Aurigny Air Services
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so the point im making is that BA have things in place at JER, the LGW crews nightstop at JER
they have ground handling, lounge, check-in etc all in place
all they would need would be the LCY slots, and also if BE do exit the JER-LON route, demand I would of thought would be there
cs
they have ground handling, lounge, check-in etc all in place
all they would need would be the LCY slots, and also if BE do exit the JER-LON route, demand I would of thought would be there
cs
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Blue Islands are already on LCY-JER, I suspect an ERJ-170 might be a little too much aircraft for the Channel Islands from LCY, as they pulled the jet from IOM in favour of a leased Saab 2000 from Eastern. (additional cost I would have thought!)
Aurigny may be a good fit for GCI-LCY but I suspect it would indeed need to be at the expense of Gatters who are now doing a LHR and becoming size queens and still shafting a long standing customer like flybe. Airports can sometimes do damaging things in their own interests, LCY lost a NCL link with T3 as the cost of operating a J41 was made prohibitive by the airport operator.
Aurigny may be a good fit for GCI-LCY but I suspect it would indeed need to be at the expense of Gatters who are now doing a LHR and becoming size queens and still shafting a long standing customer like flybe. Airports can sometimes do damaging things in their own interests, LCY lost a NCL link with T3 as the cost of operating a J41 was made prohibitive by the airport operator.
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Also LCY have a policy of pricing to push out smaller capacity as well. How about the following idea. Aurigny could replace the 72 with a 170/195 using the existing slots to increase capacity maybe add one or two further rotations. This may give them better reliability. Or will we see BI try there hand on LGW.
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I think at 68 seats, the ATR72 is ok for LCY management - the E170 does not offer a lot more capacity and LCY is still full of 50 seaters. What LCY wants to get rid of is the 30seater stuff like the Jetstream 41 or Dornier 328 (which is of course still around).
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You lot seem to think if you want slots you get them.
The slot will effect the loads.
Having pish slots will just mean you run empty aircraft how ever nice they are be it J41 or a EJet.
Unless they can get decent slots the route just won't work.
I could actually see the Airbus trans-atlantic BA route working from jersey The first crew getting it to ireland from jersey via city then the second getting it across the pond.
But what do I know I am only a pilot.
The slot will effect the loads.
Having pish slots will just mean you run empty aircraft how ever nice they are be it J41 or a EJet.
Unless they can get decent slots the route just won't work.
I could actually see the Airbus trans-atlantic BA route working from jersey The first crew getting it to ireland from jersey via city then the second getting it across the pond.
But what do I know I am only a pilot.
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But what do I know I am only a pilot.
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I could actually see the Airbus trans-atlantic BA route working from jersey The first crew getting it to ireland from jersey via city then the second getting it across the pond.
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Don't know if the price is right it might work. Also as well as its departing from Jersey you wouldn't have to pay any departure tax which is a fair wack for a biz class seat from the UK trans-atlantic more than paying to go with BCI retrun to Jersey. Would have the advantage of clearing customs in Ireland.
Depends on the banks I am sure if a few of them got together and had set days they wanted to go with it maybe possible. Depends how many of them currently use it but position in.
A Shannon link might work as well on certain days of the week during the summer again dodging the UK departure tax and clearing customs/immigration before departing.
Depends on the banks I am sure if a few of them got together and had set days they wanted to go with it maybe possible. Depends how many of them currently use it but position in.
A Shannon link might work as well on certain days of the week during the summer again dodging the UK departure tax and clearing customs/immigration before departing.
Last edited by mad_jock; 18th May 2013 at 16:08.
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Although this is now totally irrelevant to Aurginy I will give this a go. There are a lot of problems with your proposition and hence why people see it as fantasy!
- The customer will still be liable to pay APD even as a connecting passenger. This would be equal according to HMRC to £137
- With your suggestion have you considered the crew do not start their duty in LCY? They start their duty in LHR as they are mainline crew, therefore operate the equivalent of two sectors to Shannon (LHR-LCY-SNN). Your suggestion would only work if the crew had another overnight in JER...ie. LHR-LCY-JER (o/n) JER-LCY-SNN (o/n) SNN-JFK (o/n) - JFK-LCY-LHR. To overnight another crew in JER for such a marginal route is lunacy. Let alone the flight duty limitations headache.
- Aircraft maintenance. One A318 lands at 10, departs at 4...so i'm guessing we are going to squeeze in a JER rotation inbetween much needeed maintenance, cleaning etc?
