LEEDS 5
Join Date: Nov 2006
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Talking about 777s at LBA, if anyone remembers the GE90 rollback issue some years ago EK and others were using the aircraft fitted with those engines at full takeoff thrust for a short period.
Forget LBA, a 773ER could have used London City. They were leaping in the air when not using the systems to derate them based on payload and available concrete.
PIA have some bog standard 777s and also the 772LR with the big GE90s so if their scheduling permits then a 772LR would be the ideal plane for the job. Plenty of thrust and reverser action available to compensate for LBA's short runway. The aircraft uses runway if it's available, but when it isn't then they have considerable flexibility to crank up the power. These two frames (BGY and BGZ) regularly turn up on less taxing duty such as the PK701/2 at MAN so slotting them into LBA may be possible if the pavement loading isn't a problem.
Forget LBA, a 773ER could have used London City. They were leaping in the air when not using the systems to derate them based on payload and available concrete.
PIA have some bog standard 777s and also the 772LR with the big GE90s so if their scheduling permits then a 772LR would be the ideal plane for the job. Plenty of thrust and reverser action available to compensate for LBA's short runway. The aircraft uses runway if it's available, but when it isn't then they have considerable flexibility to crank up the power. These two frames (BGY and BGZ) regularly turn up on less taxing duty such as the PK701/2 at MAN so slotting them into LBA may be possible if the pavement loading isn't a problem.
Join Date: Jan 2004
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Forget LBA, a 773ER could have used London City. They were leaping in the air when not using the systems to derate them based on payload and available concrete
A point I made weeks ago flying about half full range of fuel to ISB.
The take off distance for these variants is less than the 733.
I assume runway strength is the same as in the past so 744's no problem.
A point I made weeks ago flying about half full range of fuel to ISB.
The take off distance for these variants is less than the 733.
I assume runway strength is the same as in the past so 744's no problem.
Join Date: Feb 2002
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Runway strength is certainly not an issue the runway is concrete PCN 61R/A/W/T whilst the loading isn't the highest it is Rigid (R) and its sub sructure is the strongest (A) also it's rated for maximum tyre pressure allowed (W) and has been evaluated by Technical evaluation (T).As a comparison Birmingham is PCN 63 F/B/W/T Manston is PCN 53 F/C/W/T. If I remember correctly before the 747 could operate the then Runway 28 was dug up (an asphalt runway) to strengthen the pavement to allow the 747 to taxy through Bravo to the apron.
The only problem I can see is where they would park the beast without disrupting other larger ac movements. If it used one of the airbridges then it would probably preclude ac taxying behind it.
The only problem I can see is where they would park the beast without disrupting other larger ac movements. If it used one of the airbridges then it would probably preclude ac taxying behind it.
Join Date: Feb 2002
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51/R/B/W/T
Granted it is from an old document, as were the Birmingham and Manston figures, could you please explain how the strength and sub surface has changed or is this a reassessment of the requirements?
Thanks
Granted it is from an old document, as were the Birmingham and Manston figures, could you please explain how the strength and sub surface has changed or is this a reassessment of the requirements?
Thanks
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could you please explain how the strength and sub surface has changed
The PCN number is assessed as 51, ie it is lower than it used to be so is less capable of sustaining aircraft of higher weights.
The Sub-grade strength category: Has changed from A where
A High strength: characterized by K150 Nm/m3 1 and respresenting all K values above 120 Nm/m3 for rigid pavements, and by CBR2 = 15 and representing all CBR values above 13 for flexible pavements.
to B where
B Medium strength: characterized by K80 Nm/m3 and representing a range in K of 60 to 120 Nm/m3 for rigid pavements, and by CBR = 10 and representing a range in CBR of 8 to 13 for flexible pavements.
A look at the Boeing data for a B777-200LR;
MaxTOW of 348,358Kg on a B runway, a PCN of 82 is needed.
MinTOW of 145,150Kg on a B runway, a PCN of 23 is needed.
So as long as the aircraft isn't anywhere near MaxTOW then the runway is sufficient! [Edit - a further look at the Boeing data reveals that with a PCN of 51 Rigid B runway - the MaxTOW avail on a 777-20LR is approx 290,000Kg]
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It does seem a little unusual how the runway can become less strong than before.....the only reason i could see a downgrade in surface condition and strenght is if the runway is heavily cracked or subsiding, the runway surface wont have warn down that far (will it) it will be a superior type of concrete than they use on the roads......Me thinks this is too confusing for me!!!!
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GWOWB
Backtrack32 - see previous posts. Aircraft required an engine change and declared serviceable this afternoon. Will be positioning empty back to Plymouth this eve. LBIA Just for info its a Dash-8-311 and not a Q200 - none of the WOW fleet are Q series as they don't have the cabin noise supression system fitted not that that made any difference anyway.
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Harrogate
On a slight tangent, I think a 'modest' and well timed service to the capital would still be viable.
National Express have been making a phenomenal pigs ear of the train service since they took over from GNER (who rather hastily gave the franchise up, remember - and then regretted it massively).
I used to think these inter-city train operators were all much of a muchness, but National Express are truly, truly awful. Terrible service, terrible cleanliness, terrible catering - I see so, so many pissed off people on the London trains from Leeds these days. It really is a horrible experience, and I'm not particularly fussy. The decline since GNER gave up the franchise has been striking.
But then I hear National Express have already been stripped of the franchise and it looks likely that Virgin will get it. Think what you like about Virgin companies, but Virgin Trains have got to be better than the current shower of ****. I've been on Virgin Trains a few times and it's always been fine - far better than National Express.
