MD80 plane crash in Phuket, Sep. 07
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OG cabin crew
On another topic...1-2go employees have still not received a dime since the airline was grounded. Several F/A's are in the process of trying to sue in order to gain a payout of 30,000 to 60,000 baht ($1000-2000).
Also, 1-2 go employees have been asked to return their cabin crew manuals for the MD's, bags, uniforms and anything with the 1-2 go logo. Anyone who can read Thai might want to take a look at www.crewza.com) It would seem Udom has no intention of restarting OG although it appears he wants to keep OX going.
I really feel for OG cabin crew who did their best for the airline despite being treated terribly, made to ignore their legalities (hours etc). The service training they received was of high standard. I have met a few ex OX cabin crew here in DXB at EK.
Also, 1-2 go employees have been asked to return their cabin crew manuals for the MD's, bags, uniforms and anything with the 1-2 go logo. Anyone who can read Thai might want to take a look at www.crewza.com) It would seem Udom has no intention of restarting OG although it appears he wants to keep OX going.
I really feel for OG cabin crew who did their best for the airline despite being treated terribly, made to ignore their legalities (hours etc). The service training they received was of high standard. I have met a few ex OX cabin crew here in DXB at EK.
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memorial annoucement
Phuket Gazette - online English newspaper for Phuket, Thailand, with daily news, classified ads, yellow pages, business listings, upcoming events, event calendar, phuket events
Phuket Gazette's memorial announcement says OTG staff are helping with the memorial. To the best of my knowledge, this is a misquote by the Phuket Gazette.
-- Certainly any and all OTG staff are welcome and invited --
Phuket Gazette's memorial announcement says OTG staff are helping with the memorial. To the best of my knowledge, this is a misquote by the Phuket Gazette.
-- Certainly any and all OTG staff are welcome and invited --
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One-Two-Go Grounded Until October
From The Phuket Gazette:
PHUKET: Controversial low-cost carrier One-Two-Go will remain grounded until at least October, but its owner is certain the airline will eventually resume services.
Udom Tantiprasongchai, founder and chairman of One-Two-Go, told the Gazette this week he was confident the airline will resume its Phuket service.
“We have done everything we have to do. It is now up to us to decide when we resume flying,” he said.
Mr Udom admitted that the resumption of services would “honestly not happen this month” and would come in October at the earliest.
One-Two-Go initially grounded its fleet of eight McDonnell Douglas MD-80 jet aircraft citing financial conditions and the need to restructure.
It was subsequently grounded by the Thailand Department Of Civil Aviation (DCA) for allegedly breaching safety regulations, having a lack of proper airline management and for falsification of documents by some pilots who had misrepresented their credentials.
The government suspension, to August 21, was subsequently extended by the DCA to September 20.
One-Two-Go’s self-imposed termination of services had been set to conclude next Monday, but neither deadline will be met, Mr Udom said.
Recent political unrest including the two-day closure of Phuket International Airport (PIA) by anti-government protesters and a subsequent drop in demand were among the reasons the airline is not yet ready to resume flights to Phuket, he said.
Mr Udom said he had received many emails urging the airline to resume flying.
Another obstacle to restarting service was that some staff had left to do other jobs, he said.
However, Mr Udom pledged to “come back again, stronger and with better quality.”
Meanwhile, inquiries with Nok Air to confirm it is continuing with its weekend Phuket-Bangkok flights were unsuccessful, though staff at the carrier’s booking table recently told Gazette staff that no weekend flights were available. Many Nok Air staff, including some in Phuket, lost their jobs when the airline ceased local operations.
Nok Air initially suspended all flights to Phuket but, subsequently, starting on August 9, resumed Saturday and Sunday flights.
Phuket therefore continues to suffer from a lack of airline capacity with only Thai Airways International, Thai AirAsia and Bangkok Airways servicing the island from other domestic bases.
Report by Gazette aviation columnist Alastair Carthew.
Udom Tantiprasongchai, founder and chairman of One-Two-Go, told the Gazette this week he was confident the airline will resume its Phuket service.
