SOUTHAMPTON
Join Date: Nov 2006
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Other than the fact that SOU lacks stands especially purposely for A320 size aircraft as well as a runway of only 1,723 m or 5,653 ft what is actually stopping airlines like Easyjet to at least consider taking over the Flybe sun routes from Southampton to Alicante, Faro, Malaga, Nice and Palma?
If EZY can operated out of Southend why not Southampton, I know there are limitations as there is a steeper approach to SOU but we have had regular 737's from Air Berlin, Air Europa, etc and 757's from Thomson, First Choice, etc as well as A320's from Iberoworld, Spanair, etc flying to most of those destinations that are currently the 'sun' routes from SOU.
The new management need to get off there arse's and start promoting the airport more and with all its benefits that include direct motorway access to the M27 and M3 as well the airport station with all it's connections plus the many cruise passengers that embark on their cruise from Northern Europe's busiest cruise turnaround port with an expected 2 million passengers in 2015.
Management should be trying hard to get the likes of Easyjet and encourage them to base an aircraft at SOU to fly on the current sun routes that are probably going to be dropped by Flybe at some stage even though they have always been popular from SOU, there is a demand for more flights from SOU even though BOH is down the road the wider catchment area of SOU is huge and not everyone wants to fly Ryanair from BOH.
With two based A319 Easyjet could fly on the current sun routes as well as opening new routes to the likes of Barcelona, Ibiza, Milan, Munich, Venice, etc, maybe even offer Geneva like they do at BOH with a Swiss based aircraft.
On another note I was informed that approx 5,000 Spanish students had stayed in and around Southampton over the summer period all accommodated in the cities student blocks, surely there is a summer demand to offer a short programme of flights by the likes of Air Nostrum similar to those that fly to LTN.
Thoughts anyone especially ADFLY as I appreciate his enthusiasm for SOU.
If EZY can operated out of Southend why not Southampton, I know there are limitations as there is a steeper approach to SOU but we have had regular 737's from Air Berlin, Air Europa, etc and 757's from Thomson, First Choice, etc as well as A320's from Iberoworld, Spanair, etc flying to most of those destinations that are currently the 'sun' routes from SOU.
The new management need to get off there arse's and start promoting the airport more and with all its benefits that include direct motorway access to the M27 and M3 as well the airport station with all it's connections plus the many cruise passengers that embark on their cruise from Northern Europe's busiest cruise turnaround port with an expected 2 million passengers in 2015.
Management should be trying hard to get the likes of Easyjet and encourage them to base an aircraft at SOU to fly on the current sun routes that are probably going to be dropped by Flybe at some stage even though they have always been popular from SOU, there is a demand for more flights from SOU even though BOH is down the road the wider catchment area of SOU is huge and not everyone wants to fly Ryanair from BOH.
With two based A319 Easyjet could fly on the current sun routes as well as opening new routes to the likes of Barcelona, Ibiza, Milan, Munich, Venice, etc, maybe even offer Geneva like they do at BOH with a Swiss based aircraft.
On another note I was informed that approx 5,000 Spanish students had stayed in and around Southampton over the summer period all accommodated in the cities student blocks, surely there is a summer demand to offer a short programme of flights by the likes of Air Nostrum similar to those that fly to LTN.
Thoughts anyone especially ADFLY as I appreciate his enthusiasm for SOU.
Join Date: Sep 2008
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Either that or why not the likes of BA. It works out of LCY, why not from SOU. I know BA were the predominant carrier in SOU prior to Flybe but the Embraers wouldn't be an issue in and out of SOU
Join Date: Aug 2007
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I'm sure SOU management ARE trying to get extra flights/carriers/routes in. Just because you don't see it on the ground doesn't mean they are not trying. A lot of time and effort goes into a new route launch. Much of it is commercially sensitive as one airlines opportunity is also another's especially if it's a sure ire winner.
New routes are a gamble, Flybe weren't exactly sure what the outcome of launching new routes from BOH were until they launched them. Uptake was slow but now momentum on those routes is gathering they can see that they haven't detracted passengers from SOU.
So BOH, SOU and Flybe are all winners in a sense.
