BRISTOL - 4
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787
From what I hear the 787 will have no problems reaching Florida and the Caribbean from BRS.
I'm guessing the above would be in charter config, so based on QR carrying less passengers and DOH being closer than the likes of Florida, would the 787 work?
I'm guessing the above would be in charter config, so based on QR carrying less passengers and DOH being closer than the likes of Florida, would the 787 work?
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I’m not aware of any recent definitive statement concerning the B 787’s and A 350’s ability to operate from BRS.
There has been a lot of discussion on local and national aviation message boards about the subject for a while now, possibly for two reasons: the first is that in 2010 the Thomson MD stated that BRS would be amongst the first airports to operate the TOM B 787 but in the event that has not happened; the second is that a few months after the MD’s statement a TOM B 767 experienced a hard landing at BRS leading to structural damage to the airframe with the subsequent AAIB report highlighting, inter alia, a disproportionate number of hard landings with B 767s on runway 09.
Some believe that Thomson is no longer prepared to use its 787s at BRS but the absence of the type at BRS might equally be the result of commercial considerations as much as operational ones, although it does seem certain that anything larger than a B 767 could not use the full length parallel taxiway because the wings would overhang a fence next to a public road. The airport proposes turning circles and back tracking to overcome this problem.
The first two issues of the BRS master plan published following the government's 2003 White Paper on civil aviation, and both are about a decade old, stated that Boeing had indicated the B 787 would be able to reach Cape Town or western America from the existing runway, later illustrated as a distance in excess of 9,000 kilometres. I realise that early assessments of capability don’t always translate into reality when new aircraft types are finally delivered, and I believe that early 787s were overweight, but with Doha less than 5,500 kilometres from Bristol Boeing must have made a considerably over optimistic prediction with the information they initially provided if even 5,500 kilometres are out of range.
Having no technical qualifications in this subject whatsoever I cannot venture any worthwhile opinion on this particular aspect.
Given that Qatar apparently wants to increase its BHX presence I’m a bit surprised that south west England is in the airline's sights at present. BHX is reasonably convenient for many West Country travellers when it comes to long haul and BHX is increasing its portfolio across a number of airlines.
The other point to bear in mind if Qatar, or any other airline, is looking at the Middle East (or other long haul) from the West Country/South Wales is the APD situation. If Wales gains this power and reduces it to nil, as the Wales Assembly Government has suggested is in its mind, then long haul could become an attractive proposition for airlines deciding on BRS or CWL. The Westminster government’s various proposals for mitigating the effects on English airports of APD devolution to Scotland and Wales would seem to offer little or nothing in BRS’s case, and some might not be legal under EU legislation anyway.
Put simply I believe that if it was a straightforward issue of BRS or CWL for such a route as Qatar then the former’s position serving a larger and wealthier primary catchment, as well as a larger secondary catchment in the further south west and M4 corridor, would carry the day.
However, if operational and/or government taxation policies intrude the issue is much less clear.
There has been a lot of discussion on local and national aviation message boards about the subject for a while now, possibly for two reasons: the first is that in 2010 the Thomson MD stated that BRS would be amongst the first airports to operate the TOM B 787 but in the event that has not happened; the second is that a few months after the MD’s statement a TOM B 767 experienced a hard landing at BRS leading to structural damage to the airframe with the subsequent AAIB report highlighting, inter alia, a disproportionate number of hard landings with B 767s on runway 09.
Some believe that Thomson is no longer prepared to use its 787s at BRS but the absence of the type at BRS might equally be the result of commercial considerations as much as operational ones, although it does seem certain that anything larger than a B 767 could not use the full length parallel taxiway because the wings would overhang a fence next to a public road. The airport proposes turning circles and back tracking to overcome this problem.
