DURHAM TEES VALLEY AIRPORT - 5
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I fail to understand what downgrading the airfield means (as mentioned in the press)? What category do you need to handle a 737 flying to Palma vs an 80 seater Fokker 70 flying to Amsterdam?
If we still have flights to Verona and Bulgaria, then surely the airfield could still handle Thomson 738 flights?
If we still have flights to Verona and Bulgaria, then surely the airfield could still handle Thomson 738 flights?
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KLM
And another P.S on KLM.
I said to Skyman yesterday that I don't think KLM will care providing the yields hold. Unless the owners manage this properly and on the front foot, this could have a quick and dramatic affect on KLM passenger numbers.
As soon as the KLM leisure passengers and the business community are fully up to speed with all this news, would you book with KLM from Teesside?
I can tell you now that if I had a business trip to plan now for 3 months time, would I book via Teesside or Newcastle whilst the only source of information from the owners I have is "watch this space"? I think the answer is obvious.
Peel need to get a credible, understable, strategic, reassuring announcement out TODAY if part of their plan for the future is to retain the services of KLM and Eastern airways.
I said to Skyman yesterday that I don't think KLM will care providing the yields hold. Unless the owners manage this properly and on the front foot, this could have a quick and dramatic affect on KLM passenger numbers.
As soon as the KLM leisure passengers and the business community are fully up to speed with all this news, would you book with KLM from Teesside?
I can tell you now that if I had a business trip to plan now for 3 months time, would I book via Teesside or Newcastle whilst the only source of information from the owners I have is "watch this space"? I think the answer is obvious.
Peel need to get a credible, understable, strategic, reassuring announcement out TODAY if part of their plan for the future is to retain the services of KLM and Eastern airways.
I would still book KLM / Eastern to/from DTV if the price was no higher than from Newcastle / Leeds.
Either the DTV flights will operate or the airline will offer me a transfer to my choice of nearby airport at a time of my convenience but at the airline's cost. Furthermore if DTV loses service I would retain the option to ask for a refund on a ticket whose original conditions of sale state its non refundable.
Yes, this is a way of effectively gaming the system at the airline's cost. I accept however that customers booking under the expectations I've just mentioned are less than ideal for an airline.
Either the DTV flights will operate or the airline will offer me a transfer to my choice of nearby airport at a time of my convenience but at the airline's cost. Furthermore if DTV loses service I would retain the option to ask for a refund on a ticket whose original conditions of sale state its non refundable.
Yes, this is a way of effectively gaming the system at the airline's cost. I accept however that customers booking under the expectations I've just mentioned are less than ideal for an airline.
Last edited by davidjohnson6; 29th Oct 2013 at 13:15.
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Could there be someone waiting in the wings who does not want any competition from another opperator hence the TOM situation. Only to reveal all when they have an exclusive deal.
Possibly the silliest post ever.
Probably pie in the sky, but who knows??
Possibly the silliest post ever.
Probably pie in the sky, but who knows??
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The press teams
The press should be trying to obtain a copy of the Peel-council contract.
Dont know if there was another contract after VAS sold their shares?
I would be very interested to find out just WHO benefited from the councils giving the airport away to Peel.
Why did Hughie prefer Peel???? as I heard there were 10 other interested parties who wanted to buy the airport BUT were not entertained by the management? WHY? Can the press interview Hughie and whoever was on the DTV board at the time of the sale to Peel???
I read somewhere, might have been on here that Peel now value the DTV land at £30m in their own accounts.
Lots of questions need to be asked.
The press should be trawling back through the post here to get some clues as to WHO has got rich out of these deals.
Anyone from the press been in touch with KLM, Eastern or Cobham about the latest fiasco at DTV?
Winters coming, lets see how many times the airport is closed due to snow as Peel havent invested in equipement either
Dont know if there was another contract after VAS sold their shares?
I would be very interested to find out just WHO benefited from the councils giving the airport away to Peel.