New routes are a gamble, Flybe weren't exactly sure what the outcome of launching new routes from BOH were until they launched them. Uptake was slow but now momentum on those routes is gathering they can see that they haven't detracted passengers from SOU.
So BOH, SOU and Flybe are all winners in a sense.
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But SOU won't be the winner if we lose all our sun routes what would be left is approximately half of the destinations that were flown by Flybe at the peak of their SOU operations.
I fear that if no airline comes forward we may see the end of these popular destinations which would be sad in my opinion.
With regards to BA City Flyer operating from SOU I was going to mention them actually they would obviously be my preference and it wouldn't affect their London operations in any way.
Let's hope the future is secure for SOU regarding the 'sun' routes and any further expansion to those destinations then SOU will be a winner and not a looser either with Flybe or another carrier or two.
With the expansion of Vueling in the UK market I would like them to reconsider operating from SOU again.
Sean
I fear that if no airline comes forward we may see the end of these popular destinations which would be sad in my opinion.
With regards to BA City Flyer operating from SOU I was going to mention them actually they would obviously be my preference and it wouldn't affect their London operations in any way.
Let's hope the future is secure for SOU regarding the 'sun' routes and any further expansion to those destinations then SOU will be a winner and not a looser either with Flybe or another carrier or two.
With the expansion of Vueling in the UK market I would like them to reconsider operating from SOU again.
Sean
Just to point out that Flybe have been sending Q400's SOU-PMI as part of the S16 schedule, and they've been to ALC on a few occasions that I'm aware of aswell, so the "sun routes" may not entirely disappear even if the 195's are not around to operate them.
Join Date: May 2009
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I am in agreement that SOU's Achilles' Heel is that is relies too strongly on a single airline for its passenger traffic. While Flybe offer a good combination of business and leisure routes on aircraft well suited to SOU they also like to chop and change a lot. Having read elsewhere that SOU will likely become an all Q400 base from this winter I sadly think the chances of the Sun routes returning in their typical sate next year is rather slim. I imagine there will be quite a few regular customers who will not be pleased with this move, especially given they have been running for the past 12 years!
Flybe may consider using Q400's for the likes of PMI and possibly ALC if it has worked out well this year, although given the jet alternatives both ex. SOU and up the road at BOH I doubt these would be massively popular, and I think we could rule out AGP/FAO on a Q400, even if it is possible on paper. Q400's could work quite well for the likes of BCN, BIA, NCE, GOA as well based on what they fly currently and have flown in the past.
A carrier like Easyjet could be very beneficial for SOU being able to operate a variety of Sun and City routes not currently served. My reservations about such an operation would be 1. Would they be happy with being limited to 2 (maybe 3 with some reshuffling) based aircraft as a result of the lack of appropriate stands for A319/20's? 2. Would they end up trying to compete more widely with Flybe, potentially killing them off routes such as EDI/GLA/AMS via a fare war and leaving those routes not as well served as they are today? and finally 3. How much would SOU affect their LGW base, and would significant expansion at the former potentially dilute some routes at their largest base a little?
BA Cityflyer I could not see operating out of SOU beyond maybe the occasional weekend charter, maybe in the future we might see a few Bath Travel charters in addition to the BOH ones they are operating next year.
Good to see that Thomas Cook will operate their own PMI flight next summer, this should be at least one of Flybe's Sun routes will still be reasonably well served;
Thomas Cook - Fri Evelop A320 (180 seats?)
Thomson - Tues/Sat Volotea 717 (125 x 2 seats)
Fingers crossed for some more good news in the coming weeks as more carries release their summer schedules.
Flybe may consider using Q400's for the likes of PMI and possibly ALC if it has worked out well this year, although given the jet alternatives both ex. SOU and up the road at BOH I doubt these would be massively popular, and I think we could rule out AGP/FAO on a Q400, even if it is possible on paper. Q400's could work quite well for the likes of BCN, BIA, NCE, GOA as well based on what they fly currently and have flown in the past.