The first two issues of the BRS master plan published following the government's 2003 White Paper on civil aviation, and both are about a decade old, stated that Boeing had indicated the B 787 would be able to reach Cape Town or western America from the existing runway, later illustrated as a distance in excess of 9,000 kilometres. I realise that early assessments of capability don’t always translate into reality when new aircraft types are finally delivered, and I believe that early 787s were overweight, but with Doha less than 5,500 kilometres from Bristol Boeing must have made a considerably over optimistic prediction with the information they initially provided if even 5,500 kilometres are out of range.
Having no technical qualifications in this subject whatsoever I cannot venture any worthwhile opinion on this particular aspect.
Given that Qatar apparently wants to increase its BHX presence I’m a bit surprised that south west England is in the airline's sights at present. BHX is reasonably convenient for many West Country travellers when it comes to long haul and BHX is increasing its portfolio across a number of airlines.
The other point to bear in mind if Qatar, or any other airline, is looking at the Middle East (or other long haul) from the West Country/South Wales is the APD situation. If Wales gains this power and reduces it to nil, as the Wales Assembly Government has suggested is in its mind, then long haul could become an attractive proposition for airlines deciding on BRS or CWL. The Westminster government’s various proposals for mitigating the effects on English airports of APD devolution to Scotland and Wales would seem to offer little or nothing in BRS’s case, and some might not be legal under EU legislation anyway.
Put simply I believe that if it was a straightforward issue of BRS or CWL for such a route as Qatar then the former’s position serving a larger and wealthier primary catchment, as well as a larger secondary catchment in the further south west and M4 corridor, would carry the day.
However, if operational and/or government taxation policies intrude the issue is much less clear.
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QR
[Given that Qatar apparently wants to increase its BHX presence]
"Wants to increase" is an understatement.
QR have jumped in with both feet with a daily 787 and an additional flight on Saturdays-commencing April 16
Insider rumours also state EK are to introduce their 2 class A380 on their midday flight.
I see some tasty prices coming up.
SS
ps I still have to drive down the M5 for my Easyjet/Ryanair flights
"Wants to increase" is an understatement.
QR have jumped in with both feet with a daily 787 and an additional flight on Saturdays-commencing April 16
Insider rumours also state EK are to introduce their 2 class A380 on their midday flight.
I see some tasty prices coming up.
SS
ps I still have to drive down the M5 for my Easyjet/Ryanair flights
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I surmise that there are no plans near or mid- term for 787 services. If there were, I would envisage BRS would be in the process of modifying the existing airport infrastructure (taxiways, stands, etc) to support such operations.
Commercially, BRS is probably attractive to 2-3 of 787 operators (TOM, QR, EK), but operationally I think BRS struggles.
Commercially, BRS is probably attractive to 2-3 of 787 operators (TOM, QR, EK), but operationally I think BRS struggles.
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APD
Understood that airlines don't like LH tags or 3 legged routes but..
BRS/CWL are so close together and IF APD is devolved a routing of DOH/BRS/CWL/DOH would give QR or whoever a 2 way benefit.
Larger / wealthier catchment area of BRS coupled with the better
operational capability of CWL.
Think I'm correct in stating that APD is payable on departures not arrivals though quite how that would work out for departing BRS pax - not too sure.
BRS/CWL are so close together and IF APD is devolved a routing of DOH/BRS/CWL/DOH would give QR or whoever a 2 way benefit.
Larger / wealthier catchment area of BRS coupled with the better
operational capability of CWL.
Think I'm correct in stating that APD is payable on departures not arrivals though quite how that would work out for departing BRS pax - not too sure.
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I surmise that there are no plans near or mid- term for 787 services. If there were, I would envisage BRS would be in the process of modifying the existing airport infrastructure (taxiways, stands, etc) to support such operations.
Commercially, BRS is probably attractive to 2-3 of 787 operators (TOM, QR, EK), but operationally I think BRS struggles.
Commercially, BRS is probably attractive to 2-3 of 787 operators (TOM, QR, EK), but operationally I think BRS struggles.
This has apparently recently appeared in the EAD info for BRS:
(g) B787 available taxi routes:
Departure Runway 09:
Taxiway Z to Taxiway G, enter Runway at GX.
