MANCHESTER - 7

[ManofMan]

Do you live in a vast expanse that needs clearing before the airport can operate...stands...taxiways...runways, how can they clear the snow when its falling so heavy??

Preperation my Ar$e...its simply fell too heavy too quickly, look at the Metars !!!!

EGCC 031650Z 12006KT 2000 -SN BKN008 00/00 Q1005 SNOCLO
EGCC 031620Z 13005KT 0800 R23R/1500 SN BKN004 00/00 Q1005 NOSIG
EGCC 031550Z 13003KT 1100 R23R/P1500 SN FEW002 SCT004 BKN008 00/M00 Q1006 BECMG BKN004
EGCC 031520Z 16005KT 1000 R23R/1300 SN FEW003 SCT008 BKN011 01/00 Q1006 BECMG BKN008
EGCC 031450Z 17005KT 2100 -SN SCT008 SCT012 01/00 Q1006 BECMG 1400 SN BKN008
EGCC 031420Z 17009KT 6000 -SHSN FEW014 SCT025 BKN032 02/00 Q1006 BECMG 3000 SHSN BKN010


What cant speak cant lie...bring a million staff in and you couldnt keep the place open, in order to clear the runway you need to get on it, not easily done with landing traffic...hence...SNOCLO

[MARK9263]

Tut,tut,tut...! and still the excuses flow.
I went outside when it stopped and it was about 1 INCH of snow..

[ManofMan]

I went outside when it stopped and it was about 1 INCH of snow

Thats O.K. then...cant imagine a 777 would skid very far in 1 inch of wet snow...maybee you are right, they should have stayed open...Emirates could have launched a new service from Dubai to Heald Green....cos thats where it would have come to a halt when it had finsished skidding.

Dont get me wrong...i was on here banging the drum on how poor MAN was when they used cheap de-icer before Christmas...that simply froze....but today...not the airports fault i am afraid.

[Mouser]

Has it stopped or as forecast has it turned to rain.

[MAN777]

Thats my point, MAN has TWO runways keep one swept all the time and alternate.

What is required is a fully staffed snow fleet

Last week there was just two brushes on the runway no wonder they cannot keep up.

[MUFC_fan]

Surely if snow is falling an inch in 45 minutes, then by the time one end of a runway is clear then the end that you started at would be covered again - I ain't no expert but that seems the logic to me!

I think the reason is that it has come down too fast.

You can have as many runways Dallas Fort Worth and nothing could get in!

[purplehelmet]

manofman

dubai to heald green. nice one lmao

[opnot]

mark9623
one inch of snow, braking action poor /poor/poor no landers QED

man777 how long do you pay for a fully equip snow fleet in this country. I remembered it snowed in June a afew years ago

[Mouser]

Airport flight arrivals shows EK109 landed at 19.03

[TURIN]

While the two runways are being alternately cleared, who, and with what is clearing the taxiways and stands?

Ever tried shifting a heavy jet in thick snow? You think a diversion is expensive? Try having a couple of tugs jack-knife into the fuselage taking the headset men with them! Now that is expensive.

How do you expect the bags/cargo to be offloaded when the stands are thick with snow? Highloaders are not off road vehicles. While were at it, how does an electric buggy pull a set of steps through thick snow?

True, if there was a multitude with shovels and grit you may have a chance but currently forget it.

We do not generally in this country experience the weather we have at the moment. It is not economical to man up and maintain a fleet of equipment that will be used once every other blue moon.

Accept it. It's a bit inconvenient but it's better than injuries to personnel and damaged aircraft.
Don't get me started on de-icing the aircraft!!!!

[MARK9263]

OH! And that was a problem 5/10/20/30/40 years ago?
This the first time we ever had snow ?

Stop the tow-the-line,PC,apologist nonsense..!

[Brian Fantana]

Manofman - Taxiways and airside roads should have been de-iced and swept that way they would have been able to get onto the runway - PRIOR PLANNING!! Or was there not enough man power on shift. The Bean counters not allowing overtime?? Yes there is landing traffic to dodge but it’s a winter afternoon in Feb during the worst recession to hit the airlines - hardly peak week in summer aircraft movements going on.
MAN777 - MAN has 2 runways, but the bean counters are not prepared to cover the cost of opening the second. Fire cover on the far side would have to open, extra controllers in the tower and airfield ops to carry out runway inspections.
I have experience of being stuck in the hold at Dayne with 23R blocked and having to divert with other carriers, we were not allowed to do a visual approach onto 23L, a CAVOK day too!!
MAN needs to pull its socks up sharpish but whilst bean counters are running it there is no chance! IMHO

[MAN777]

The stands and taxiways were not thick with snow, there was a very thin coating of rapidly melting slush, its perfectly safe to drive any form of airport vehicle in those conditions WITH CARE. The ground was not frozen as was the case a few weeks ago.