A carrier like Easyjet could be very beneficial for SOU being able to operate a variety of Sun and City routes not currently served. My reservations about such an operation would be 1. Would they be happy with being limited to 2 (maybe 3 with some reshuffling) based aircraft as a result of the lack of appropriate stands for A319/20's? 2. Would they end up trying to compete more widely with Flybe, potentially killing them off routes such as EDI/GLA/AMS via a fare war and leaving those routes not as well served as they are today? and finally 3. How much would SOU affect their LGW base, and would significant expansion at the former potentially dilute some routes at their largest base a little?
BA Cityflyer I could not see operating out of SOU beyond maybe the occasional weekend charter, maybe in the future we might see a few Bath Travel charters in addition to the BOH ones they are operating next year.
Good to see that Thomas Cook will operate their own PMI flight next summer, this should be at least one of Flybe's Sun routes will still be reasonably well served;
Thomas Cook - Fri Evelop A320 (180 seats?)
Thomson - Tues/Sat Volotea 717 (125 x 2 seats)
Fingers crossed for some more good news in the coming weeks as more carries release their summer schedules.
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Easy jet
I have long maintained EZY are a perfect fit for SOU. It's easy to forget that they are as much about the businessman as they are about holidays in the sun. They would fit SOU perfectly but as someone has already said we would have to sacrifice frequency. Unfortunately SOU is doomed to to a future with BE or another likeminded low aspirational airline. The only plus point on the horizon is the BOH operation being wound up once the subsidies dry up.
It's a shame an invester like Stobart doesn't come along and make a go of SOU. Look at what they have done for a pointless airport like SEN. It has all the right ingredients for a successful airport and even some ace up it's sleeves like being based in the cruise capital of Northern Europe. Unfortunately it's owned by someone's pension fund as a vehicle to park some money. Without the stands and taxiways being built the bigger airlines won't be interested.
It's a shame an invester like Stobart doesn't come along and make a go of SOU. Look at what they have done for a pointless airport like SEN. It has all the right ingredients for a successful airport and even some ace up it's sleeves like being based in the cruise capital of Northern Europe. Unfortunately it's owned by someone's pension fund as a vehicle to park some money. Without the stands and taxiways being built the bigger airlines won't be interested.
Adfly
If Flyb e can't offload the E195s in the next two or three months I'm sure you can expect to see the sun routes back next summer. They operated this summer as a way of offsetting the cost of keeping them grounded but will go back into storage for the winter if they can@t be got rid of
If Flyb e can't offload the E195s in the next two or three months I'm sure you can expect to see the sun routes back next summer. They operated this summer as a way of offsetting the cost of keeping them grounded but will go back into storage for the winter if they can@t be got rid of
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Ok I'll bite and ask RJ the obvious.
Why is EZY a 'perfect' ft for SOU. An A320 doesn't fit all at on the stands as canberra97 says.
What subsidies are BOH getting? Would you care to enlighten us?
I'm sure that Southend users find there's a 'point' to the Airport. London is a BIG place and those on the East/South East now have extra choice other than STN and LGW.
Pensions are not for 'parking' money but ensuring growth and good return. At least I hope mine is getting that!
Over to you Riv...
Why is EZY a 'perfect' ft for SOU. An A320 doesn't fit all at on the stands as canberra97 says.
What subsidies are BOH getting? Would you care to enlighten us?
I'm sure that Southend users find there's a 'point' to the Airport. London is a BIG place and those on the East/South East now have extra choice other than STN and LGW.
Pensions are not for 'parking' money but ensuring growth and good return. At least I hope mine is getting that!
Over to you Riv...
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with a little investment (not before time) on the northern taxiway and maybe re-arranging stands 1-5 to say 1-3 to accommodate A319 size, surely this would be a viable solution. If as many say, that Flybe are transferring to a Q400 fleet only from Southampton, could they not utilise the remaining stands 6-14?
The problem holding back SOU development isn't simply the runway length. Due to a requirement to provide a minimum length RESA (runway end safety area) 73 metres is lost from the 20 TORA, resulting in only 1650 metres being available, less than SEN. Secondly there is a horrific tree problem off the south end of the runway together with the hill. These are performance (ie take-off weight) limiting. The hill cannot be moved, the trees can. Reduction of one group (ie believe called Marhill Copse) would significantly improve the situation and permit an increase in take-off weights/range.