Runway 27:
Taxiway Z to Taxiway A, enter Runway at AX.
Departure Runway 09:
Taxiway Z to Taxiway G, enter Runway at GX.
Runway 27:
Taxiway Z to Taxiway A, enter Runway at AX.
Brunel to Concorde
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Long haul APD considerations
Understood that airlines don't like LH tags or 3 legged routes but..
BRS/CWL are so close together and IF APD is devolved a routing of DOH/BRS/CWL/DOH would give QR or whoever a 2 way benefit.
Larger / wealthier catchment area of BRS coupled with the better
operational capability of CWL.
Think I'm correct in stating that APD is payable on departures not arrivals though quite how that would work out for departing BRS pax - not too sure.
BRS/CWL are so close together and IF APD is devolved a routing of DOH/BRS/CWL/DOH would give QR or whoever a 2 way benefit.
Larger / wealthier catchment area of BRS coupled with the better
operational capability of CWL.
Think I'm correct in stating that APD is payable on departures not arrivals though quite how that would work out for departing BRS pax - not too sure.
Even if Wales had reduced APD to nil for flights departing the Principality a BRS-CWL-DOH would attract the APD rate in place for English airports for the entire journey in respect of those departing from BRS, ie long haul rate, as would a CWL/BRS/DOH for those departing from BRS.
So if Wales had secured devolved APD and reduced it to nil and the UK government maintained the present rate for English airports (currently £71 economy, £142 premium - rising to £73/£146 next April, although under 16s will be exempt from next March) the difference would be significant.
Many years ago airlines did operate CWL/BRS/ANOTHER or BRS/CWL/ANOTHER (both scheduled and charter) but this hasn't occurred much in the past 20 years.
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Even if Wales had reduced APD to nil for flights departing the Principality a BRS-CWL-DOH would attract the APD rate in place for English airports for the entire journey in respect of those departing from BRS, ie long haul rate, as would a CWL/BRS/DOH for those departing from BRS.
So if Wales had secured devolved APD and reduced it to nil and the UK government maintained the present rate for English airports (currently £71 economy, £142 premium - rising to £73/£146 next April, although under 16s will be exempt from next March) the difference would be significant.
Many years ago airlines did operate CWL/BRS/ANOTHER or BRS/CWL/ANOTHER (both scheduled and charter) but this hasn't occurred much in the past 20 years.
So if Wales had secured devolved APD and reduced it to nil and the UK government maintained the present rate for English airports (currently £71 economy, £142 premium - rising to £73/£146 next April, although under 16s will be exempt from next March) the difference would be significant.
Many years ago airlines did operate CWL/BRS/ANOTHER or BRS/CWL/ANOTHER (both scheduled and charter) but this hasn't occurred much in the past 20 years.
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New link to the textual data for the B787 is
EGGD / BRS Textual Data
Scroll to page 9 and all the info is there
previous link appears to be broken now
hope this helps
Regards
Speedbird
EGGD / BRS Textual Data
Scroll to page 9 and all the info is there
previous link appears to be broken now
hope this helps
Regards
Speedbird
Brunel to Concorde
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B 787
The taxi routes in this document for the B 787 use the parallel taxiway for its entire length both entering and leaving the runway.
It's not clear what has changed from the time when the BRS master plan stated that the 787 would be too wide for the parallel taxiway (wings would overhang a fence next to a pubic road) and suggested that turning circles would be constructed as an interim measure, with a longer term goal of moving the public road (Winters Lane) to the north, something that would doubtless have been met with howls of protest from all sorts of groups and individuals.
It does seem then that one potential operational impediment no longer applies unless someone with expert knowledge corrects me.
It's not clear what has changed from the time when the BRS master plan stated that the 787 would be too wide for the parallel taxiway (wings would overhang a fence next to a pubic road) and suggested that turning circles would be constructed as an interim measure, with a longer term goal of moving the public road (Winters Lane) to the north, something that would doubtless have been met with howls of protest from all sorts of groups and individuals.