Why did Hughie prefer Peel???? as I heard there were 10 other interested parties who wanted to buy the airport BUT were not entertained by the management? WHY? Can the press interview Hughie and whoever was on the DTV board at the time of the sale to Peel???
I read somewhere, might have been on here that Peel now value the DTV land at £30m in their own accounts.
Lots of questions need to be asked.
The press should be trawling back through the post here to get some clues as to WHO has got rich out of these deals.
Anyone from the press been in touch with KLM, Eastern or Cobham about the latest fiasco at DTV?
Winters coming, lets see how many times the airport is closed due to snow as Peel havent invested in equipement either
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It is interesting that in continuing to read this thread that in most cases the "penny still hasn't dropped", to restate that if there was ever any doubt that Peel's current strategy is to close the airport to commercial operators, it has now become very clear.
It would, even for Peel, be politically unacceptable to simply "lock the gates" so instead they have adopted the more subtle approach of simply withdrawing investment and addressing each and every service in a negative way.
Put simply "if you pull away enough of the foundations then eventually the building will collapse".
All this on going talk of airlines apart from TOM, do you really think that Peel's attitude will be any less negative ?, No Chance !, The party line by the current management is that we will not be open for business next summer do not come ! or as they have said
So forget all none current operations as Peel clearly are not interested, as to those still operating, principally KL, then there is in place a "service contract" between them and DTV, rest assured as soon as there is any chance to terminate it by Peel, then they will. Unfortunately there is no other rational or logical conclusion to all of this.
It would, even for Peel, be politically unacceptable to simply "lock the gates" so instead they have adopted the more subtle approach of simply withdrawing investment and addressing each and every service in a negative way.
Put simply "if you pull away enough of the foundations then eventually the building will collapse".
All this on going talk of airlines apart from TOM, do you really think that Peel's attitude will be any less negative ?, No Chance !, The party line by the current management is that we will not be open for business next summer do not come ! or as they have said
" Following a business review of operations by Durham Rees Valley Airport, Thomson and First Choice have been notified that they will no longer be able to operate their flights from the airport"
Last edited by skyman771; 29th Oct 2013 at 16:48.
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Skipness One Echo
You make a lot of sensible & valid points in your posts, however you have missed the key one above. Peel have never had any intention whatsoever of disposing of the airport. They saw it as valuable development land, which was a good fit for their portfolio.
The issue that frustrates "Northbound" & many others is how they were able to be able to put "one over" a bunch of incompetent idiots in it's acquisition in the first place !
Teesside as it is now, isn't commercially viable and couldn't be sold as a going concern for any price Peel would accept.
The issue that frustrates "Northbound" & many others is how they were able to be able to put "one over" a bunch of incompetent idiots in it's acquisition in the first place !
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Yes, perhaps I wasn't clear. They appear to be running the business down with an intention to close commercial passenger operations and monetise the land. Painful. I hope someone stops them!
Whilst I generally refrain from "bashing", I have to say I'm shocked the owners are letting all the negativity and comment come out first. Surely, in a major announcement like this, you would expect them to get on the front foot - tell the public what is happening and at least "try" and show there is a sense of purpose and direction to the plans, however difficult the message is. Instead, the public are fed rumours, snippets and the truth via the back door with nothing other than a "watch this space" from the owners. I am a Director in business and this is not the way you treat customers.
Also, assuming BGH and BE follow but just haven't been confirmed yet, does this mean that all other pax flights which need the terminal are now not welcome? What about freight?
***Thread drift alert - can anybody remember a similar instance of an airport turning away a customer of this stature?***
Last edited by SWBKCB; 29th Oct 2013 at 18:19.
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It seems ironic that Thomson customers are being encouraged to switch to Doncaster Airport services in lieu of DTV. Now which company owns Doncaster Robin Hood Airport again? And aren't Newcastle and Leeds-Bradford Airports closer and more convenient for Teesside originating customers? How interesting!!!
Interesting too that Thomson should receive a "we don't want you at MME" message when they are also the principal airline left holding things together down at stablemate DSA! Hmmm ….
Top management!