“We have done everything we have to do. It is now up to us to decide when we resume flying,” he said.
Mr Udom admitted that the resumption of services would “honestly not happen this month” and would come in October at the earliest.
One-Two-Go initially grounded its fleet of eight McDonnell Douglas MD-80 jet aircraft citing financial conditions and the need to restructure.
It was subsequently grounded by the Thailand Department Of Civil Aviation (DCA) for allegedly breaching safety regulations, having a lack of proper airline management and for falsification of documents by some pilots who had misrepresented their credentials.
The government suspension, to August 21, was subsequently extended by the DCA to September 20.
One-Two-Go’s self-imposed termination of services had been set to conclude next Monday, but neither deadline will be met, Mr Udom said.
Recent political unrest including the two-day closure of Phuket International Airport (PIA) by anti-government protesters and a subsequent drop in demand were among the reasons the airline is not yet ready to resume flights to Phuket, he said.
Mr Udom said he had received many emails urging the airline to resume flying.
Another obstacle to restarting service was that some staff had left to do other jobs, he said.
However, Mr Udom pledged to “come back again, stronger and with better quality.”
Meanwhile, inquiries with Nok Air to confirm it is continuing with its weekend Phuket-Bangkok flights were unsuccessful, though staff at the carrier’s booking table recently told Gazette staff that no weekend flights were available. Many Nok Air staff, including some in Phuket, lost their jobs when the airline ceased local operations.
Nok Air initially suspended all flights to Phuket but, subsequently, starting on August 9, resumed Saturday and Sunday flights.
Phuket therefore continues to suffer from a lack of airline capacity with only Thai Airways International, Thai AirAsia and Bangkok Airways servicing the island from other domestic bases.
Report by Gazette aviation columnist Alastair Carthew.
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BKKFLY
You are dead right. During the UN Peackeeper charters, Udom always had the Flight Attendants on the aircraft for up to 3 or 4 days. When you get back on board the aircraft, they look totally shagged out. OX claimed there were no FTLs for the Flight Attendants but the document was eventually found at the DCA showing them the same as for Flight Crew. At that time OX was found stupid in that way and they had to remove the F/As on the Seoul trips and give them rest up there. So understand that neither the DCA or OX ever monitors this and that is where Udom finds the cheaper way to fly their aircraft. It is all bull**** and some authority has to ban OX from ever flying anywhere.
You are dead right. During the UN Peackeeper charters, Udom always had the Flight Attendants on the aircraft for up to 3 or 4 days. When you get back on board the aircraft, they look totally shagged out. OX claimed there were no FTLs for the Flight Attendants but the document was eventually found at the DCA showing them the same as for Flight Crew. At that time OX was found stupid in that way and they had to remove the F/As on the Seoul trips and give them rest up there. So understand that neither the DCA or OX ever monitors this and that is where Udom finds the cheaper way to fly their aircraft. It is all bull**** and some authority has to ban OX from ever flying anywhere.
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Udom FoS
Yes, this is a misquote
“One-Two-Go staff will be arranging the monks for the ceremony,” Ms Sweet said.
I said in the telephone interview I would arrange for Monks to conduct a service but I didn't know where they were coming from cause I hadn't arranged it yet ." Maybe 1-2 go staff would LIKE to help and arrange for that.."
I've received no reply to email to staff web site
Memorial is to be held base of runway 9 on the beach , off airport property 3 - 6 PM ( 15:00 - 18:00 )
Park and enter from the south west boundry outside airport.
And that quote from Udom is so BS
"My choice when to fly...."
I loved how the article contradicts him,
DCA grounded 'till Sept 20 th
And Forever After ....
“One-Two-Go staff will be arranging the monks for the ceremony,” Ms Sweet said.
I said in the telephone interview I would arrange for Monks to conduct a service but I didn't know where they were coming from cause I hadn't arranged it yet ." Maybe 1-2 go staff would LIKE to help and arrange for that.."