It does seem then that one potential operational impediment no longer applies unless someone with expert knowledge corrects me.
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Not totally sure but wasn't the land at the North side of the taxiway sold in the early 90's to the golf club on the proviso that if any of it was required by the airport for development it would come back under airport ownership, obviously for a fee of course
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WOW Air - Icelandic Low Cost Carrier
Although nothing has been announced from the airport yet, if you take a look on the WOW Air website it is showing Bristol as a new destination from May 2016.
The flights look as if they leave Bristol at 12:00 on Monday, Wednesday and Friday to Reykjavik (Keflavik) with onward connections to Boston, Montreal, Toronto and Washington (Baltimore).
They're showing flights to Reykjavik (Keflavik) from £39 and to Boston for £99 one way!!
It will only be WOW's second destination in the UK, the first one being London Gatwick.
This is an excellent addition to the BRS network, especially as it gives great low cost connections to the USA and Canada, with more destinations over the Atlantic to come.... the below was taken from the ch-aviation website from the 4th November.
The flights look as if they leave Bristol at 12:00 on Monday, Wednesday and Friday to Reykjavik (Keflavik) with onward connections to Boston, Montreal, Toronto and Washington (Baltimore).
They're showing flights to Reykjavik (Keflavik) from £39 and to Boston for £99 one way!!
It will only be WOW's second destination in the UK, the first one being London Gatwick.
This is an excellent addition to the BRS network, especially as it gives great low cost connections to the USA and Canada, with more destinations over the Atlantic to come.... the below was taken from the ch-aviation website from the 4th November.
WOW air (WW, Reykjavik Keflavik) has announced plans to source its first widebody aircraft needed for the upcoming launch of flights to the US West Coast.
Using three A330-300s, the Icelandic LCC plans to serve Los Angeles Int'l (4x weekly) and San Francisco, CA (5x weekly) from its Reykjavik Keflavik hub beginning summer of next year. The A330s will be configured with 340 seats in a single-class layout.
WOW air currently operates a fleet of three A320-200s and two A321-200 (sl)s on flights to both mainland Europe as well as Boston and Baltimore Thurgood Marshall in the United States. Toronto Pearson and Montréal Trudeau are expected to launch in May 2016.
Using three A330-300s, the Icelandic LCC plans to serve Los Angeles Int'l (4x weekly) and San Francisco, CA (5x weekly) from its Reykjavik Keflavik hub beginning summer of next year. The A330s will be configured with 340 seats in a single-class layout.
WOW air currently operates a fleet of three A320-200s and two A321-200 (sl)s on flights to both mainland Europe as well as Boston and Baltimore Thurgood Marshall in the United States. Toronto Pearson and Montréal Trudeau are expected to launch in May 2016.
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3 weekly fights from 13th May with A320
Bristol gains one-stop low-cost transatlantic connection following WOW air arrival :: Routesonline
Bristol gains one-stop low-cost transatlantic connection following WOW air arrival :: Routesonline
Brunel to Concorde
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Keflavik
I found it surprising that easyJet decided to stop Keflavik next April. The route began in December 2013 and the first year carried more passengers than easyJet's publicly stated prediction before the route began.
2015 is the second full year and CAA stats show that the route is well up on 2014 in terms of passenger numbers albeit September and October saw significant drops compared with those months in 2014. Fares have never looked that cheap either.
easyJet operated at 3 x weekly last winter but 2 x weekly in the summer. I was expecting them to return in winter 16/17. Whether they will now remains to be seen.
Accepting that easyJet has been the main driver of BRS's success over the past decade it's always a good thing to have more airlines. Relying on one major customer is never wise in any industry if it can be avoided.
Another plus is that WOW will arrive at 1010 and depart at 1100 which is a quieter period at BRS where the terminal can become uncomfortably crowded at times, although the recent terminal expansion and current further terminal expansion work ought to go a long to dealing with this.
