Scilly Isles Route
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Skybus don't tech stop on long distance routes like Southampton or Bristol.
They do have fuel bowsers on ISC - bought in from Gry Maretha several times a week.
Fuel is always available for Skybus aircraft - but nothing else.
They do have fuel bowsers on ISC - bought in from Gry Maretha several times a week.
Fuel is always available for Skybus aircraft - but nothing else.
Last edited by PlymouthPixie; 13th Jul 2012 at 08:36.
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I appreciate a Dash 7 on the Scillies route would not get much utilisation given the small size of the tourist market on the islands and my understanding is that numbers have fallen over the last five years. I tend to regard Scilly as eyewateringly expensive these days. But if the economics worked out would there not be scope for day trippers. In earlier days significant numbers used to go to St.Mary's from Penzance on the Scillonian before it got so expensive.
Day trip from say Newquay to St. Mary's anyone ? I wonder what fares would need to be charged to get sufficient bums on seats ?
Day trip from say Newquay to St. Mary's anyone ? I wonder what fares would need to be charged to get sufficient bums on seats ?
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It wonders me why you only concentrate on an oldtimer like the DHC-7 when a newer 39 seat DHC-8-103 can be used provided the 14/32 runway is lengthened to 800 metres. To extend the runway with 200 metres will cost a bit money with a gully towards the Old Town Lane and the rocks/coastline in the other direction, but it's feasible.
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The only reason for talking about the Dash-7, is it's one I have heard mentioned in the past as *almost* being able to operate from the existing runway. If there are better (in production) alternatives then great.
I was always under the impression the Dash-8s needed around 1000m. I agree 800m is more likely than 1000m as an extension, however it would still be tight I think.
Nice pic by the way
I was always under the impression the Dash-8s needed around 1000m. I agree 800m is more likely than 1000m as an extension, however it would still be tight I think.
Nice pic by the way
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Widerĝe Flyveselskap have used the DCH-8-103 for scheduled PSO flights to the 25 Norwegian STOLports for almost 20 years now. In other words this no news at all. All these STOLports had from the outset TORA/ASDA/TODA/LDA 799 metres when they were built between 1965 and 1990, but two of them have been lengthened afterward to also accommodate the larger 50 seat DHC-8-311 (ENBN and ENFL - both locations are vital oil bases with heli shuttle to offshore platforms).
I'm flying more and less on regular basis to one of these STOLports - Namsos - to do some work at one of our production sites. Namsos (OSY/ENNM) have only a LDA (Landing Distance Available) of 797 metres, and it has never been a problem to land except once due to visibility being close to zero. Below is a photo of one of these mini Dash-8s about to land at Namsos.
Dooby, in case you want to know about the previous photo I showed - it was taken on a visit to St. Marys on 2 April 2012. We flew in from St. Just Land's End on one of the first flights that day, stayed for a bit over one hour and flew back again to LEQ. Later that day we also manged to get a return flight with British International from Penzance to Tresco.
More about Widerĝe and the STOLport network:
Flights to Norway and the rest of the world - fly with Widerĝe
Widerĝe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I'm flying more and less on regular basis to one of these STOLports - Namsos - to do some work at one of our production sites. Namsos (OSY/ENNM) have only a LDA (Landing Distance Available) of 797 metres, and it has never been a problem to land except once due to visibility being close to zero. Below is a photo of one of these mini Dash-8s about to land at Namsos.
Dooby, in case you want to know about the previous photo I showed - it was taken on a visit to St. Marys on 2 April 2012. We flew in from St. Just Land's End on one of the first flights that day, stayed for a bit over one hour and flew back again to LEQ. Later that day we also manged to get a return flight with British International from Penzance to Tresco.
More about Widerĝe and the STOLport network:
Flights to Norway and the rest of the world - fly with Widerĝe
Widerĝe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Last edited by LN-KGL; 14th Jul 2012 at 12:08.
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Very sad day, I hope that BIH keep the mx facility at NQY
IOS will obviously still be served ex NQY by 5Y, TSO however will be left with no air links.
I also still think that long term a BE codeshare on 5Y services will be a good thing.
cs
IOS will obviously still be served ex NQY by 5Y, TSO however will be left with no air links.
I also still think that long term a BE codeshare on 5Y services will be a good thing.
cs
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Sounds like an opposite to the PLH situ, shut down the airline then close the airport ... PZE have got it arse about face!
Tresco has a 1,188ft runway, how much runway does a loaded BN2 need and any chance of a runway extension in to the pond?
Tresco has a 1,188ft runway, how much runway does a loaded BN2 need and any chance of a runway extension in to the pond?
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If I am not mistaken, BIH operates up to 9 flights a day to the islands, so that's a daily capacity of almost 250 seats. Don't know what the load factors are, but to make up for that shortfall in capacity, Skybus would need to operate something like two additional Twin Otters from NQY or dozens of Islander flights from St. Just. Or is the general belief that passengers will opt for the vomit comet, i.e. take the ship?
To me, it sounds a bit more like pressuring someone as the islands obviously cannot operate without a replacement for the transport capacity BIH has provided for decades.
