those of a disgruntled rogue, but I experience people with his views an awful lot once the flight deck door closes.
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Jet2 4
Therein lies the rub Artie. People have been hacked off for a very long time. The difference now is that everyone else is recruiting. People are leaving Jet2 to go work at Ryanair! If that isn't setting off alarm bells nothing will. It seems that management are still taking the ostrich approach.
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I evidently live in a different crew room to you guys then because I can't say that I have noticed a significant moral issue to be honest. I think you will find that whichever airline's crew room you stood round in you would find moans and groans. Don't get me wrong, it isn't perfect, as I've already said, but there is a lot worse and it wouldn't take much to make improvements.
Re the leavers, I agree that they are from a spectrum of the workforce not just young guys going to BA. The majority are off to BA, on a variety of fleets not just long haul. Some (very few) have decided to go back to Ryanair after Ryanair offered them what they wanted (base and permanent contract), but they certainly aren't in any sort of numbers that could be misconstrued as worrying imo.
I am making no assumptions as to who anyone on here is, those that know me know who I am on here. I don't hide, and if I have a grumble I don't air it in public, I have stuck my neck out when necessary in the past and wouldn't hesitate to speak to the relevant management if I had any again. Surely it's much better than coming on here and airing your dirty laundry when you probably haven't tried to actually speak to the relevant people with your issue and a possible way that it could be improved, not that we can all have what we want of course, after all this is a business.
As I have said before, no airline fits all its employees, but to state that a 5-10% attrition when the biggest player in the country is recruiting is hardly a surprise. Of the 5-10% probably only about 1% are off to anywhere other than BA.
Re the leavers, I agree that they are from a spectrum of the workforce not just young guys going to BA. The majority are off to BA, on a variety of fleets not just long haul. Some (very few) have decided to go back to Ryanair after Ryanair offered them what they wanted (base and permanent contract), but they certainly aren't in any sort of numbers that could be misconstrued as worrying imo.
I am making no assumptions as to who anyone on here is, those that know me know who I am on here. I don't hide, and if I have a grumble I don't air it in public, I have stuck my neck out when necessary in the past and wouldn't hesitate to speak to the relevant management if I had any again. Surely it's much better than coming on here and airing your dirty laundry when you probably haven't tried to actually speak to the relevant people with your issue and a possible way that it could be improved, not that we can all have what we want of course, after all this is a business.
As I have said before, no airline fits all its employees, but to state that a 5-10% attrition when the biggest player in the country is recruiting is hardly a surprise. Of the 5-10% probably only about 1% are off to anywhere other than BA.
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Echoing JFP and others - Sean Dillon your ramblings are becoming tiresome!
You clearly have issues with J2, your prerogative - but please try to at least adhere to the basics of any debate/argument...... i.e. strike a balance between presenting your opinion, listening to your opponents' point of view and debate it from there - its all one way with you!
So much of your diatribe is also firmly positioned at individuals (which if proven would be liable) rather than a general overview of the company. Be careful Sean Dillon...........
May I offer you some advice - No? Oh well I'll offer it anyhow!
Leave J2, don't burn your bridges (you never know when you might need a job or reference!) and stop doing your dirty washing in front of the very people who actually pay your wages - the customers - it is neither needed or the action of a professional pilot - GROW UP!
You clearly have issues with J2, your prerogative - but please try to at least adhere to the basics of any debate/argument...... i.e. strike a balance between presenting your opinion, listening to your opponents' point of view and debate it from there - its all one way with you!
So much of your diatribe is also firmly positioned at individuals (which if proven would be liable) rather than a general overview of the company. Be careful Sean Dillon...........
May I offer you some advice - No? Oh well I'll offer it anyhow!
Leave J2, don't burn your bridges (you never know when you might need a job or reference!) and stop doing your dirty washing in front of the very people who actually pay your wages - the customers - it is neither needed or the action of a professional pilot - GROW UP!
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If I can interject here: as a new member to the forum can I just say that I wholeheartedly agree with Endofeng and his/her post inre: Sean Dillon.
As a traveller who uses J2, listening to (or reading) the thoughts of a disgruntled pilot or cabin crew who really does seem to bite the hand that feeds is a sad state of affairs.
Honestly, life is far too short to be that unhappy in a job and if you really are that fed up, I'd leave ASAP if I were you.
Just my two'penneth.
Cheers.
As a traveller who uses J2, listening to (or reading) the thoughts of a disgruntled pilot or cabin crew who really does seem to bite the hand that feeds is a sad state of affairs.
Honestly, life is far too short to be that unhappy in a job and if you really are that fed up, I'd leave ASAP if I were you.
Just my two'penneth.
Cheers.
Last edited by nonfrequentflyer_NCL; 28th Apr 2015 at 17:18. Reason: grammar
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Not going to even comment on the thoughts of spotters/passengers on a pilots website quite frankly!
But as the odd other poster bringing to the fore, in between the head-in-sand clowns/Meeson Cool Aid Drinkers, confirm what the reality of life at Jet2 is and that nothing will ever evolve due to the pathetic and childish culture of people thinking its a great success.
There is a 'brick wall' coming, someone will need to actually wake up! I did like the 'GROW UP' comment...something Jet2 has a lot to do!
I see Thomson have announced recruitment again in September - it just continues...
But as the odd other poster bringing to the fore, in between the head-in-sand clowns/Meeson Cool Aid Drinkers, confirm what the reality of life at Jet2 is and that nothing will ever evolve due to the pathetic and childish culture of people thinking its a great success.
There is a 'brick wall' coming, someone will need to actually wake up! I did like the 'GROW UP' comment...something Jet2 has a lot to do!
I see Thomson have announced recruitment again in September - it just continues...