Perhaps the one minus point is that WOW is not well known to local travellers so publicity will have to be good, something that BRS usually excels in when it comes to supporting its airlines.
2015 is the second full year and CAA stats show that the route is well up on 2014 in terms of passenger numbers albeit September and October saw significant drops compared with those months in 2014. Fares have never looked that cheap either.
easyJet operated at 3 x weekly last winter but 2 x weekly in the summer. I was expecting them to return in winter 16/17. Whether they will now remains to be seen.
Accepting that easyJet has been the main driver of BRS's success over the past decade it's always a good thing to have more airlines. Relying on one major customer is never wise in any industry if it can be avoided.
Another plus is that WOW will arrive at 1010 and depart at 1100 which is a quieter period at BRS where the terminal can become uncomfortably crowded at times, although the recent terminal expansion and current further terminal expansion work ought to go a long to dealing with this.
Perhaps the one minus point is that WOW is not well known to local travellers so publicity will have to be good, something that BRS usually excels in when it comes to supporting its airlines.
Last edited by MerchantVenturer; 24th Nov 2015 at 19:28. Reason: typo
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Keflavik
Does it possibly point to the traffic on the route originating mainly from Iceland rather then the Bristol end of things?
It would make sense if you look at it from that mindset perhaps...
MH.
It would make sense if you look at it from that mindset perhaps...
MH.
Brunel to Concorde
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Keflavik
That might be a reason. It could also be to do with transatlantic connections or simply availability of aircraft I suppose.
Incidentally, it does seem that easyJet intends to return to the BRS-KEF route next winter after dropping it from next April. The linked report (below) says that winter passenger numbers rose considerably but summer saw almost no growth.
Whether they will have that re-think now that WOW has arrived remains to be seen. If they don't and resume at this winter's schedule 6 x weekly across both airlines seems a lot of seats to fill, even with some transatlantic onward connectivity.
The passenger numbers in the report for January-August are incorrect according to CAA stats with twice the number flying than shown in the report.
easyJet reduces Iceland-Bristol to winter only - Iceland Monitor
Remaining with easyJet, Catania has re-appeared in the booking system for next summer, again at 2 x weekly but commencing slightly later in early June.
Of matters generally at BRS, the CEO hinted in the recent consultative committee minutes that further growth can be anticipated in 2016.
Incidentally, it does seem that easyJet intends to return to the BRS-KEF route next winter after dropping it from next April. The linked report (below) says that winter passenger numbers rose considerably but summer saw almost no growth.
Whether they will have that re-think now that WOW has arrived remains to be seen. If they don't and resume at this winter's schedule 6 x weekly across both airlines seems a lot of seats to fill, even with some transatlantic onward connectivity.
The passenger numbers in the report for January-August are incorrect according to CAA stats with twice the number flying than shown in the report.
easyJet reduces Iceland-Bristol to winter only - Iceland Monitor
Remaining with easyJet, Catania has re-appeared in the booking system for next summer, again at 2 x weekly but commencing slightly later in early June.
Of matters generally at BRS, the CEO hinted in the recent consultative committee minutes that further growth can be anticipated in 2016.
Brunel to Concorde
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bmi regional
BRS to FRA, MUC, CDG, ABZ, DUS and HAM are now all bookable through next summer. Until today only the first three were bookable beyond March. Frequencies don't seem to have reduced.
Of the routes flown this year only MXP and NTE are missing from next summer's booking engine (NTE has disappeared from the drop-down destination list). Given that easyJet is to commences a 2 x weekly Nantes summer service from next March, it's no surprise that bmir's route won't be brought back (as seems the case).
easyJet flew daily from BRS to MXP until the recession took hold against a daily Ryanair Bergamo. Ryanair now operates just 3 x weekly to BGY in summer only. With a 13th based aircraft for next summer it does seem that more work will have to be found to utilise it fully.