To me, it sounds a bit more like pressuring someone as the islands obviously cannot operate without a replacement for the transport capacity BIH has provided for decades.
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The current Twin Otter fleet is maxed out as it is.
1 Islander operates from Lands End - St Marys
1 Islander in for check at Lands End.
The other Islander alternates with the Lands End - St Marys Islander throughtout the day.
1 Twin Otter on the Newquay - St Marys.
The other two operate the BRS, SOU & EXT throughout the day.
The S-61 is almost always full - about 26 seats - BIH make £2000 for every flight, £1000 of that goes on fuel and the chopper, the rest goes on staff wages and the upkeep of the heliport, hence the loss making - so even though the flights are full, they still make a loss becuase of the increased price of fuel.
1 Islander operates from Lands End - St Marys
1 Islander in for check at Lands End.
The other Islander alternates with the Lands End - St Marys Islander throughtout the day.
1 Twin Otter on the Newquay - St Marys.
The other two operate the BRS, SOU & EXT throughout the day.
The S-61 is almost always full - about 26 seats - BIH make £2000 for every flight, £1000 of that goes on fuel and the chopper, the rest goes on staff wages and the upkeep of the heliport, hence the loss making - so even though the flights are full, they still make a loss becuase of the increased price of fuel.
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There is normally one Twin Otter based at St. Just (at least it was so as I made my flights in April), but as said above normally used to the more distant airports.
Here are two of them at St. Marys
The British International S-61Ns are getting old, and I suspect they aren't the most cost effective among the helicopters these days. It's sad to see them go, but this day had to come. Maybe why I did the trip in April just to have done it? I missed out Plymouth with a few days because of the radar coverage, but this time I made it.
Cabin view on the return flight from Tresco
Here are two of them at St. Marys
The British International S-61Ns are getting old, and I suspect they aren't the most cost effective among the helicopters these days. It's sad to see them go, but this day had to come. Maybe why I did the trip in April just to have done it? I missed out Plymouth with a few days because of the radar coverage, but this time I made it.
Cabin view on the return flight from Tresco
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from Beeb
Penzance to Isles of Scilly helicopter flights ending
The service has been run since 1964 but will end on 1 November.
A helicopter service from Cornwall to the Isles of Scilly is to end, its operators have announced. British International Helicopters (BIH) is to end its service from Penzance, which has run since 1964, in November.
The company blamed the decision on uncertainty created by legal challenges to its sale of land to supermarket giant Sainsbury's.
St Ives' Liberal Democrat MP Andrew George has called the announcement "appalling" and a "disaster". BIH has to move from its 15-acre site at the end of October because of the Sainsbury's deal. It planned to use the proceeds from the sale to buy new aircraft and bid for new business. But the company, which has not operated services this week, said the decision to close the route was "finally triggered by legal action taken by Tesco and two private individuals".
Analysis
Neil Gallacher BBC South West Business Correspondent
No surprise that this has rattled an island community that already feels itself to be stuck out on a limb. The helicopters take about a third of the passengers that go to and fro each year. Aeroplanes owned by the Steamship Group also operate, but BIH's helicopters carry more passengers.
And the islands' ferry route doesn't operate in the winter.
But there's some reassurance: the Steamship Group says it has plenty of spare capacity for now, especially in the winter when its aeroplanes are less busy.
And it's extending the life of the current Scillonian ferry "until at least 2018".
Two crunch questions remain for now.
- What'll happen to prices under a Steamship air and sea monopoly?
- And, in a few years, what replaces the Scillonian and its current ancient port facility in Penzance?
It's a lot of uncertainty for a small community to shoulder. It said potential delays caused by the challenges "created too many uncertainties for the passenger service to continue".
BIH said the closure would affect employees and that a formal redundancy consultation process had begun with staff.
The independent Cornwall councillor for Porthleven and Helston South, Andrew Wallis, said BIH's decision was a "kick in the teeth" for the communities of the islands and west Cornwall.
He said: "To me, this is two supermarkets squabbling over a piece of land and the communities of Penzance and the Isles of Scilly are the ones to miss out."
Mr George said he had called for an emergency meeting over the link.
Conservative-Independent led Cornwall Council said it was "extremely disappointed" by the decision to end the service, which has offered as many as 40 flights a day and is thought to be used by up to 130,000 people a year.
It said: "We are keen to continue to talk to BIH about the future of the helicopter service and to see what support can be provided."
The Isles of Scilly Council said it was "deeply saddened" at the move.
The unitary authority said it was pleased services would operate until the end of October because it "ensures there will be no disruption to the holiday season".
It added that its immediate priority was to "ensure the stability of our transport infrastructure" and that "steps are already under way" to do so.
The Scillonian ferry service to the islands from Penzance remains, as do Skybus aeroplane services from Bristol, Exeter, Land's End, Newquay and Southampton.
Both are operated by the Isles of Scilly Steamship Group.
Group chairman Andrew May said the company would work with the Scillonian community in an attempt to compensate for BIH's pulling out.
Sainsbury's said it was still committed to bringing a store to Penzance.
BIH said anyone with a flight booked after 1 November would be given a full refund.