I've received no reply to email to staff web site
Memorial is to be held base of runway 9 on the beach , off airport property 3 - 6 PM ( 15:00 - 18:00 )
Park and enter from the south west boundry outside airport.
And that quote from Udom is so BS
"My choice when to fly...."
I loved how the article contradicts him,
DCA grounded 'till Sept 20 th
And Forever After ....
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Mr Udom said he had received many emails urging the airline to resume flying.
So don't expect any major changes to happen not until the government of Thailand is not anymore US friendly and only than Thailand will be downgraded.
Them's the facts, like it or not.
Udom seems to have everyone in his hip pocket.
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Rescue/Recovery video
We were given a video of the rescue - really a recovery - many months ago. The families have seen it in private.
The 1 year anniversary seems like a responsible time to make this video more public.
See the InvestigateUdom.com Video and Image site. Select the "recovery video" link.
Due to size limitations the video is in 3 parts.
If you are able to attend the memorial for the victims today, please do. If not, we appreciate your positive thoughts.
The 1 year anniversary seems like a responsible time to make this video more public.
See the InvestigateUdom.com Video and Image site. Select the "recovery video" link.
Due to size limitations the video is in 3 parts.
If you are able to attend the memorial for the victims today, please do. If not, we appreciate your positive thoughts.
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411A, any recruitment for 747 pilots relates to the OX operations not 1-2 go which only had a fleet of old MD 80's.
All OG crew were required to return their ID's, manuals, cabin bags...basically anything with the 1-2 go logo. I really don't think 1-2 go will be relaunched. If Udom does do something he will surely do it under another name.
When the airline was first grounded do you remember the report in the BKK post in which Udom was quoted as saying he had investors from HK and SIN who were interested in investing in a new full service carrier to compete with TG.
I wonder if there was any ground to that or just more Udom pie in the sky?
All OG crew were required to return their ID's, manuals, cabin bags...basically anything with the 1-2 go logo. I really don't think 1-2 go will be relaunched. If Udom does do something he will surely do it under another name.
When the airline was first grounded do you remember the report in the BKK post in which Udom was quoted as saying he had investors from HK and SIN who were interested in investing in a new full service carrier to compete with TG.
I wonder if there was any ground to that or just more Udom pie in the sky?
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Entire Thai Airline Industry Stinks
The entire industry is rife with incompetence.
From InvestigateUdom.com summary of discoveries.
http://www.investigateudom.com/files/DCA_Summary.pdf
I thik this deserves a new thread ..
From InvestigateUdom.com summary of discoveries.
http://www.investigateudom.com/files/DCA_Summary.pdf
I thik this deserves a new thread ..
<<<<<<<A Summary of the Information Provided to the FAA on Thai-based Aviation
In our efforts for a proper investigation and accountability into the crash of Orient Thai’s
One-Two–Go OG269, we have received documents, photographs, and crew allegations demonstrating improper behavior of various Thai airlines and of Thailand’s civil aviation
authority, the DCA.
The evidence and allegations make it clear that prior to, during, and after the crash of OG269, the Thai DCA knew or should have known that Thai airlines were continually compromising safety. While much of the evidence suggests outright corruption and incompetence, even taken in the best possible light, DCA oversight of Thai aviation is inexcusably lax.
Information we received came from pilots and personnel working for Orient Thai Airlines, One-Two-Go Airlines, SkyStar Airways and Phuket Air. The vast majority of this information was known or could have been easily discovered by the DCA, including:
1. Airlines regularly falsify check rides. In one case, XXX informed DCA Deputy Director- General Vitichai [sometimes spelled Wittichai] of 4 fraudulent check rides taking place in December 2007. No action was taken by the DCA upon XXX’s notification. Nor was any
action taken after we made the material public. The DCA finally took some action just prior to the FAA’s recent visit. No management was every censored.
2. We have very credible testimony from pilots who learn of passing sim checks they have never taken.
3. We have very credible testimony of pilots who are not qualified for the aircraft they fly.
4. The airlines regularly require their pilots to fly in excess of the maximum legal limits
(110 hours a month in Thailand) and ICAO (100 hours a month) with full knowledge of
the DCA.