The airline has already announced that Venice Marco Polo will return from next March (it too was dropped during the recession) against Ryanair's Treviso and today easyJet has announced a new Glasgow-Malpensa route. So it would not require a huge leap of faith to believe that MXP would be a strong contender if easyJet intends introducing more routes from BRS for next year.
Of the routes flown this year only MXP and NTE are missing from next summer's booking engine (NTE has disappeared from the drop-down destination list). Given that easyJet is to commences a 2 x weekly Nantes summer service from next March, it's no surprise that bmir's route won't be brought back (as seems the case).
easyJet flew daily from BRS to MXP until the recession took hold against a daily Ryanair Bergamo. Ryanair now operates just 3 x weekly to BGY in summer only. With a 13th based aircraft for next summer it does seem that more work will have to be found to utilise it fully.
The airline has already announced that Venice Marco Polo will return from next March (it too was dropped during the recession) against Ryanair's Treviso and today easyJet has announced a new Glasgow-Malpensa route. So it would not require a huge leap of faith to believe that MXP would be a strong contender if easyJet intends introducing more routes from BRS for next year.
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KLM at BRS
KLM has updated its schedules and during July and August the evening rotation to AMS has been upgraded from the usual E190 and is now showing as a 737.
Below is the summary:
from 01 Jan 2016 - 21 Feb 2016 - 20x weekly flights (20x E190) - (2,000 seats a week)
from 22 Feb 2016 - 26 Mar 2016 - 26x weekly flights (26x E190) - (2,600 seats a week)
from 27 Mar 2016 - 03 Jul 2016 - 28x weekly flights (28x E190) - (2,800 seats a week)
from 04 Jul 2016 - 28 Aug 2016 - 28x weekly flights (21x E190 / 7x B737-700) - (3,094 seats a week)
from 29 Aug 2016 - 31 Oct 2016 - 28x weekly flights (28x E190) - (2,800 seats a week)
Below is the summary:
from 01 Jan 2016 - 21 Feb 2016 - 20x weekly flights (20x E190) - (2,000 seats a week)
from 22 Feb 2016 - 26 Mar 2016 - 26x weekly flights (26x E190) - (2,600 seats a week)
from 27 Mar 2016 - 03 Jul 2016 - 28x weekly flights (28x E190) - (2,800 seats a week)
from 04 Jul 2016 - 28 Aug 2016 - 28x weekly flights (21x E190 / 7x B737-700) - (3,094 seats a week)
from 29 Aug 2016 - 31 Oct 2016 - 28x weekly flights (28x E190) - (2,800 seats a week)
Brunel to Concorde
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Going forward
The eastern extension to the terminal building was officially opened today by The Princess Royal. There was an item on the local telly news that also featured airport CEO, Robert Sinclair.
He was talking about reaching 10 mppa which is the limit currently set by the airport's planning consents after which, he said, they would be looking to go beyond that.
That would involve another battle with environmentalists and fellow travellers without doubt, but at least the current leader of North Somerset Council, in whose area the airport sits, appeared to be supportive when he was interviewed in the same news story.
The 12-month figure up to the end of November is 6,741,123, up 6.8% on a year ago (CAA stats), so 6,750,000 should be exceeded in the calendar year. November itself at 412,084 was up 10.2% on November 2014.
It will still take a few years to get to around 10 mppa and that assumes there are no nasty shocks along the way waiting to jump out.
He was talking about reaching 10 mppa which is the limit currently set by the airport's planning consents after which, he said, they would be looking to go beyond that.
That would involve another battle with environmentalists and fellow travellers without doubt, but at least the current leader of North Somerset Council, in whose area the airport sits, appeared to be supportive when he was interviewed in the same news story.
The 12-month figure up to the end of November is 6,741,123, up 6.8% on a year ago (CAA stats), so 6,750,000 should be exceeded in the calendar year. November itself at 412,084 was up 10.2% on November 2014.
It will still take a few years to get to around 10 mppa and that assumes there are no nasty shocks along the way waiting to jump out.