The service has been run since 1964 but will end on 1 November.
A helicopter service from Cornwall to the Isles of Scilly is to end, its operators have announced. British International Helicopters (BIH) is to end its service from Penzance, which has run since 1964, in November.
The company blamed the decision on uncertainty created by legal challenges to its sale of land to supermarket giant Sainsbury's.
St Ives' Liberal Democrat MP Andrew George has called the announcement "appalling" and a "disaster". BIH has to move from its 15-acre site at the end of October because of the Sainsbury's deal. It planned to use the proceeds from the sale to buy new aircraft and bid for new business. But the company, which has not operated services this week, said the decision to close the route was "finally triggered by legal action taken by Tesco and two private individuals".
Analysis
Neil Gallacher BBC South West Business Correspondent
No surprise that this has rattled an island community that already feels itself to be stuck out on a limb. The helicopters take about a third of the passengers that go to and fro each year. Aeroplanes owned by the Steamship Group also operate, but BIH's helicopters carry more passengers.
And the islands' ferry route doesn't operate in the winter.
But there's some reassurance: the Steamship Group says it has plenty of spare capacity for now, especially in the winter when its aeroplanes are less busy.
And it's extending the life of the current Scillonian ferry "until at least 2018".
Two crunch questions remain for now.
- What'll happen to prices under a Steamship air and sea monopoly?
- And, in a few years, what replaces the Scillonian and its current ancient port facility in Penzance?
It's a lot of uncertainty for a small community to shoulder. It said potential delays caused by the challenges "created too many uncertainties for the passenger service to continue".
BIH said the closure would affect employees and that a formal redundancy consultation process had begun with staff.
The independent Cornwall councillor for Porthleven and Helston South, Andrew Wallis, said BIH's decision was a "kick in the teeth" for the communities of the islands and west Cornwall.
He said: "To me, this is two supermarkets squabbling over a piece of land and the communities of Penzance and the Isles of Scilly are the ones to miss out."
Mr George said he had called for an emergency meeting over the link.
Conservative-Independent led Cornwall Council said it was "extremely disappointed" by the decision to end the service, which has offered as many as 40 flights a day and is thought to be used by up to 130,000 people a year.
It said: "We are keen to continue to talk to BIH about the future of the helicopter service and to see what support can be provided."
The Isles of Scilly Council said it was "deeply saddened" at the move.
The unitary authority said it was pleased services would operate until the end of October because it "ensures there will be no disruption to the holiday season".
It added that its immediate priority was to "ensure the stability of our transport infrastructure" and that "steps are already under way" to do so.
The Scillonian ferry service to the islands from Penzance remains, as do Skybus aeroplane services from Bristol, Exeter, Land's End, Newquay and Southampton.
Both are operated by the Isles of Scilly Steamship Group.
Group chairman Andrew May said the company would work with the Scillonian community in an attempt to compensate for BIH's pulling out.
Sainsbury's said it was still committed to bringing a store to Penzance.
BIH said anyone with a flight booked after 1 November would be given a full refund.
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i think BIH were looking for an excuse to get out of the loss making scilly route, with the FOST dauphins going to Hms raleigh, Newquays facility will go next.
BIH are streamlining to probably focus on offshore/ mil contracts. this has been smoke and mirrors for the last couple of years from BIH as they never really intended to go to Newquay either
BIH are streamlining to probably focus on offshore/ mil contracts. this has been smoke and mirrors for the last couple of years from BIH as they never really intended to go to Newquay either
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I agree the proposed juidicial review was just the excuse BIH were looking for to drop the service. Although they spoke about a NQY-IOS service, flights were only loaded through to January 2013, not even to the end of W12 season. I always had my suspicions they planned to drop the service. A great shame.
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What surprises me is that the location of the current heliport at Penzance appears to be such a lucrative piece of real estate that it would have been able to finance the relocation of the whole operation to St. Erth, including building a new heliport (or was this supposed to be paid from public funds?). I mean the area is next to the main road and railway track and not exactly in an uptown living area, if I am not mistaken.
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@virginblue, this is the kind of thing that led many people to believe that BIH had no intention of continuing the service, and were just looking for an excuse/way to blame it on someone else. The speed at which they pulled out of the St Erth plan added to that.
I can see a way it would have worked financially, in that I believe they had a debt that was about to mature, the revenue from the sale would have allowed them to pay off that debt and avoid crippling interest payment, possibly making the route profitable again.
One thing to note is that one of the big concerns people are voicing is whether Skybus has the capacity to pick up all the passengers that were being carried by BIH (70,000 is the number floating around, although I suspect that is passenger segments not return trips).
I can see a way it would have worked financially, in that I believe they had a debt that was about to mature, the revenue from the sale would have allowed them to pay off that debt and avoid crippling interest payment, possibly making the route profitable again.
One thing to note is that one of the big concerns people are voicing is whether Skybus has the capacity to pick up all the passengers that were being carried by BIH (70,000 is the number floating around, although I suspect that is passenger segments not return trips).
Last edited by Dooby; 3rd Aug 2012 at 12:36.