The taxiway situation isn't simple. When the site was re-developed many items of the family silver were given away to secure quick planning consent. This included the punitive night flight restrictions and an undertaking not to build a northern taxiway that would take aircraft closer to houses in Southampton Road (Eastleigh) than they would be on the runway at its north end. Consequently, any extension will have to either be on the east side or stop short of the northern end of the runway (effectively ruled out due to building of another of the many car parks).
Thanks to BAA SOU is a catalogue of missed opportunities which will hold back long term development without multi-million pound investment, how deep are the new owner's pockets? Or is it just a case of eventually throwing in the towel and selling off the site for non-airport development when growth isn't worth the investment?
The taxiway situation isn't simple. When the site was re-developed many items of the family silver were given away to secure quick planning consent. This included the punitive night flight restrictions and an undertaking not to build a northern taxiway that would take aircraft closer to houses in Southampton Road (Eastleigh) than they would be on the runway at its north end. Consequently, any extension will have to either be on the east side or stop short of the northern end of the runway (effectively ruled out due to building of another of the many car parks).
Thanks to BAA SOU is a catalogue of missed opportunities which will hold back long term development without multi-million pound investment, how deep are the new owner's pockets? Or is it just a case of eventually throwing in the towel and selling off the site for non-airport development when growth isn't worth the investment?
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Personally, Rivet Joint I would stay well clear of Stobart regarding Aviation matters. I have said on a number of occasions they should stick to what they know best i.e. logisitics or as we old gits know as road and rail transport. Even though Southend has again come out on top in the Which airport survey the airport is still well underused and passenger numbers are declining.
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More details on the Germania charters to Chambery this winter, source is AirlineRoute:
From 12th Dec 2015
ST3798 SOU1320 – 1555CMF 319 7
ST3799 CMF1035 – 1115SOU 319 7
Indeed I am also hopeful that the new owners may invest a little more into the airfield and address some of the current restrictions.
From 12th Dec 2015
ST3798 SOU1320 – 1555CMF 319 7
ST3799 CMF1035 – 1115SOU 319 7
Indeed I am also hopeful that the new owners may invest a little more into the airfield and address some of the current restrictions.
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TCAS FAN
Surely the simple answer would be to build a taxiway linking stand 14 out to the runway that would alleviate the need for backtracking from the middle point of 02/20. This I don't see as interfering with houses on Southampton Rd at the northern end of the airfield and would not be cost prohibitive.
I'm probably barking up the wrong tree but this plus my suggestion of reducing the number of stands at 1-5 to accommodate larger aircraft would not attract huge financial outlays and might just start to sow the seed of thought in new airlines minds!!
Surely the simple answer would be to build a taxiway linking stand 14 out to the runway that would alleviate the need for backtracking from the middle point of 02/20. This I don't see as interfering with houses on Southampton Rd at the northern end of the airfield and would not be cost prohibitive.
I'm probably barking up the wrong tree but this plus my suggestion of reducing the number of stands at 1-5 to accommodate larger aircraft would not attract huge financial outlays and might just start to sow the seed of thought in new airlines minds!!
Stewyb
Would considerably improve the current situation. One of the catalogue of the BAA missed opportunities that I mentioned. When we were resurfacing the runway, with the asphalt production plant on site, we inquired as to the cost - under £50K to install it!
Canberra97
Role on the Neos!
Would considerably improve the current situation. One of the catalogue of the BAA missed opportunities that I mentioned. When we were resurfacing the runway, with the asphalt production plant on site, we inquired as to the cost - under £50K to install it!
Canberra97
Role on the Neos!
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For those that were wondering if BA Cityflyer might make an appearance next year they are now scheduled in to operate a few Malaga charters for Omega holidays who seem to be operating quite an enlarged programme next year from Southampton
5 flights are scheduled to operate on Sat 23 July , 6 , 20 , 27 Aug , 24 Sept with flight times of 1425 dept and 2040 arrive
5 flights are scheduled to operate on Sat 23 July , 6 , 20 , 27 Aug , 24 Sept with flight times of 1425 dept and 2040 arrive
