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Jet2 4

Old 19th Oct 2014, 16:55
  #1781 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2013
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Yeah as you say, probably some of the only benefits of a new fleet would be that they could operate (or would be forced to operate) more high frequency, i.e operating 4/5 weekly where they currently operate 2 weekly, but that doesn't mean the routes are going to be profitable. And then there was something about their current fleet being mostly paid for so all they pay for is operating and maintenence. No need to pay for things like leasing etc.
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Old 19th Oct 2014, 17:07
  #1782 (permalink)  
 
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They need to stick with what they're doing. It works. They need to know who they are and stick with it. You need your niche in aviation to make money and you need focus. Just ask AIr Berlin, MON and BD what happens when you don't know who you are trying to be. New Airbus and A330s will be the downfall of them.
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Old 19th Oct 2014, 18:14
  #1783 (permalink)  
 
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"New Airbus and A330s will be the downfall of them."
Someones been to drama lessons ?! If you dont consider development and build slowly on existing experience, you stagnate and then thats when you sink
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Old 19th Oct 2014, 19:07
  #1784 (permalink)  
 
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I don't doubt that Jet2 could raise the funds to finance a new (as in direct from the factory) fleet, but their business model would struggle to support it, a new fleet would require far higher utilisation than what they could do with their current business model or current fleet.
Jet2's business is widely misunderstood. .com is now Holidays's bitch. The business was diversified away from scheduled low cost towards package holidays back when the credit crunch hit, specifically to avoid a futile attempt to compete with RYR. It caused some internal strife, with the adjustments to working practices (and how it was mishandled) the primary reason for the Emirates exodus back in 09/10. It's now all about the package holiday customers. A low cost version of Thomas Cook / Thomson.

Recent comms tell us some flights now have 90%+ Holidays customers on board. If a coach is waiting for customers in Cyprus, deep night flying becomes commercially viable, which the current "Queens Of The Sky" cannot manage. That's the way the business is going and it seems to scream for a new, reliable, higher utilisable fleet.

Mixed fleet flying on A320/321/330 would be far more crew efficient (let's face it, crew utilisation is pathetic, most Jet2 crew don't see the "wrong" side of 500 hours a year).

all they pay for is operating and maintenence. No need to pay for things like leasing etc.
The crux of the matter. As the fleet ages, maintenance is becoming crippling. I heard LU is soon to be scrapped due to maintenance costs going through the roof. The NEO vs the classic's fuel burn is probably enough of a cost saving alone.

You don't have to go back too far for it to have been utterly unthinkable that Jet2 would build a state of the art training centre. "But they couldn't afford it"...
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Old 19th Oct 2014, 19:37
  #1785 (permalink)  
 
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Artie Fufkin

Yep agree with much of your analysis, but with Jet2 holidays driving the flying program the business becomes more seasonal, package holiday volume in winter are a fraction of the summer volume and it is for that reason that Jet2 sensibly lease in capacity during the peak 4 month period, but being a package means ATOL and cradle to the grave care when something goes wrong, which they do (both), they could not run the current fleet at the sort of utilisation that the big Lo Co's do and have any chance at an on time performance, as you say stay in your niche and gradually replace the classics with newer kit.
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Old 19th Oct 2014, 21:14
  #1786 (permalink)  
 
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Surely they can continue operating as they are with used aircraft, they can still get "new" A/C just not necessarily factory fresh.

i.e they have the classics while everyone else has the NG's, they're starting to get the NG's now as everyone else starts to get neo's and MAX's, which they can have while everyone else has the MAX 2.0 and the A320eneo (even newer engine option)

They can operate used aircraft acceptably reliably with a non strenuous yet still quite high utilisation over the summer, and still not haemorrhage money over the winter with half the fleet on the ground.