In an effort to show oversight in hindsight, the DCA recently ordered the pilots to
produce historic flight summaries for the FAA. Out of fear of being the scapegoats for
the excessive hours, some of the pilots refused to provide such paperwork.
5. The airlines regularly conduct maintenance malpractice.
A. Severe problems that have been “squawked” (made known by the pilots to
maintenance personnel) are often reported by maintenance personnel to have
cleared up or been remedied, only to reappear for the flight crew.
B. Inspections are frequently done on paper only.
C. Heavily documented cases where improper maintenance and illegal flights nearly
lead to catastrophes include:
One-Two–Go OG269, we have received documents, photographs, and crew allegations demonstrating improper behavior of various Thai airlines and of Thailand’s civil aviation
authority, the DCA.
The evidence and allegations make it clear that prior to, during, and after the crash of OG269, the Thai DCA knew or should have known that Thai airlines were continually compromising safety. While much of the evidence suggests outright corruption and incompetence, even taken in the best possible light, DCA oversight of Thai aviation is inexcusably lax.
Information we received came from pilots and personnel working for Orient Thai Airlines, One-Two-Go Airlines, SkyStar Airways and Phuket Air. The vast majority of this information was known or could have been easily discovered by the DCA, including:
1. Airlines regularly falsify check rides. In one case, XXX informed DCA Deputy Director- General Vitichai [sometimes spelled Wittichai] of 4 fraudulent check rides taking place in December 2007. No action was taken by the DCA upon XXX’s notification. Nor was any
action taken after we made the material public. The DCA finally took some action just prior to the FAA’s recent visit. No management was every censored.
2. We have very credible testimony from pilots who learn of passing sim checks they have never taken.
3. We have very credible testimony of pilots who are not qualified for the aircraft they fly.
4. The airlines regularly require their pilots to fly in excess of the maximum legal limits
(110 hours a month in Thailand) and ICAO (100 hours a month) with full knowledge of
the DCA.
In an effort to show oversight in hindsight, the DCA recently ordered the pilots to
produce historic flight summaries for the FAA. Out of fear of being the scapegoats for
the excessive hours, some of the pilots refused to provide such paperwork.
5. The airlines regularly conduct maintenance malpractice.
A. Severe problems that have been “squawked” (made known by the pilots to
maintenance personnel) are often reported by maintenance personnel to have
cleared up or been remedied, only to reappear for the flight crew.
B. Inspections are frequently done on paper only.
C. Heavily documented cases where improper maintenance and illegal flights nearly
lead to catastrophes include:
•
At Orient Thai, a serious issue with a left engine thrust reverser on a
747 was ignored. One western-trained pilot resigned due to the airline’s
refusal to stop flying the aircraft. The thrust reverser sleeve eventually
separated from the aircraft – in mid air. The aircraft could have lost a
wing but fortunately did not.
747 was ignored. One western-trained pilot resigned due to the airline’s
refusal to stop flying the aircraft. The thrust reverser sleeve eventually
separated from the aircraft – in mid air. The aircraft could have lost a
wing but fortunately did not.
•
Phuket Air needed to ferry an aircraft from Saudi Arabia to Jakarta for
an engine change. In order to legally fly the aircraft, the engine that
required replacement needed to be deemed serviceable. Papers were
signed and it was suddenly “serviceable”. Unfortunately, the engine
came apart during take-off, dumping engine parts including the entire
turbine for miles. The DCA had just 4 days previously audited Phuket
Air’s maintenance department. [There are publicly available pictures of
the separated turbine resting in the parking lot of a Saudi hotel.]
an engine change. In order to legally fly the aircraft, the engine that
required replacement needed to be deemed serviceable. Papers were
signed and it was suddenly “serviceable”. Unfortunately, the engine
came apart during take-off, dumping engine parts including the entire
turbine for miles. The DCA had just 4 days previously audited Phuket
Air’s maintenance department. [There are publicly available pictures of
the separated turbine resting in the parking lot of a Saudi hotel.]