- Weather...are BA going to put at risk their flag ship route by operating the aircraft first to an airport known for diversions and been shut for days on end. How will the highly paying pax get to JFK if your ac is stuck diverting from JER. Remember they only have 2xA318, both are used on a weekday.
I honestly think you are looking at a very limited market. Look at the airlines over the years that have pulled off JER-LCY while using cheap, high density seated props. To run a 40 odd seater jet....crazy...let alone to connect to JFK...good luck
Maybe it's time to get back to Aurigny....
- The customer will still be liable to pay APD even as a connecting passenger. This would be equal according to HMRC to £137
- With your suggestion have you considered the crew do not start their duty in LCY? They start their duty in LHR as they are mainline crew, therefore operate the equivalent of two sectors to Shannon (LHR-LCY-SNN). Your suggestion would only work if the crew had another overnight in JER...ie. LHR-LCY-JER (o/n) JER-LCY-SNN (o/n) SNN-JFK (o/n) - JFK-LCY-LHR. To overnight another crew in JER for such a marginal route is lunacy. Let alone the flight duty limitations headache.
- Aircraft maintenance. One A318 lands at 10, departs at 4...so i'm guessing we are going to squeeze in a JER rotation inbetween much needeed maintenance, cleaning etc?
- Weather...are BA going to put at risk their flag ship route by operating the aircraft first to an airport known for diversions and been shut for days on end. How will the highly paying pax get to JFK if your ac is stuck diverting from JER. Remember they only have 2xA318, both are used on a weekday.
I honestly think you are looking at a very limited market. Look at the airlines over the years that have pulled off JER-LCY while using cheap, high density seated props. To run a 40 odd seater jet....crazy...let alone to connect to JFK...good luck
Maybe it's time to get back to Aurigny....
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Whats the latest thinking down there (sensible not crazie NY plans) to deal with the lGW prob. Up here on Fraggle we dont own an airline and our politicians havent a clue. Are GR going to buy bigger planes or just more slots?
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I see Aurigny is now officially looking for a CEO.
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Actually it's not as stupid as it sounds. A friend of mine was involved a few years ago in offering JER-USA via STN. The market as it existed at the time with BA offering JER-LGW ground transfer to LHR and onwards to the States was huge. However, the difference is that the LCY USA service is a high revenue premium product and it is unlikely that there is sufficient demand for such a high quality and expensive service out of the islands.
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Aurigny
It would seem that some of you think it rather poor that over the last few years GR has run at a loss.
Please remember the following points:
GR HAVE TO fly some routes at a loss as they are the state airline owned by the people of Guernsey to serve Guernsey ALL YEAR ROUND! not just the summer.
GR are EXTREMELY UNDERFUNDED, and very understaffed. With so few planes and so many costs it would be hard to show a profit unless everything went their way. Managers often have to make reactionary decisions which can have a bad effect on many things. Also we must consider the economic conditions lately have been dire.
The States of Guernsey expect to make a loss on the island bus service of about £1m pa and this is something much bigger we are talking about!
Flybe have tried for years to buy, slur, beat GR with no success and this is largely due to the people who work for GR and better more consistent service. Flybe have bled customers to GR for years and even putting on a jet did not reverse this and that is the real reason for them pulling out.
So how about showing them some respect?
Please remember the following points:
GR HAVE TO fly some routes at a loss as they are the state airline owned by the people of Guernsey to serve Guernsey ALL YEAR ROUND! not just the summer.
GR are EXTREMELY UNDERFUNDED, and very understaffed. With so few planes and so many costs it would be hard to show a profit unless everything went their way. Managers often have to make reactionary decisions which can have a bad effect on many things. Also we must consider the economic conditions lately have been dire.
The States of Guernsey expect to make a loss on the island bus service of about £1m pa and this is something much bigger we are talking about!
Flybe have tried for years to buy, slur, beat GR with no success and this is largely due to the people who work for GR and better more consistent service. Flybe have bled customers to GR for years and even putting on a jet did not reverse this and that is the real reason for them pulling out.
So how about showing them some respect?
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I used to run an airline before retirement and know how tough it is, whatever else you say about Aurigny they have survived for more years than hundreds of their competitors and all credit for that.
Many years since I flew with them but such airlines are what our aviation heritage is created from so the best of luck for the future and when you start flying to Newquay Aurigny, let me know, I will round up a few passengers!!
Many years since I flew with them but such airlines are what our aviation heritage is created from so the best of luck for the future and when you start flying to Newquay Aurigny, let me know, I will round up a few passengers!!
Last edited by GROUNDHOG; 30th May 2013 at 19:20.