I really want to see the A330 happen, I'm glad it is (or they are definitely on track), I agree it will be risky but I think they can make it work, I have faith in them. Even if it fails, it will be tragic, but I don't think it would finish them off.
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Old 19th Oct 2014, 21:15
  #1787 (permalink)  
 
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Looking forward to this A330 arrival. I wonder if it will be reliveried for the summer?
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Old 19th Oct 2014, 22:12
  #1788 (permalink)  
 
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Hope so, it would be mighty pretty
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Old 20th Oct 2014, 01:55
  #1789 (permalink)  
 
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Maybe , they are looking at the 330's because they can't find any half decent 767's that have been rumoured in the past several times , once the next gen 330's and 350's come online , older versions of the 330 will be coming up for grabs . Would imagine the numbers have been crunched over and over , slow and steady seems to be working well for them, and no reason why in the future it won't still, I think if anything , is what will they use to replace the 737 300's with , or will they just get phased out , replaced with more 800's , or would they likely look to pick up a mix or 319/320's ? Personally think they'd likely stick with the 737's and have a small Airbus long haul fleet . Fast forward 10 years , maybe pick up some second hand early build 787's
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Old 20th Oct 2014, 02:04
  #1790 (permalink)  
 
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Yeah those second hand terrible teen 78's will be right up LS's street.

I think they should be looking in EK's direction for A330's
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Old 21st Oct 2014, 09:41
  #1791 (permalink)  
 
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I thought they would of stuck with Boeing but thumbs up to them for getting something as big as that. I just wonder how long they will keep the 75's for.
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Old 21st Oct 2014, 10:48
  #1792 (permalink)  
 
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airbus

they used to have a couple of a300 freighters be for they got into passengers in a big way.
they were converted to freighters in filton bristol.
it was nice to watch them with crew training out of filton.
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Old 21st Oct 2014, 20:33
  #1793 (permalink)  
 
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Midhaul

The 'Bus they are leasing is an A330-343. Trent engines and not the very latest bells and whistles HGW version.

That makes it the ideal plane for Canaries midhaul sectors or packed to the rafters with Alicante and Palma passengers. I'd expect it might see plenty of Dalaman and Paphos too. That A333 variant might not be ideal for flying over the pond but as for the LS and Holidays core routes it would fit quite nicely. High capacity, medium range.

LS also has to integrate BLK's flying into the MAN operation for next summer's forward bookings and hopefully it'll swell those ALC and other routes for them. Having a people mover on the strength is a no-brainer and the A330-343 fits the bill nicely.
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Old 21st Oct 2014, 22:34
  #1794 (permalink)  
 
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A330

If its Air Asia X as the donor airline, one old as the hills aircraft is a -301 GE engined variant, and possibly unable to go TATL. The rest are -343E variants, built between 2005 and 2014, and unless they are equipped as short to medium haul only, I suspect would be well capable of TATL operations.

Maybe someone would know the differences in more detail?
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Old 22nd Oct 2014, 05:33
  #1795 (permalink)  
 
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The a/c is going to be 9M-XXM with substitute a/c 9M-XXC both RR powered.
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Old 22nd Oct 2014, 09:59
  #1796 (permalink)  
 
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If they're just getting one, which it looks like they are, it'll be interesting what contingency plans they'll have in place if it goes tech.

It'll be an expensive lease if all doesn't go as planned - shipping a full A330 load across 2/3 other aircrafts or leasing in another is not going to be cheap. I'm sure the company they're leasing off won't compensate a lot to them depending on the issues.

Don't mean to be so doom and gloom but surprised nobody has not mentioned this yet.

It could still be a good move for Jet2 though if it all goes smoothly - I imagine there'll be plenty of s for them and could change the structure of their business for future years.
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Old 22nd Oct 2014, 10:03
  #1797 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by JonnyH View Post
Don't mean to be so doom and gloom but surprised nobody has not mentioned this yet.
They have mentioned it, just where it matters and not on PPRuNe.
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Old 22nd Oct 2014, 10:36
  #1798 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Interesting move by Jet2 and I wish them well...Good company to travel with...I presume this will be a wet lease with a couple of Jet2 staff supernumary in the cabin, as it were??
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Old 22nd Oct 2014, 10:37
  #1799 (permalink)  
 
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It'll be a damp lease.
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Old 22nd Oct 2014, 11:20
  #1800 (permalink)  
 
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There was mention of two in one grapevine message.
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