•
Three weeks after the first attempt to fly the Phuket Air 747, Phuket Air
violated numerous crew, maintenance and civil regulations and the
terms of their insurance why the flew the 3 engine 747 to Jakarta. Both
flight events were highly public and the sequence of events could not
reasonably have been unknown to the DCA.
6. At the time of the crash of OG269, Orient Thai had no training manuals, no safety
manual and no safety program all of which must be monitored by the DCA.
7. The airlines regularly operate in violation of the Minimum Equipment List (MEL). For
some airlines, the MEL is only a copy of the Master Minimum Equipment List (MMEL).
Both are gross violations of ICAO standards and very unsafe.
8. At least one airline regularly flies overweight because of an inability of the staff to
properly track and convert weights between metric and English systems.
9. A lack of clear boundaries between the airlines and the DCA both creates opportunities
for corruption and makes it clear that the DCA is aware of Thai airline violations of safe
procedures:
A. The DCA runs a program in which a DCA agent works in the DCA office for 5 days
a week and then flies 2 days a week with their assigned airline. The airline pays
the DCA agent’s salary for the days spent at the airline. Besides conflict of
interest based on the payment and responsibilities of the DCA agent, these DCA
agents are themselves exceeding duty time by working 7 days a week.
[A few days before the FAA’s recent trip to Thailand, the DCA altered the
program to 1 flying day per week for agents.]
violated numerous crew, maintenance and civil regulations and the
terms of their insurance why the flew the 3 engine 747 to Jakarta. Both
flight events were highly public and the sequence of events could not
reasonably have been unknown to the DCA.
6. At the time of the crash of OG269, Orient Thai had no training manuals, no safety
manual and no safety program all of which must be monitored by the DCA.
7. The airlines regularly operate in violation of the Minimum Equipment List (MEL). For
some airlines, the MEL is only a copy of the Master Minimum Equipment List (MMEL).
Both are gross violations of ICAO standards and very unsafe.
8. At least one airline regularly flies overweight because of an inability of the staff to
properly track and convert weights between metric and English systems.
9. A lack of clear boundaries between the airlines and the DCA both creates opportunities
for corruption and makes it clear that the DCA is aware of Thai airline violations of safe
procedures:
A. The DCA runs a program in which a DCA agent works in the DCA office for 5 days
a week and then flies 2 days a week with their assigned airline. The airline pays
the DCA agent’s salary for the days spent at the airline. Besides conflict of
interest based on the payment and responsibilities of the DCA agent, these DCA
agents are themselves exceeding duty time by working 7 days a week.
[A few days before the FAA’s recent trip to Thailand, the DCA altered the
program to 1 flying day per week for agents.]
•
DCA agent Praphon is assigned to Orient Thai’s One-Two-Go fleet. As a
working pilot there, Agent Praphon is aware of and complicit in the
airline’s violations of ICAO and legal standards, including fraudulent and
frequently non-existent training and re-currency programs, lack of
required manuals and training program, and excessive flight and duty
hours and maintenance fraud.
1. Proof of these frauds by Orient Thai are publicly available and have
been given to the FAA.
2. Several pilots allege Agent Phraphon regularly extorts Thai First
Officers to pay for prostitutes on the Chaing Mai route.
B. DCA Deputy Director-General Vitichai and Orient Thai and One-Two-Go CEO
Udom Tantiprasongchai are “golf buddies”. Their relationship and its particulars
have led to credible allegations that the DCA overlooks Orient Thai and One-Two-
Go infractions and that DCA Deputy Director-General Vitichai protects Mr.
Tantiprasongchai’s interests. There are credible allegations of bribery, including
allegations from witnesses to such bribery.
working pilot there, Agent Praphon is aware of and complicit in the
airline’s violations of ICAO and legal standards, including fraudulent and
frequently non-existent training and re-currency programs, lack of
required manuals and training program, and excessive flight and duty
hours and maintenance fraud.