I understand that runways are a different matter, but once off the runway are you telling me that a slow moving airliner is going to be bothered by a bit of slush ?

I never suggested a snow fleet available all year, what i did imply was that maybe with 36 hours notice, some sort of effective team could be put together. I have worked on and off at MAN for 30 years and I dont ever recall such long closures for such small amounts of snow, also the snow clearing fleet MAN had years ago was half the size it is now and the place was kept open, what is so different ??

Hopefully this will be the last snow of the winter and MAG management can get back to running the shops !! Oh by the way dont you need flights actually on the ground at Manchester to supply the shop punters !!!

[Ringwayman]

Can anyone suggest how "an effective team" can be assembled in 36 hours? As I understand it, all would-be operatives on the apron needed to go through the appropriate channels for them to go through security processes before they gain airside passes....something that can take months. So for today's events, it means that they would have had to start that process perhaps back in November. Then MAN put them on a retainer "just in case" and in the meantime these people would have to be trusted to keep their diairies free for 3 to 6 months so that nothing could potentially clash with what may be needed once in 10 to 20 years. In the meantime we could be talking 50 people on reasonable money (let's pitch in at £5.80/hr for a 37 hour week for 20 weeks which equates to well over £4000 perperson or £200,000 in total without any overtime) for no net effect except to necessitate a rise in airport charges to reflect these extra costs which is something that most, if not all, airlines are clamouring against.

As for the shops needing flights on the ground, are you suggesting that there are no passengers already at the airport ready for the outbound sectors?

[busz]

Flew into SZG as the FO on a flight recently. It snowed while we were there, and the snow clearing team, about 8 vehicles were on and off the runway in between the departures and arrivals. You CAN keep the show on the road, but it requires investment. MAN is too busy giving dividends to the councils to invest in infrastructure at the moment however.

I used to be proud of my airport. Not anymore

[MAN777]

I didnt mean bring in outsiders, give me some credit.

Snow clearing staff come from other sections within MAG, anybody who can drive and who are suitably trained can be diverted into the role. Thats how its always been done.

I think MAN has adopted a "too hard to do" policy and basically decided not to make the effort until the last flake falls, then take your time to catch up, however long that is. Meanwhile dozens of MAN movements are scattered all over the UK, causing further knock on delays and cancellations.

Re shoppers in Terminals, Basic Retail common sense says that you get as many people as possible through the doors to spend their money. So if the airport is being run by bean counters, they are shooting themselves in the foot by being so ready to shut the runway. A few hundred delayed passengers only have a finite amount of money to spend.

[greatoaks]

Man of Man

Emirates could have launched a new service from Dubai to Heald Green....cos thats where it would have come to a halt when it had finished skidding.

Pi$$ Funny ... well done

Here's an idea for the accountants

Whilst the airport is closed run some free buses from the Trafford Centre and pack em through the new blue retail experience......£££££££'s

[TURIN]

Stop the tow-the-line,PC,apologist nonsense..!

Eh?

You CAN keep the show on the road, but it requires investment.

Now your getting it.

I understand that runways are a different matter, but once off the runway are you telling me that a slow moving airliner is going to be bothered by a bit of slush ?

No, but a static one full of fuel and load will be a bugger to shift off the gate.

[Mr A Tis]

Let us not forget either that the airlines want to pay minimum fees ( or in Ryanair's case-no fees at all) to use the airport facilities.
Its not just the airport beencounters, but the airlines are as much to blame, under the "ryanairisation" of the industry.

[Betablockeruk]

Let us not forget either that the airlines want to pay minimum fees ( or in Ryanair's case-no fees at all) to use the airport facilities.

and yet PIK (Ryanir base) is currently taking most of GLA diverted traffic.

Looks like if you got hit by this band of snow then snoclo was inevitable.