I know my lady's colleagues at the DoH (and the DWP for that matter) would gladly utilise a London air service if it was cost effective enough for them to justify. The onward European connections were especially handy for them prior to the budget cutbacks which prevented them from using the plane in most cases.
On a slight tangent, I think a 'modest' and well timed service to the capital would still be viable.
National Express have been making a phenomenal pigs ear of the train service since they took over from GNER (who rather hastily gave the franchise up, remember - and then regretted it massively).
I used to think these inter-city train operators were all much of a muchness, but National Express are truly, truly awful. Terrible service, terrible cleanliness, terrible catering - I see so, so many pissed off people on the London trains from Leeds these days. It really is a horrible experience, and I'm not particularly fussy. The decline since GNER gave up the franchise has been striking.
But then I hear National Express have already been stripped of the franchise and it looks likely that Virgin will get it. Think what you like about Virgin companies, but Virgin Trains have got to be better than the current shower of ****. I've been on Virgin Trains a few times and it's always been fine - far better than National Express.
I know my lady's colleagues at the DoH (and the DWP for that matter) would gladly utilise a London air service if it was cost effective enough for them to justify. The onward European connections were especially handy for them prior to the budget cutbacks which prevented them from using the plane in most cases.
MMENCLLBAMAN
National Express (from Leeds)
Arrive 20 minutes before train and grab coffee in pleasant First Class Lounge.
Join clean train, take seat with water, biscuits and real cup ready for coffee.
Switch on laptop and treat train as office.
Decide slightly hungry and walk to restaurant where pleasant food served by pleasant people (albeit expensive)
Realise by Stevenage have done more work on train than would have done in office decide to pick up paper and catch up on world affairs.
Pull into Kings Cross, leave train refreshed.
Possible drawbacks: No seat (I always reserve as book far enough in advance to get cheaper tickets) or possible delays (IMHO much less now with NXEC than under GNER - maybe due to their very fair Delay Repay policy)
National Express (from Leeds)
Arrive 20 minutes before train and grab coffee in pleasant First Class Lounge.
Join clean train, take seat with water, biscuits and real cup ready for coffee.
Switch on laptop and treat train as office.
Decide slightly hungry and walk to restaurant where pleasant food served by pleasant people (albeit expensive)
Realise by Stevenage have done more work on train than would have done in office decide to pick up paper and catch up on world affairs.
Pull into Kings Cross, leave train refreshed.
Possible drawbacks: No seat (I always reserve as book far enough in advance to get cheaper tickets) or possible delays (IMHO much less now with NXEC than under GNER - maybe due to their very fair Delay Repay policy)
BBC NEWS | Business | National Express loses rail route
Despite what MMENCLLBAMAN said there back in Feb, it's been patently obvious to anyone who uses the east coast mainline service regularly that National Express have been killing it slowly. They gave up on it months ago. It's now a shocking customer experience, and they're actually managing to lose passenger numbers at a time when pretty much every other mainline train operator grows them.
The down-side of all of this for Flybe is that a decent train operator will get hold of the franchise now, who'll run it properly and so kill off the LBA - London air connection forever.
Bring back GNER.
OK, so Virgin may not get the franchise (or they may), but anyone will be better than National Express. Anyone thinking the National Express service was anything like acceptable needs to calibrate their expectations, because they're way off the mark.
Flybe Fills the National Express Void
01 July 2009
Flybe, Europe’s largest regional airline, today reported record sales on its new air service from Yorkshire to London.
In direct contrast to the chaos on the rail network, which today saw the government take the East Coast rail service into public ownership, Flybe sold more tickets on June 30th than on any other day since the route was announced in April.
Commenting on the strong sales, Mike Rutter, Flybe’s Chief Commercial Officer said:
“The demand for tickets on Flybe’s new service from Leeds Bradford to London Gatwick has exceeded all expectations. Flybe came to the rescue when BMI walked away from their Leeds to London air service and now it seems we are coming to the rescue of more and more Yorkshire travellers who have lost faith with the railways. Transport links for the UK’s regional economies are crucial and Flybe is proud to provide convenient, affordable and reliable services for Yorkshire and London alike.”
01 July 2009
Flybe, Europe’s largest regional airline, today reported record sales on its new air service from Yorkshire to London.
In direct contrast to the chaos on the rail network, which today saw the government take the East Coast rail service into public ownership, Flybe sold more tickets on June 30th than on any other day since the route was announced in April.
Commenting on the strong sales, Mike Rutter, Flybe’s Chief Commercial Officer said:
“The demand for tickets on Flybe’s new service from Leeds Bradford to London Gatwick has exceeded all expectations. Flybe came to the rescue when BMI walked away from their Leeds to London air service and now it seems we are coming to the rescue of more and more Yorkshire travellers who have lost faith with the railways. Transport links for the UK’s regional economies are crucial and Flybe is proud to provide convenient, affordable and reliable services for Yorkshire and London alike.”
Join Date: Apr 2009
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PIA 777
Rumour has it that PIA are to start B-777 ops back end of October, the turning D at 32 is the same as islamabad so no problems there
Join Date: May 2005
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PIA 777
If this turns out to be true,is it likely to be 777 200 series,or 777 300 series?
Just noticed from lbia website,last nights flight arrived 1 1/2 hours late but departed 6 hours late at 2AM.What was the reason for this lengthy delay anybody?.
Just noticed from lbia website,last nights flight arrived 1 1/2 hours late but departed 6 hours late at 2AM.What was the reason for this lengthy delay anybody?.
Last edited by lbalad; 14th Jul 2009 at 05:39. Reason: add further question