1. Proof of these frauds by Orient Thai are publicly available and have
been given to the FAA.
2. Several pilots allege Agent Phraphon regularly extorts Thai First
Officers to pay for prostitutes on the Chaing Mai route.
B. DCA Deputy Director-General Vitichai and Orient Thai and One-Two-Go CEO
Udom Tantiprasongchai are “golf buddies”. Their relationship and its particulars
have led to credible allegations that the DCA overlooks Orient Thai and One-Two-
Go infractions and that DCA Deputy Director-General Vitichai protects Mr.
Tantiprasongchai’s interests. There are credible allegations of bribery, including
allegations from witnesses to such bribery.
•
In one well-known incident, a scheduled 747 flight was delayed by the
Flight Engineer because the landing pilot had overheated the brakes.
Rather than tolerate the delay, the pilot physically removed the flight
engineer’s bags from the aircraft and departed – with passengers – but
without the Flight Engineer. The incident was widely known and was
documented by the Flight Engineer. The DCA took no action.
Flight Engineer because the landing pilot had overheated the brakes.
Rather than tolerate the delay, the pilot physically removed the flight
engineer’s bags from the aircraft and departed – with passengers – but
without the Flight Engineer. The incident was widely known and was
documented by the Flight Engineer. The DCA took no action.
•
DCA Deputy Director-General Vitichai admitted on camera that Orient
Thai’s One-Two-Go pilots were vastly over hours in the crash of OG269.
He further acknowledged that Orient Thai Airlines had provided crash
investigators, including the NTSB, with fraudulent flight hour
information. However, he never notified the NTSB of the fraud, even
though lead investigator Jill Andrews of the NTSB ghost wrote the crash
investigation report for the DCA.
[In February 2008, we informed Ms. Andrews of the fraud. In May, we
provided her with the true rosters. In June, Ms. Andrews completed the
crash report. The DCA has not released that report.]
Thai’s One-Two-Go pilots were vastly over hours in the crash of OG269.
He further acknowledged that Orient Thai Airlines had provided crash
investigators, including the NTSB, with fraudulent flight hour
information. However, he never notified the NTSB of the fraud, even
though lead investigator Jill Andrews of the NTSB ghost wrote the crash
investigation report for the DCA.
[In February 2008, we informed Ms. Andrews of the fraud. In May, we
provided her with the true rosters. In June, Ms. Andrews completed the
crash report. The DCA has not released that report.]
•
In February 2008, long after he had the OG269 black box information
and proof of excessive flight hours, knowledge of an improper training
program and lack of a safety program at Orient Thai and One-Two-Go,
DCA Deputy Director-General Vitichai told the press, “No punishment will
be imposed on any agency or personnel after completion of the
investigation [into the crash of OG269] because the accident was
beyond control.”
[The immediate cause of the crash was flight crew error during a bad
weather landing. One pilot appears to have been incapacitated and the
other to have panicked. The root causes of the crash are shown here.]
A Category 1/Acceptable rating would require the FAA to conclude that the DCA licenses and
oversees air carriers in accordance with ICAO aviation safety standards. It seems
reasonable to expect Thailand could only achieve a Category 1/Acceptable rating after:
and proof of excessive flight hours, knowledge of an improper training
program and lack of a safety program at Orient Thai and One-Two-Go,
DCA Deputy Director-General Vitichai told the press, “No punishment will
be imposed on any agency or personnel after completion of the
investigation [into the crash of OG269] because the accident was
beyond control.”
[The immediate cause of the crash was flight crew error during a bad
weather landing. One pilot appears to have been incapacitated and the
other to have panicked. The root causes of the crash are shown here.]
A Category 1/Acceptable rating would require the FAA to conclude that the DCA licenses and
oversees air carriers in accordance with ICAO aviation safety standards. It seems
reasonable to expect Thailand could only achieve a Category 1/Acceptable rating after:
The DCA decertifies every airline that provided it with fraudulent information.