Interesting too that Thomson should receive a "we don't want you at MME" message when they are also the principal airline left holding things together down at stablemate DSA! Hmmm ….
Top management!
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According to tonight's Look North there will be an announcement tomorrow that all charter flights will be stopped. Can't see the two scheduled airlines lasting longer than a year or two then Peel can get on with property development plus scrapyard, caravan park etc.
A couple of idiotic quotations from local MPs. MPs raise concerns about loss of charter flights from Durham Tees Valley Airport (From The Northern Echo)
A couple of idiotic quotations from local MPs. MPs raise concerns about loss of charter flights from Durham Tees Valley Airport (From The Northern Echo)
Last edited by apaul; 29th Oct 2013 at 19:35.
Where now ??
Well it's been an interesting 48 hours(or maybe months) one of the busiest threads on pprune and certainly the saddest?
My fear is the adverse pr is going to send shivers up Kim and Eastern and peel will get what they desire.
". It's not our fault,we had no option,everyone deserted the airport". I can see the echo headlines now.."we had no option but too close". If I were klm I would get out now before their reputation is tarnished and dragged down
PEEl you are a disgrace and an affront to. Uk industry.I am sorry I am just so angry...
My fear is the adverse pr is going to send shivers up Kim and Eastern and peel will get what they desire.
". It's not our fault,we had no option,everyone deserted the airport". I can see the echo headlines now.."we had no option but too close". If I were klm I would get out now before their reputation is tarnished and dragged down
PEEl you are a disgrace and an affront to. Uk industry.I am sorry I am just so angry...
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Question
The latest Echo piece quotes a councillor saying he knows it costs the airport a lot of money to run security, fire etc..for these flights. This backs up the thought that the only logical reason you would do this is if it loses you money.
What I don't get is aren't you still going to need fire coverage, security and check in staff for the residual services? So, how does scrapping charter flights save cash?
Most IT flights landed on a w rotation mid afternoon. That is the time the afternoon Aberdeen service is on, so does this flight not require security and fire coverage?
Really looking forward to seeing the public face of this logic tomorrow. We know Peel enjoy spin, so they're going to have to be at their best to make this sound good.
What I don't get is aren't you still going to need fire coverage, security and check in staff for the residual services? So, how does scrapping charter flights save cash?
Most IT flights landed on a w rotation mid afternoon. That is the time the afternoon Aberdeen service is on, so does this flight not require security and fire coverage?
Really looking forward to seeing the public face of this logic tomorrow. We know Peel enjoy spin, so they're going to have to be at their best to make this sound good.
Last edited by P330; 29th Oct 2013 at 19:59.
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It appears to confirm that Thomson were pushed. That being the case, it would seem certain that the one-off charters, Jersey and Balkan will follow suit.
You might need some extra staff to service a B737 (compared to a Fokker 70), but surely not for a Dash 8 or EMB-175?
Might be worth repeating an earlier post - from the Northern Echo in early 2003 (my underlining):
Quote:
So it is clear why it was sold to Peel - promise of investment which the councils couldn't afford. It would seem a legitimate question as to was the £20m investment made and on what, and if not - why not?
Quote:
Peel Holdings are believed to have offered to pay £500,000 for 75 per cent of the shares owned by the five local authorities who own Teesside Airport. It will also contribute £100,000 towards the costs of doing the deal. The report says the cost of transferring the airport could be as high as £500,000 - meaning the authorities may end up receiving £100,000 between them. Following the sale, Hartlepool, Middlesbrough, Stockton, Redcar and Cleveland and Durham county/Darlington councils will retain a 25 per cent share in the airport, which will eventually fall to 12 per cent. A statement from the five shareholding councils said "In reality it will result in a massive investment, running into many millions of pounds over the next five years. As was made clear by the shareholders, when the choice of Peel Airports as the 'preferred bidder' to become a strategic partner in the airport was announced in January, they believe that this is the most viable option for securing the levels of investment needed for the key projects which will enable the airport to maximise its own potential - and contribute to the regeneration of the communities its serves. The interest of the shareholders in negotiating the agreement with Peel is to maximise investment in the long-term future of the airport - not to generate short-term returns for themselves."
