DUNDEE
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A Dundee business chief has leapt to the defence of Dundee Airport after Flybe pulled its popular route to Amsterdam.
Flybe blamed the landscape around the city and said “enhanced radar coverage is required” for the company to carry on operating the service.
Flybe blamed the landscape around the city and said “enhanced radar coverage is required” for the company to carry on operating the service.
“Services have been run out of Dundee for decades so it’s absolute nonsense citing this radar thing as an issue and Flybe should give people the real reason they’ve stopped the route.
“I think somebody at Flybe needs to set the record straight — this is nothing to do with the council or the airport.
“I think somebody at Flybe needs to set the record straight — this is nothing to do with the council or the airport.
When Mr van der Kuyl’s comments were put to Flybe, the airline said it would be making no further comment, and referred the Tele to its previous statement. The company insists it will look at opportunities to operate out of Dundee in the future.
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Picking up some of Porrohman's observations about the Cat C ILS procedure, an aircraft flying the outbound leg at 180 knots and initiating the base turn immediately on reaching D8 would remain clear of the Perth ATZ and therefore of much of its traffic - especially if it is being flown, as is more often the case, in a westerly wind that will blow the aircraft east as it flies round the base turn.
Leuchars' radar coverage of the western parts of the procedure at 2200ft is not bad, but it doesn't see much at 1000ft below and to the west of the procedure, where quite a lot of Perth traffic could be.
But I suspect the real issue with the radar coverage is not how much Leuchars can see, but the fact that it's provided from Leuchars and not Dundee. Once an inbound is transferred to Dundee the radar service ceases, and if the inbound is then doing the full procedure from the DND, any traffic info they might have been given by Leuchars immediately before handover will be old hat by the time they're flying the base turn close to Perth.
But looking at the incidents to Flybe Dash 8s this summer, I suspect they might have been driven by - as others have suggested here - crew inexperience with dealing with a non-radar visual circuit with lots of light aircraft. On one occasion the Dash reported turning base, having been advised he was No.3 to 2 light aircraft, and filed an MOR after Tower told him to extend to allow the light aircraft in.
If Dundee has a future as a commercial airport and future operations require radar, the best solution would be a joint deal with the MoD to position a radar serving both Leuchars and Dundee on the high ground behind Tayport/Newport. The Leuchars radar isn't being replaced under the NATS/Thales ATC contract for MoD airfields so there's scope for a joint purchase.
Leuchars' radar coverage of the western parts of the procedure at 2200ft is not bad, but it doesn't see much at 1000ft below and to the west of the procedure, where quite a lot of Perth traffic could be.
But I suspect the real issue with the radar coverage is not how much Leuchars can see, but the fact that it's provided from Leuchars and not Dundee. Once an inbound is transferred to Dundee the radar service ceases, and if the inbound is then doing the full procedure from the DND, any traffic info they might have been given by Leuchars immediately before handover will be old hat by the time they're flying the base turn close to Perth.
But looking at the incidents to Flybe Dash 8s this summer, I suspect they might have been driven by - as others have suggested here - crew inexperience with dealing with a non-radar visual circuit with lots of light aircraft. On one occasion the Dash reported turning base, having been advised he was No.3 to 2 light aircraft, and filed an MOR after Tower told him to extend to allow the light aircraft in.
If Dundee has a future as a commercial airport and future operations require radar, the best solution would be a joint deal with the MoD to position a radar serving both Leuchars and Dundee on the high ground behind Tayport/Newport. The Leuchars radar isn't being replaced under the NATS/Thales ATC contract for MoD airfields so there's scope for a joint purchase.
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Major regional airline Flybe, which is ending its services from Dundee, announced a “solid” third quarter’s performance in tough trading conditions.
The airline has axed its Dundee-Amsterdam service and is not renewing its franchise arrangement with Loganair for flights to London Stansted, although Loganair is bidding to take over that service on its own.
The airline has axed its Dundee-Amsterdam service and is not renewing its franchise arrangement with Loganair for flights to London Stansted, although Loganair is bidding to take over that service on its own.
Join Date: Feb 2017
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question
Hello , thank you for allowing me on your forum.
I'm a beginner pilot having logged only 4 hours so far on an ex RAF powered glider out of Oban Airfield.
That strip without Argyll councils weird action of painting put part of the runway is slightly longer than Vagar used to be.
Now Dundee I do not know too well.
but would it be pheasible for an Embraer 170 /190 to operate from there given Flybe's good relations there.
Would that not open Dundee up to the possibility of say for example LEAL or Palma.
Also perhaps Manchester .
Would there be demand?.
I'm new to the forum and please welcome any thoughts and advice.
I'm a beginner pilot having logged only 4 hours so far on an ex RAF powered glider out of Oban Airfield.
That strip without Argyll councils weird action of painting put part of the runway is slightly longer than Vagar used to be.
Now Dundee I do not know too well.
but would it be pheasible for an Embraer 170 /190 to operate from there given Flybe's good relations there.
Would that not open Dundee up to the possibility of say for example LEAL or Palma.
Also perhaps Manchester .
Would there be demand?.
I'm new to the forum and please welcome any thoughts and advice.
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fjenci
Flybe aren't 'bidding' to take over that service on their own!
The Flybe franchise expires on 31 August 2017 and on 01 September 2017 Loganair will be flying Dundee to Stansted themselves.
Flybe aren't 'bidding' to take over that service on their own!
The Flybe franchise expires on 31 August 2017 and on 01 September 2017 Loganair will be flying Dundee to Stansted themselves.
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Well if Flybe hadn't ditched the AMS service last year they'd certainly be doing it now - Leuchars SSR is offline for the next three months!
U0844/17 - LEUCHARS SSR U/S. 08 MAR 15:20 2017 UNTIL 05 JUN 23:59 2017. CREATED: 08 MAR 15:23 2017
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Dundee not more
The subsidy from Wee Jimmy Crankie runs oot very soon . Inglies ( idiota ) couldn't run an ice cream van. Feel sorry for the tower "jannies", they had a career path in mind. "Anthony" was a major "bell-end".
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"The subsidy from Wee Jimmy Crankie runs oot very soon . Inglies ( idiota ) couldn't run an ice cream van. Feel sorry for the tower "jannies", they had a career path in mind. "Anthony" was a major "bell-end"."
Trainspotting 3???
Trainspotting 3???
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Won't Leuchars be able to provide a service using their Primary Radar?
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With all the millions of pounds worth of subsidies that keep getting pumped into DND, why don't they have their own SSR or put one on top of the Sidlaws and share it with Perth?