The DCA dismisses every manager and agent who accepted such obviously fraudulent
information.
information.
A newly reconstituted DCA shows an ability and willingness to competently oversee Thai
civil aviation.
If the FAA does not find Thailand in compliance with the ICAO standards, then the FAA must
demote Thailand’s ranking to Category 2/Conditional or to Delisted/Unacceptable.
It is difficult to understand how the FAA itself could be performing appropriate oversight and
have provisionally concluded that the DCA performs oversight in accordance with ICAO
standards.
civil aviation.
If the FAA does not find Thailand in compliance with the ICAO standards, then the FAA must
demote Thailand’s ranking to Category 2/Conditional or to Delisted/Unacceptable.
It is difficult to understand how the FAA itself could be performing appropriate oversight and
have provisionally concluded that the DCA performs oversight in accordance with ICAO
standards.
N4790P
Entire Thai Airline Industry Stinks
The entire industry is rife with incompetence.
You do NOT know the entire Thai Aviation Industry. You are fully justified to attack the rubbish but you cannot and should not keep on generalising .
As someone who is certified by the Thai DCA (and JAA) I object to being called incompetent.
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A couple of pictures from the protest in front of the Thai embassy in Paris. Look for Sept 16, 2008.
We should have photos from the small memorial in Phuket soon.
Many thanks to those of you who attended.
We should have photos from the small memorial in Phuket soon.
Many thanks to those of you who attended.
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@InvestigateUdom
I salut you buddy for what you have done and you'll continue to do! Airlines like that should be stopped from operating not only in the interest of the passengers but also in the interest of us "drivers".
Good work and keep it up!
I salut you buddy for what you have done and you'll continue to do! Airlines like that should be stopped from operating not only in the interest of the passengers but also in the interest of us "drivers".
Good work and keep it up!
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ZFT
I think the point of the thread is that that is a questionable credential.
But there's no question of competency there, and you have every right to object to being labeled incompetent.
There are many competent and safety-minded professionals in Thailand, in the pilot community, AOC's, maintenance, AeroThai, and even in DCA itself. I know a few myself.
What's being discussed here is whether the DCA's practices are sufficient to reassure the masses of non-professionals that depend on it's actions, that DCA is sufficiently exercising its oversight authority to ensure passenger safety, free of political influence and corruption.
Clearly, based on repeated deficiency in some of the carriers they regulate, and the ensuant loss of lives, they have come up short in that regard. Worse, as an organization, they continue to deny or simply bury existing problems, and show no inclination to improve.
InvestigateUdom believes, and quite reasonably, that the most effective way of changing these problems for the better revolves around lobbying her own government for withholding or withdrawing the coveted "1" status of an IASA audit.
Unfortunately for you, and the other competent professionals in Thai aviation, that method does paint the entire industry with a broad brush. There's no escaping that when the regulating authority is considered the source of or complicit in safety deficiencies.
Yes, there are competent operators here who have passed their IOSA audits. As did Garuda in Indonesia, which is still barred from Europe, based on Indonesian DCA's deficiency. Their measure for appeal, like your own complaint about the unfairness of the generalizations, is that they have proven competencies to authorities much more reliable than the DCA.
Is that not, in fact, an admission that withholding or withdrawing the certification granted to all of the nation's aviation industry on the basis of DCA compliance, is justified? That the DCA does not do its job competently, and that you should be judged, individually, by a higher authority?
As someone who is certified by the Thai DCA
and JAA I object to being called incompetent.
There are many competent and safety-minded professionals in Thailand, in the pilot community, AOC's, maintenance, AeroThai, and even in DCA itself. I know a few myself.
What's being discussed here is whether the DCA's practices are sufficient to reassure the masses of non-professionals that depend on it's actions, that DCA is sufficiently exercising its oversight authority to ensure passenger safety, free of political influence and corruption.
Clearly, based on repeated deficiency in some of the carriers they regulate, and the ensuant loss of lives, they have come up short in that regard. Worse, as an organization, they continue to deny or simply bury existing problems, and show no inclination to improve.