John Williams, the leader of Darlington Borough Council, said Peel had a good track record, having already turned around the fortunes of Liverpool Airport. He said the deal was the only way forward. "Anyone who uses the airport can see that it urgently needs major investment, The £20m private sector investment will give Teesside Airport a future. Without this, it will be stuck in a cycle of decline which will eventually lead to its closure."
Councillor David Walsh, leader of Redcar and Cleveland Borough Council, and a member of airport committee, said: "In the present situation, it is the only way the airport can get in the investment that it needs to prosper and grow. It has to be a calculated risk. There was no way that the local authorities would have the money at their disposal to turn it into an airport fit for the coming decades. But we are getting £20m from Peel, who are to remodel the terminal and apron, providing more slots for aircraft, and attracting retailers into the departure lounge. This money will go hand in hand with cash from One NorthEast which is going into the infrastructure and providing better access to the airport."
Hugh Lang, airport managing director, said the Peel development would provide everything the public sector cannot fund - such as buildings and land - and provide long-term investment. "We are trying to identify areas of investment so that we can hit the ground running as soon as everything is signed." he said. A spokesman from Peel Airports said: "We totally endorse the statement of the shareholders." The company has promised to refurbish the main terminal building and construct a new parallel taxiway for aircraft serving a cargo depot. It will also work with One NorthEast to create a 400,000 sq ft business park on a 25-acre site, complete with its own access road, and has said it would be happy to offer each of the local authority shareholders a seat on the airport's board.
John Williams, the leader of Darlington Borough Council, said Peel had a good track record, having already turned around the fortunes of Liverpool Airport. He said the deal was the only way forward. "Anyone who uses the airport can see that it urgently needs major investment, The £20m private sector investment will give Teesside Airport a future. Without this, it will be stuck in a cycle of decline which will eventually lead to its closure."
Councillor David Walsh, leader of Redcar and Cleveland Borough Council, and a member of airport committee, said: "In the present situation, it is the only way the airport can get in the investment that it needs to prosper and grow. It has to be a calculated risk. There was no way that the local authorities would have the money at their disposal to turn it into an airport fit for the coming decades. But we are getting £20m from Peel, who are to remodel the terminal and apron, providing more slots for aircraft, and attracting retailers into the departure lounge. This money will go hand in hand with cash from One NorthEast which is going into the infrastructure and providing better access to the airport."
Hugh Lang, airport managing director, said the Peel development would provide everything the public sector cannot fund - such as buildings and land - and provide long-term investment. "We are trying to identify areas of investment so that we can hit the ground running as soon as everything is signed." he said. A spokesman from Peel Airports said: "We totally endorse the statement of the shareholders." The company has promised to refurbish the main terminal building and construct a new parallel taxiway for aircraft serving a cargo depot. It will also work with One NorthEast to create a 400,000 sq ft business park on a 25-acre site, complete with its own access road, and has said it would be happy to offer each of the local authority shareholders a seat on the airport's board.
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Talk to workers???
Fear the worst then NO MORE passenger flights !!
Close the airport building and then turn the terminal into another hangar to break aircraft up!!
Shame really
Fear the worst then NO MORE passenger flights !!
Close the airport building and then turn the terminal into another hangar to break aircraft up!!
Shame really
Ryanair ?
Look on the bright side...maybe Peel have made a pact with the devil and persuaded Ryanair to set up a low cost base with three aircraft ??
OOps sorry just woke up..will have to stop eating cheese before I go to bed...
OOps sorry just woke up..will have to stop eating cheese before I go to bed...
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I have said it before Peel are a land ownership company and if you look at all of there airports you will see asset stripping.....of land which is what they know how to do!! You will see a half hearted attempt to run an airport but its all about the land use!!
Still rumours of there biggest airport Liverpool struggling to make a profit!?
Still rumours of there biggest airport Liverpool struggling to make a profit!?