InvestigateUdom believes, and quite reasonably, that the most effective way of changing these problems for the better revolves around lobbying her own government for withholding or withdrawing the coveted "1" status of an IASA audit.
Unfortunately for you, and the other competent professionals in Thai aviation, that method does paint the entire industry with a broad brush. There's no escaping that when the regulating authority is considered the source of or complicit in safety deficiencies.
Yes, there are competent operators here who have passed their IOSA audits. As did Garuda in Indonesia, which is still barred from Europe, based on Indonesian DCA's deficiency. Their measure for appeal, like your own complaint about the unfairness of the generalizations, is that they have proven competencies to authorities much more reliable than the DCA.
Is that not, in fact, an admission that withholding or withdrawing the certification granted to all of the nation's aviation industry on the basis of DCA compliance, is justified? That the DCA does not do its job competently, and that you should be judged, individually, by a higher authority?
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The Memorial Service For The One-Two-Go Victims
Mai Khao beach, Phuket, Tuesday September 16th 2008
The plane wreckage is still under tarpaulin between the airport and the beach:
The memorial service:
Two of the wreaths were from the US Embassy and Phuket Airport Hotel:
An additional service was performed after the monks had left:
The reading of the names of the victims:
Interviews with Phuket Gazette TV and NBT TV:
The spirit house and wreaths are at the location of the tsunami memorial:
Videos:
Phuket Gazette TV
NBT
The plane wreckage is still under tarpaulin between the airport and the beach:
The memorial service:
Two of the wreaths were from the US Embassy and Phuket Airport Hotel:
An additional service was performed after the monks had left:
The reading of the names of the victims:
Interviews with Phuket Gazette TV and NBT TV:
The spirit house and wreaths are at the location of the tsunami memorial:
Videos:
Phuket Gazette TV
NBT
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Leave Montri Alone
Investigateudom.com, You Are A Fcuken Wancar.leave Poor Montri Alone.he Was A Decent Person And Pilot.i Know, .....i Hired Him At Ox, And Was Very Impressed With His Intelligence.he Died As A Result Of.......in This Order......poor Weather At Phuket, Handled Poorly By His Pic, Due To Poor Skills Displayed By Arief, Due To Poor Training And Oversight By His Employer, Due To Poor Oversight By The Thai Dca, Due To ................actions Taken By The Owner Udom, Due To Poor Control Exercised By The Govt Of Thailand , Due To No One Else Could Give A Damn As Long As There Was No Crash Etc Etc Etc......please Give Me An Email Address And I Will Identify Myself To You And Will Meet Up At A Suitable Location, But The Beer Is On You.shame On You.
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PiratePete
I agree with everything you said (aside from me being a Fcuken Wancar). In fact, I said it before you. See my post regarding Montri.
I'm unclear what anyone thinks I am saying about Monti. My brief summary of the pilots in the aircraft is "Arief was incapacitated and Montri was not competent." Surely you don't disagree? OG 269 and Orient Thai Airlines in all its many forms is a total and absolute failure of Thai oversight and wonton and willful disregard by Udom Tantiprasongchai.
I will gladly buy you a beer. My email address is [email protected].
I'm unclear what anyone thinks I am saying about Monti. My brief summary of the pilots in the aircraft is "Arief was incapacitated and Montri was not competent." Surely you don't disagree? OG 269 and Orient Thai Airlines in all its many forms is a total and absolute failure of Thai oversight and wonton and willful disregard by Udom Tantiprasongchai.
I will gladly buy you a beer. My email address is [email protected].
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competence
montri was as competent as could be expected of a pilot with his experience level, he had low hours, and it is standard industry practice to carry an additional, qualified and experienced, safety pilot , or covering first officer with a much higher experience level in the jump seat to land the plane if the PIC becomes incapacitated, and to watch what is going on to stop anything unsafe developing.To my knowledge, OX never did this, and this is another one of their failings.Everyone does this except OX, to save crew numbers thus money.A covering FO would likely have avoided this crash.Pete.